Posts by larc

16

Reflection from the past...

by Scorpion in

jw
friends

"if you are a young person, you also need to face the fact that you will never grow old in this present system of things.

because all the evidence in fulfillment of bible prophecy indicates that this corrupt system is due to end in a few years.

of the generation that observed the beginning of the "last days" in 1914, jesus foretold: "this generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur."-matt.

The Great Pyramid - from God: "Its wonderful coorespondencies with the Bible LEAVE NO DOUBT the same divine inspirer of the prophets and apostles inspire this 'Witness' also." Studies in the Scriptures III, 1905 ed. p.17 (All Caps are mine)

The Great Pyramid - from Satan: Regarding it, they wrote, "Then Satan put this knowledge in dead stone, which may be called Satan's Bible, and not God's stone Witness." Watchtower, Nov. 15, 1928.

"Beth-Sarmin, built in 1930, is now held in trust for the occupancy of those princes on their return." New World p. 104

"Berth-Sarim was built for Brother Rutherford's use." 1975 Yearbook.

In 1941, during WWII, they wrote: "the near future will bring and is already hastening to bring ... Armageddon. the battle of the great day of God Almighty." Consolation p.11

In 1968 they wrote: "During World War I, God's people expected it to lead directly into Armageddon, but Jehovah prevented such a climax at that time. WE DIDN'T SUCCUMB TO SUCH A TEMPTATION DURING WORLD WAR II." (All caps mine)
Kingdom Ministry, Jan. 1968 p. 5.

"Would it be Scripturally proper for them to now marry and to begin to rear children? No, is the answer, which is supported by the Scriptures" Face the Facts, 1938, 46.

35

Watchtower History

by RR in

i once offered this to obed, and he did seem interested, however, because of my being a free thinker, it didn't go too well with the jw moderators on witnet.. i had propose a history forum, where the history of the watchtower society could be analyzed, their beliefs, and practices, how they evolved, why they believe as they did or do.

such a forum will enlighten many to the organization they either once called or currently call 'jehovah's visible organization.'.

"people in glass houses, shouldn't throw stones"

larc

RR,

Don't need to answer the last question, found evidence that Russell was hedging. (see the Main discussion posted early this morning)
Q: you stated in your history that Rutherford made 100 changes in the religion. I've collected quite a few, but not nearly 100. Is this list available?

16

Reflection from the past...

by Scorpion in

jw
friends

"if you are a young person, you also need to face the fact that you will never grow old in this present system of things.

because all the evidence in fulfillment of bible prophecy indicates that this corrupt system is due to end in a few years.

of the generation that observed the beginning of the "last days" in 1914, jesus foretold: "this generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur."-matt.

larc

Also, in the pre - 1914 edition of Studies in the Scriptures Vol II you quoted above, they wrote that 1914 "will be the furthest limit of the rule of imperfect men." In the 1916 edition, they changed it to the idea that 1914 "will see the disintegration of the rule of imperfect men." Thus, with an ecoonomy of word changes Russell was able to radically alter the meaning of the text. This ia a clever writing method, but not a very honest one.

I think the WTBTS needs to revise their definition of "the truth." "The truth is whatever we printed in the last 12 months."

35

Watchtower History

by RR in

i once offered this to obed, and he did seem interested, however, because of my being a free thinker, it didn't go too well with the jw moderators on witnet.. i had propose a history forum, where the history of the watchtower society could be analyzed, their beliefs, and practices, how they evolved, why they believe as they did or do.

such a forum will enlighten many to the organization they either once called or currently call 'jehovah's visible organization.'.

"people in glass houses, shouldn't throw stones"

larc

RR,

I went to the site you provided regarding the early history. It was interesting. I also went back and reread Penton's version. The two accounts correspond very closely. His description of the relationship beteewn Russell and his wife is more detailed and indicates that there was more conflict between the two than I would have gathered from your account.

Also, your quote from Russell in 1913 indicated that he thought that something big was going to happen in 1914, but not necessarily the end of the world. It is my understanding that Russell made strong statements about the end in 1914 earlier on, and he was hedging his bets in 1913. Is my understanding a correct one?

35

Watchtower History

by RR in

i once offered this to obed, and he did seem interested, however, because of my being a free thinker, it didn't go too well with the jw moderators on witnet.. i had propose a history forum, where the history of the watchtower society could be analyzed, their beliefs, and practices, how they evolved, why they believe as they did or do.

such a forum will enlighten many to the organization they either once called or currently call 'jehovah's visible organization.'.

