Posts by DarioKehl

61

Hello Everyone...Just Joined Today

by DarioKehl in

i've been reading this thread for some time and finally had the opportunity to create an account.

i am anxious to meet you all and have a support group/active audience over the next crucial months and years following.

background: long-time doubter, giving way to frustration and skepticism beginning about 10 years ago and finally to total admission that this is a cult and that atheism is the way to go.

DarioKehl

no WAY! I don't know the individual, but that is interesting

61

Hello Everyone...Just Joined Today

by DarioKehl in

i've been reading this thread for some time and finally had the opportunity to create an account.

i am anxious to meet you all and have a support group/active audience over the next crucial months and years following.

background: long-time doubter, giving way to frustration and skepticism beginning about 10 years ago and finally to total admission that this is a cult and that atheism is the way to go.

Growing up a gay Jehovah's Witness (My Life Story)

by m0nk3y in

i feel the need to express how i feel and felt about my life as a gay man.

i was brought up from birth as a jehovahs witness.

this has played a major part in my life and it has been a real struggle to get past.

I find the solution in the Young People Ask book repugnant. I've struggled with this since 7th grade (I'm an "80/20 bisexual" in favor of other guys and have only come out to a select few ExJWs). This problem is HUGE within the JW community and it continues to be ignored. The advice in the publications might as well be summed up like this:

"Welp! Ok! We showed you the scriptures, soooooo... you know how God feels about the issue! Our job here is done. You just pray or read WT publications anytime those filthy thoughts enter your mind. And remember...it's probably just a phase you'll grow out of (talk about a FALSE HOPE!). You just try to live the rest of your life never knowing what it's like sharing that special bond with someone that the rest of us get to enjoy. And remember to ALWAYS have faith that JeeeHOOOOOvah will heal all sinful imperfections in the New System. "Probably you" can be like one-of-us, one-of-us, one-of-us... Ok, on to the next chapter, 'What Hobbies Should I Choose?'"

How different it would be if the roles were reversed! What if, one day, the old flabby elder woke up and was told that from this day forth, engaging in long term sexual relationships or marriage with the opposite sex was strictly forbidden, grounds for disfellowshipping and losing God's favor? How long could they stand to deny their natural impulses? I'd put my life savings up that 90% would fail--and by fail, i mean "fail" by CHOICE. Making a choice for happiness.

It's sooo sad seeing young ones in the Khall who obviously struggle. There is no approachable, active support group from within...even if they buy the whole WT Bill of Goods, they have to seek true help from "worldy" sources only--that's all that's availableto them! The only thing they can count on is becoming car group gossip fodder. My heart aches for them... I went through it too.

61

Hello Everyone...Just Joined Today

by DarioKehl in

i've been reading this thread for some time and finally had the opportunity to create an account.

i am anxious to meet you all and have a support group/active audience over the next crucial months and years following.

background: long-time doubter, giving way to frustration and skepticism beginning about 10 years ago and finally to total admission that this is a cult and that atheism is the way to go.

DarioKehl

@ wannabefree: yeah, i hear you. And believe me, there are times when I miss that quick comfort fix I used to get when I'd "Say a quick prayer to Jehovah." As a biologist, I have to admit, I look at life from an engineering perspective. As it stands now, genetics cannot explain behavior. Currently, genetic causes are only alluded to (especially in twin studies), but I very deeply believe that there's a "faith" gene and, judging from my mother's side of the family, I definitely did not inherit it lol (they're all worldy evolutionists). I used to pray but always felt silly, much like a kid leaving a tooth under their pillow when they were old enough to realize that a tooth fairy is nonsense (or so I think... JW kids never played "tooth fairy" haha).

As I stated, I will never belittle people for their beliefs or try to convert. Some exJWs jump right in to other Christian faiths and if that makes them feel better, that's a story with a happy ending. I'll never understand it tho. And perhaps you may never understand a person like me who just can't experience having faith. I dunno... the very word bothers me sometimes. It's foreign and icky. As an independent thinker, you and I have many resources at our disposal to validate our claims but the bottom line is, if a belief in "God" gets you through daily life and offers a hope for your future, then I'm very happy for you. Sometimes even envious. Lt. Commander Data always wanted to explore human emotion, but without the chip, it was a total mystery for him...I'm the same way with belief in a god.

