DesirousOfChange

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Posts by DesirousOfChange

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  57

  Why would abandoning 1914 mean they are not chosen by God?

  by InterestedOne in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i've read here that if the wt admits 607 is wrong or if 1914 is wrong, the logical result is that god did not choose them as his org.

  can someone explain to me how that logically follows?.

  couldn't they just say, "we have received new light on that, have learned that we cannot give a specific date (like how they abandoned 1935), but look, we adhere to the bible more strictly than anyone else, we strive to 'keep the cong clean' more than any other group, etc., so therefore, we must be chosen by god as his only org.

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  DesirousOfChange

  TD WROTE: It's the product of two different JW beliefs. First, their belief that Christ invisibly returned in 1914 and second, their interpretation of Matthew 24:45-47. Jehovah's Witnesses believe this passage is more than just a parable; they believe it to be prophetic. In other words, they believe that Jesus foretold that Christians would be on their own during all the centuries prior to his return and that once Jesus did return, he would inspect all Christian groups and organizations and appoint the "Slave" who had been faithful over "All his belongngs." in fulfillment of the "Prophecy."

  This "inspection" and subsequent appointment as the "Faithful and wise servant" is their primary claim to spiritual authority. They believe that this occurred in 1919 and that they as an organization were the only ones found faithful.

  It would be hard to list exactly how many secondary JW interpretations start with these two premises, but there are a lot of them. Jehovah's Witnesses believe that they as an organization were actively involved with and in many cases actually the target of a number prophecies and prophetic parallels that were realized early during the 20th century.

  Without 1914, all of this would come crashing down. So doctrinally, it is very important.

  MARY WROTE: However, the party line cannot be challenged: without 1914, there's no appointment and thus they lose all of their control over millions of lives. And that is something they want to avoid at all costs.

  I think they could easily move the 1914 (based on 607) to 1934/1935 (based on 586/587). The toughest explanation would be the 70 years prophecy. But 1935 would fit JW history well as this could be 3 1/2 years following adopting the name, etc etc. and then turmoil in Europe leading up to WWII which was certainly more catastropic/prophetic than WWI. Although all that sets in place another date, and any date is surely a bad idea anymore. But if "this generation" can be explained away with "these [overlapping & endless] generation(s)", then anything is possible. You cannot fool all the people all of the time but you can fool 7.5 million every time there is "new light".
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  22

  JWs and Counseling/Psychologists/Therapists

  by Had To Go in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hello - i am hoping that some born-ins, still-ins, elders (ex), ms, etc.

  can help me with a question i have.

  what is the typical jw thought on seeking counseling via a licensed therapist or psychologist?

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  DesirousOfChange

  I know you have kids...how do you do it?

  Frankly, I think our kids did better being raised with some kind of religious/moral (JW) guidance than their peers or other family member's kids who lacked it. So far........ no abortions, illigitimate kids, arrests, DWIs, (serious) drugs, etc. But the fact that they were sintelligent and encouraged to think on their own has made them discerning young adults and kept them from being swept away totally by all the Koolaid propoganda. All at least completed some level of college/university, one on the way to being a doctor. But would they have any advantage had we been Catholics, Baptists, Atheists? I don't think so.
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  110

  A Concerned Elder Speaks

  by Franklin Massey in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a lot of talk has centered around information dispensed at the recent km schools.

  many brothers feel there is a "tightening up" taking place.

  i had a recent experience that you may find interesting.. after the meeting i was working with our cobe on some congregation tasks when out of nowhere he said, "have you looked up any extra information about higher education since the km school?

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  DesirousOfChange

  I saw it then, and I think it's probably worse now, that the WTS loses its best and brightest. Clamping down on eduction is a surefire way of being left with the lowest level of leadership in the congregations and at Bethel.

  Maybe they prefer to work with those who are unable to think for themselves????????
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  43

  Hypocrisy 101 - Watchtower has Payed for College/College Courses for Bethelites!

  by Crisis of Conscience in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  no you did not read the title wrong.

  i was out to eat this weekend with two bethelites.

  one gave a talk in my hall and i was invited out to dinner with them by another family in my hall.. as the conversation always turns to "spiritual" things, the subject of education was brought up.