"people in glass houses, shouldn't throw stones"

larc

The best written work is by Jim Penton. He has a PhD in history, and was a very prominent Witness in Canada before he left. Like all of the x's I have met, he is a very fine person. He told me that it took four years after leaving before he could begin his book because of the emotion involved.

RR a summary of your collection of materials regarding Russell could be a valuable addition to the printed record.

18

Judicial Defense ?

by thinker in

jw
friends

it occurs to me that this forum has a vast resource of knowledge and experience.

i'd like to suggest we put our heads together and find possible defenses for active witnesses facing a judicial committee.

with frenchy's intimate knowledge of committee rules and rr's huge library, along with everyone's individual experience; we we should be able to build a logical defense (assuming logic is a useful tool to jw's).. from my own research, i have put together a logical defense for an active jw who wishes to associate with a da'd friend.

larc

Thinker,

I have really enjoyed your imput and the thoughfulness of your posts. However, on this issue, please take into account the real experiences from real people. As Emerson said, "What you do speaks so loudly, that I can not hear what you say" This applies to how actual people are treated by actual elders.

For many of us, the leaving is as difficult as it would be for an Indian to leave the reservation. You might read books about what that it is like, but the person who left can tell you what it is really like. However, one testimonial does not mean much, but you have read many stories here, and all of us could recount many more, as is attested to by Zazu.

We are not trying to be discouraging, rather we are trying to be realisticaly optimistic regarding what will most likely work.

21

Re: May Jesus forgive me..

by Frenchy in

jw
friends

roy, .

your absolution if you have any coming will be from god and not from humans.

your confession needs to be directed toward him and not us.. -seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-

larc

Roy,

You thought we treated you badly. I, on the other hand, thought we bent over backwards to be helpful. I went back and reread all the posts, and until TR blew up, there were 9 suppportive postings and only two negative ones. When people offered help, you played a game called "why don't you...yes but." The first suggestion was help from God, but you said that wouldn't work. Several people suggested professional help, but you said that wouldn't work either.
I'm going to make some suggestions, and you'll probably tell me why none of them will work.
1. Go to a Clinical Psychologist; they don't give drugs that might mask the problem. That would handle one of your concerns.
2. Since you were raised a Catholic, go see a priest. That would handle both the money and drug complaint that you made.
3. Find a support group.
4. Since you are not now acting out on your thoughts, learn to live with them and change the subject in your mind when it comes up. If you can't do this on your own, go see a Psychologist who is trained as a cognitive behaviorist, using the concepts of people like Albert Ellis and Aaron Beck. They can teach you how to unlearn what is now habitual.
5. Quit beating yourself over what you've done in the past and get on with the business of changing yourself.
BTW, I get thoughts that I wouldn't share with anybody, but they don't affect my life. They have to do with who I'd like to be in bed with and who I'd like to push off a cliff.

BTW, if you don't want to do any of the above, you only have one other chioce...be miserable.

21

Re: May Jesus forgive me..

by Frenchy in

jw
friends

roy, .

your absolution if you have any coming will be from god and not from humans.

your confession needs to be directed toward him and not us.. -seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-

larc

TR,

I agree and I'm not offended by your langauge. They're jerking our chain, and we've been very patient with them. On another thread, the women were discussing a very serious problem. What AntiChrist posted there was especially loathsome.

28

The New World

by larc in

jw
friends

earlier, i had asked about changes under the thread, "new truth".

your replies were interesting and informative, or should i say it was meat in due season and i found it upbuilding.

i have another question: is the new world view still the same.

larc

Brothers and sisters, or as they say in southern Ohio, brothern and cistern,

Are you familiar with the old western song that goes like this:

Oh, give me a home
where the buffalo roam
and the deer and the antelope play
where seldom is heard
a discouraging word
and skys are not cloudy all day

Sounds like the new world doesn't it?
Well, I'll tell you what. You show me a home where the buffalo roam and I'll show you a messy house.

I must be off.

66

Serious Question

by Prisca in

as we all know the society has very strict guidelines regarding conduct between the sexes.

in the cong i grew up in, it was so small-minded that if you were single, and seen talking to a member of the opposite sex, you were presumed to be in some sort of relationship with him/her.. sex before marriage is out of the question, with heavy petting also looked down upon.

dating is a serious affair, with all onlookers expecting engagement/marriage to be the outcome.

larc

Simon,

I agree, and the way you describe it is the way it once was. Too bad that the uninspired Governing Body brought so much ruination to young people's lives.