HOWEVER... one of my favorite interests is cutting edge physics. And I don't want to come off as one of those annoying laymen who try to blend physics with philosophy, but it's so exciting to see Science actually require faith from people for possibly the first time ever! I just finished one of the best books ever written IMHO: "The Black Hole War" by Leonard Susskind. He goes toe-to-toe with Stephen Hawking and wrote the entire novel because he proved one of Hawking's theories wrong. To a general audience, most of us would say, "Who cares? All these guys do is crunch numbers and create formulas only a few other people on earth are smart enough to comprehend!" But they WORK. The numbers WORK. And the theories they validate have meaning. Perhaps the most intriguing one for me is the hologram universe theory. Sounds hokie, I know. It immediately conjures up a scenario like "The Matrix." But, there's a possibility that this universe we percieve is just that--an illusion. All matter is made of energy, and energy in its smallest unit (at the Planck scale) is described as information...or code. I think there's a reason why physics breaks down when you zoom in to the super tiny scale. Perhaps it's part of the game... a design flaw we were never meant to notice. But we DID. I guess a small part of me desires to know more. If this is a giant holodeck, then who designed the program? What's the purpose, if any? That's what keeps me hanging on. I don't want to believe we are simply over at death. A very small part of me really, really wants there to be something more! But what I cannot do is make an allegiance with organized religion. It gives the easiest answer. "God" is the default explanation for every mystery. It just seems like a cop out, you know? Throughout history, theists seem to love the unknown and exploit it as proof of their diety. Scientists love the unknown for a different reason: It puts people to work! They want to solve the mystery. It's an easy trend to follow through human history. In ancient Greek times, "gods" were very human. They fought, they killed each other, they had sex with each other, they lived on mountaintops that were visible to humans... but once science started explaining things like thunder, lightning, droughts, etc., "god" became more and more mysterious and unintelligible. In modern times, science has provided many, many answers and, in a sense, has shoved "god" further and further into a mysterious corner. Eventually, the gaps will close. However, if...if there's a Grand Creator behind everything, I certainly cannot give credence to a 19th century American printing corporation's claim as being His representative. If there was an all-powerful being, I find it absurd to think that He would manifest himself through the WBTS.

@Billy... you look like a rascal, buddy! I look forward to getting to know you! Are you really an ex-bethelite??? How long ago were you there? I'd love to pick your brain for juicy details that go on "behind the scenes." I'm new here, so if you've posted fantastic stories before, I'll have to search for them. But when you get a chance, I'd love to hear whatcha got!

@lifelong humanist: amen! and duly noted. "swift" is easier said than done at the moment. I love my family deeply (have an adorable 3-yr old nephew) and have many, many close friends (some are of the same mindset but would never leave...but I'm working on 'em. Maybe a mass exodus at once???) There is so much to lose. But I intend to document this transition as it happens, in real time. Hopefully it will serve as an aid to others when they reach the same crossroad. This is so tough...

61

Hello Everyone...Just Joined Today

by DarioKehl in

i've been reading this thread for some time and finally had the opportunity to create an account.

i am anxious to meet you all and have a support group/active audience over the next crucial months and years following.

background: long-time doubter, giving way to frustration and skepticism beginning about 10 years ago and finally to total admission that this is a cult and that atheism is the way to go.

DarioKehl

Common apologetic argument, Cold Steel...

But this is the typical "God of the Gaps" routine and believe me, we evil atheists hear it alllll the tiiiiiime.

Everything denotes there is a God. ...incredible order and symmetry that exists in the cosmos.

Ok, explain how that denotes a "god." Just because things are orderly and symmetrical does not offer proof of your claim that an all-powerful "god" exists. By your logic, you have backed yourself into a corner. For if your "god" exists, who made Him? And don't default to the usual apologetic answer that "He has no beginning." Infinite regression is an invalid form of argument. I want you to PROVE to me... How do you know God exists? And for something to exist, by your very logic, it must have had a beginning. So where did God come from?