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  DesirousOfChange

  I've had it under pretty reliable authority that JBS may not be the strongest believer in the WTS.

  It would be real interesting to know if that was true........he was chief PR guy when Russia was in the press years ago. I was always sure that he was the best qualified candidate and that it had nothing to do with nepotism.
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  74

  CO's putting the screws on elder bodies, and ministerial servants to auxilliary pioneer this April.

  by miseryloveselders in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i have such a love/hate, 50/50 relationship with this organization any more, but a letter was read to the elders and ministerial servants that has pushed me to the 30/70 range in favor of hate, if even momentarily.

  most of you if not all are aware of the auxilliary pioneering initiative for this upcoming april.

  it's no secret that i'm not real fond of pioneering as its unscriptural for one thing.

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  DesirousOfChange

  Wonder if this means that I'll actually SEE a Jehovah's Witness in this subdivision - haven't seen one here in around 4 years..

  No. They'll be driving around between return visits which are on opposite ends of the territory (and who were not at home at this time yesterday) and at McDonald's (or Starbucks in wealthier areas).
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  17

  Have you written a letter to the GB?

  by trevorbv in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  have you ever written a letter to the wtbts asking questions?

  who did you address the letter to?

  who reads them?

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  DesirousOfChange

  I wrote the Service Dept and did indeed get a reply regarding my question about the translation of a certain scripture as compared to all the other translations in my collection. As far as I know, the cong did not get a copy.
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  43

  Jehovah'$ Witne$$e$ say center would have big impact

  by betterdaze in

  1. social
  2. current

  jehovah's witnesses say center would have big impact.

  a planned 3,000-seat educational center will have a substantial economic impact on orangeburg county over the next five years, jehovah's witnesses officials say.. .

  the center could generate $264 million in revenues over a five-year period, with the added benefit of more than $18.4 million in new sales tax revenues for the local area, church spokesman bill sims said.. .

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  DesirousOfChange

  "They bring the Ten Commandments and a Ten dollar bill, and they don't break either"

  I was told that was stated by a newpaper writer in reference to the NYC convention in 1953 0r 1958.
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  74

  CO's putting the screws on elder bodies, and ministerial servants to auxilliary pioneer this April.

  by miseryloveselders in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i have such a love/hate, 50/50 relationship with this organization any more, but a letter was read to the elders and ministerial servants that has pushed me to the 30/70 range in favor of hate, if even momentarily.

  most of you if not all are aware of the auxilliary pioneering initiative for this upcoming april.

  it's no secret that i'm not real fond of pioneering as its unscriptural for one thing.

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  DesirousOfChange

  Turn in the app. Do what you'd normally do and report 29 hours. (missed it by THAT much)
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  43

  Jehovah'$ Witne$$e$ say center would have big impact

  by betterdaze in

  1. social
  2. current

  jehovah's witnesses say center would have big impact.

  a planned 3,000-seat educational center will have a substantial economic impact on orangeburg county over the next five years, jehovah's witnesses officials say.. .

  the center could generate $264 million in revenues over a five-year period, with the added benefit of more than $18.4 million in new sales tax revenues for the local area, church spokesman bill sims said.. .

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  DesirousOfChange

  The address already is called Assembly Hall Way (@ Gussy Drive), does that mean there is already a facility there and this is a plan to build a new one at the cost of $14 Million?? If that is the case, do they really need a new facility rather than making do until the system ends??
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  66

  Could Teaching Critical Thinking Abilities, End Cult Mind-Conrol Forever?

  by lifelong humanist in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  in my mind, every child that undergoes an education system, whether it be a within the family, a basic pre-school kindergarten type structure, within a monitored school curriculum environment itself, or, as part of a further education programme, the emphasis should be on teaching people how to think critically, and for the common good of all.. if this was indeed the case, probably very few would succumb to mind-control techniques later on in life.

  cults would struggle to dupe and recruit new members.

  the cult leaders themselves, would derive little benefit from their evil mind games.

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  DesirousOfChange

  In my mind, every child that undergoes an education system,.......the emphasis should be on teaching people how to think critically, and for the common good of all.

  The common good, yes, but it would not be good for those in power. Politicians do not want people to think.