I can easily give you a scientific reason for "order" in the universe. It's called entropy. If you take liquid butane and put it inside a tank of water in a zero-gravity environment, guess what--the butane forms a PERFECT sphere. But how??? Doesn't that violate the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics???? Actually, no, not at all. Different substances have different factors for entropy (or, the tendency to be in a state of disorder) and it just so happens that the chemical properties of water cause it to "want" to be in a disordered state more than butane does. So what you see as an end product is water shoving something else into an apparently orderly fashion because water has a higher tendency to rest in a disordered state.

Evolution is the same way. You point to a creature so perfectly fit for its surroundings and credit an intelligent designer. But, you must not fail to ignore that 4 billion years of trial and error fine-tuned that organism such that it appears to be a miraculous design of purpose. I hate to pee on your pop tart, Cold Steel, but think of the advantages you have now WITHOUT a "jealous and angry God" above you!

381

Were you or someone you know sexually molested by a Jehovah's Witness ?

by flipper in

due to the fact there are about 27,000 members of this religion that are known pedophiles, and the information about it is kept in a secret database file, i wonder how many lurking jw's as well as others are aware of the severity of this problem?

remember, it's 27,000 pedophiles that they know about.

what about the thousands that don't get caught?

DarioKehl

I know of several people who this happened to. Although I refrain from blaming the local elders directly in the cases i'm familiar with, I do feel that the protocol they are forced to follow by the GB/WTBS is dispicable. Also, and I'll get this out of the way very early in the game (I'm new here as of yesterday), I can speak from experience that being a single male in his 30's in this organization isn't easy either. I routinely dealt with slander coming back to me... questioning my character. Because I wasn't married to a pio wife with 2.5 kids, an SUV, a carpet cleaning job and $50K in debt like some of them were, I was constantly bashed and my morality was questioned or often the subject of hurtful jokes (usually by ones who were in that married situation and miserably jealous). Bottom line is, people in the JW Org, even the busy-body gossip mill, know that this molestation thing is an issue. And if you're unfortunate enough to not fit their expectation of what your demographic should be, you could easily find yourself the subject of very hateful and hurtful gossip.

But it's all gooood... I know the truth. I like who I am. I'd never victimize a child. I just happen to be a bisexual who was never able to get closure from within this organization. So sure! You BET I never got married. But that doesn't make a guy a pedo!!! Sad thing is, we had a guy attending our hall who was on the sex offender web site and, after some sisters at the hall were reportedly being abusive to him, there was a local needs part about "treating everyone with kindness." Hahaha... that's rich, isn't it? A real offender gets defended from the platform and I get gossiped about on a regular basis by FRIENDS.

BTW: That's not the reason I decided to get out. I'm not that petty. These people are too close-minded for me to ever expect them to address an issue like GBLT sexuality. Whatever...

21

more Jan 15 Study WT: I caught you looking at porn! You better tell the elders!

by baltar447 in

jw
friends

so we've seen flipper's thread discussing the jan 15th wt.

well in the article following the one discussed in that thread, you have discussion about turning in your friends.

apparently now they aren't content to turn in for "gross sin".

DarioKehl

Unbelievable! ugh...

I remember being "in" and paragraphs like that taking control of my behavior. I was such a snitch in those days. So superfluous now...the excuse..."Indeed, it could lead to Steve's losing his relationship with Jehovah." LOL!!! Once you come to realize that GOD DOES NOT EXIST and that we are all electrically charged meat, walking bags of phospholipid bilayers, thermodynamic disasters none of this MATTERS. It's mind control! And it totally screws up a boy's mental, sexual and emotional development. TRUST me... it DOES.

I will have children some day and they will whack it freely, without any fear or guilt and it won't be one of those "what-if" taboo subjects in the house...no, no...they will KNOW it's 100% AOK and that mom and dad are totally on board. Ridiculous.

34

Watchtower claims Armageddon will come when US is no longer a World Power

by Alfred in

just when i thought the wash towel was done trying to interpret the book of revelations, i came across this from paragraph 16 on the last page of the march 15, 2011 watchtower.... .

the urgency of the times we live in is underscored when we consider the inspired prophecy at revelation 17:10. the seventh king, the anglo-american world power, has come into existence.

concerning it we read: when he [the seventh world power] does arrive he must remain a short while.

DarioKehl

Perhaps they're finally acknowledging that globalism is likely going to be attempted before "The End" arrives. I'm not one to buy into conspiracy theories, but there has been a noticeable "tip toe to totalitarianism" for several decades and it would easily fit their doctrine concerning the "appointed times of the nations." JWs reason that God allowed the human race to try every conceivable form of government (federalism, communism, socialism, nationalism, fascism, blah-blah-blah) but one form that has yet to be tested is the "One-World Government" so many end of days people believe is surely coming.

I see things transitioning to a Global Government, and sadly, this will likely add to their rhetoric in the coming decades they just earned with the new "overlap" clause. I won't be surprised at all if the WT and Awake! start admitting that some of the conspiracy theories are right, but they'll do so very carefully so as not to appear as nutty as David Icke or Alex Jones (ex: they'll mainly focus on UN, etc but avoid such controversial topics like vaccines and fluoridated water being part of a global eugenics agenda and... they'll stay away from the whole alien reptile thing lol).

*BTW, if anyone has the KM insert from 2005/2006 (?) containing all the "adjustments" to the 1988 Revelation Grand Climax book available as PDF, let me know! as part of my project, I plan to focus only on modern-day changes. everyone already knows about the reversals from 1860s-1995. Although relevant, those changes have been talked about and talked about and the WBTS has given the sheeple plenty of rehearsed responses to counter individuals who bring those failed prophecies up. I think the younger folks could really benefit from seeing all the recent ones presented in a concentrated format. That's what nailed the coffin shut for me!

61

Hello Everyone...Just Joined Today

by DarioKehl in

i've been reading this thread for some time and finally had the opportunity to create an account.

i am anxious to meet you all and have a support group/active audience over the next crucial months and years following.

background: long-time doubter, giving way to frustration and skepticism beginning about 10 years ago and finally to total admission that this is a cult and that atheism is the way to go.

DarioKehl

@loz

Yeah, i know, i know. I'm used to writing a lot of academic papers too and the tone of those is always a little hoity-toity. I'm sure I'll loosed up and get comfortable over time. I just wish for topics i start on here are easy reading for people we need to rescue. The amount of guilt and fear we deal with is tremendous and some just don't want to face it.

I'm in to torture apparently because this migration out of the bOrg is like slowly tearing a bandaid from an excessively hairy leg wound. Many people say, "Just rip it off!" But for me, I stand to lose a lot of close friends. In my area, my last name is synonymous with "good JWs" because my parents are spiritual pillars within the JW community. This sucks. This battle ahead is terrifying. I'm going to be labeled and known as the one who initiated the collapse of our family. But I can no longer tolerate living for everyone else. I can no longer tolerate belonging to another organization whose policies have killed 2 close friends of mine (blood doctrine). It's time to call them out. When I decide to leave, I want it to be on my own accord and I hope to refer the brothers to my project. Who knows, maybe it will enlighten them someday (I borrowed that phrase from my pioneer days after leaving a mag in the door at a not-at-home lol).

"tech-savy" well...ok, I'm kind of lazy and am looking for quick answers on how to start a podcast on iTunes. I've read up some, but I just purchased a brand-spanking new iMac and I grew up on Windows. Yeah, it's kinda like my transition from JW to atheism...lotsa de-programming involved and new applications to learn. I guess my biggest question is, are podcast servers terribly expensive? I've got my first few episodes ready to go! I know I'll make no $$$ on this, but I'm afraid to commit to something unless I know how much expense is involved (more learned behavior...fear of commitment lol).

12

Family Worship Evening, The Mormons Had It First

by Franklin Massey in

jw
friends

this has been commented about on here before but since this weeks service meeting has a continuation of the article "help for families" i thought it would be appropriate to mention that the jw family worship evening, appears to be direct copy of the mormons family home evening.

if you have the january 2011 km, compare the insert to the resources found at the official latter day saints website on how to conduct the family evening.. http://lds.org/hf/fhe/welcome/0,16785,4210-1,00.html.

DarioKehl

I sometimes wonder if the Watchtower looks with envy at the Mormons.

sir82, You better believe the WBTS have envy! "Why didn't WE think of tithing???" The Mormon church is fabulously wealthy. But, they are possibly making their tax-exempt status vulnerable due to their recent strong arm tactics in California with Prop. 8. You can't be tax-exempt and financially back political candidates.