Posts by Mat

7

My bet on how WTS will extend next Armageddon date

by RADHESYAM in

so they have been pushing armageddon off since they began.. we all know the previous dates but right now they are pushing this "overlapping" generation b/s.. .

my bet for the next "new light":.

'matthew 24:14 says that 'this good news will be preached in all the inhabited earth as a witness to all nations and then the end will come' thus wecan conclude that as there are still villages such as those in the peru which have never met white men or outsiders, until those villagers receive the truth, amrmageddon cannot come!

Mat

Well, they do argue that anyway, but I don't think it is strong enough to replace the "generation" teaching. The Overlap is just sily. If they plug that I think it will just be counterproductive.

Someone mentioned the 120 years God set in Noah's day (Gen6:3). So far they have missed that trick. They might use it when it gets to 2025, just like they started saying 1975 in 1966 (I think), however, by that time they might be better dropping the 1914 date. Far too stale by then.

They will just have to use the general argument that there are wars and disasters etc. Nice and general.

10

Did anyone sneak out their Gilead school binders instead of shredding them?

by average joe in

i am looking for gileade notes and information from and about gilead school and for pdfs of these two books unbroken will - leopold engleitner pdf and max liebster crucible of terror..

Mat

Interesting personal experience about a Gilead member:

http://www.jwfiles.com/wt_videos/do_jws_really_follow_the_bible/index.htm

67

I feel so alone here...

by Pams girl in

jw
friends

thanks to all who helped me escape my imminemt baptism after 6 years of study.

it was a close call.. ive clearly been labelled spirituallly weak, as nobody has called here to say hi or anything and its been 2 monthes now....their divine justice for me i guess.

i did see my study teacher a while back when she dropped off my memorial invite, and that was after a chat, nothing to do with the wbts...seemed like it was an afterthought on her part.. they all know about my problems with agoraphobia and panic.

Mat

Glad we helped. I'm in UK too. Can't seem to say so on mu profile

41

2 Thessalonians issue

by Mat in

reading a great book, jeus interupted, that i reccomend, but i came accross an interesting issue about second thessalonians.

ehrman argues that he does not think 2 thessalonians was written by the same person who wrote 1 thessalonians, and gives his reasons:.

if paul meant what he said in 1 thessalonians, that jesus return would be sudden and unexpected, it is hard to believe that he could have written what is said in 2 thessaloniansthat the end is not coming right away and that there will be clear-cut signs to indicate that the end is near, signs that had not yet appeared.

Mat

When I started this thread I didn't expect it to turn in to a Paul supporters verses Paul dislikers. To me the comparison is obvious, but I do understand why and how a Christian would take issue with it.

The bit where Paul blames them is 2 Thess 2: 5 where he says "Don't you remember me telling you these things?"

Iv'e known compulsive liars actually use simlar expressions, trying to make out they said stuff before that they never did. I guess the problem is we do not have an account from the Thessalonians themselfs telling us how they responded to the first letter, or what the second letter was refering to. We can only conjecture from what is written and survived to us. I visualise a simlar situation as happened in 1975, and may yet happen in 2014.

For the record, the Watchtower never actually said it would happen in 1975- they just strongly implied it. Apples and melons eh?

48

Ok I left the WBTS..... now what?? kingdom hall withdrawal

by sister x in

jw
friends

so my last meeting was in december 2010. i was attending the english and spanish halls for a year and just english for 6 yrs..... lots of meetings.

i had only two friends at the hall and no boyfriend/husband.

i live in a town where i know no one, no family and when i became a witness i left the one job (air force) where i had people who cared about me..... now im alllllll alone!

Mat

Hi, it's good you are breaking their mind control and seeing for your self what other churches say and offer. I too tried other churches after I left them. I eventually decided I didn't want a replacement religion, but I understand why other people would feel differently.

It does get easier. Leaving a religion is very like when someone dies. It's a total change of circumstances. You will go through a grieving process.

67

I feel so alone here...

by Pams girl in

jw
friends

thanks to all who helped me escape my imminemt baptism after 6 years of study.

it was a close call.. ive clearly been labelled spirituallly weak, as nobody has called here to say hi or anything and its been 2 monthes now....their divine justice for me i guess.

i did see my study teacher a while back when she dropped off my memorial invite, and that was after a chat, nothing to do with the wbts...seemed like it was an afterthought on her part.. they all know about my problems with agoraphobia and panic.

Mat

Hi PG, sorry to hear you lost so much when you left them. It would have been a lot harder if you'd actually joined. That's some consolation. It's true they chew you up then spit you out. Such is the nature of a cult.

Don't be sorry about having a moan. I'm sure we all understand.

44

WHO WROTE THE BIBLE by Washington Gladden, PT 1

by Quentin in

am currently reading this book.

would like to share some excerpts from same.take note mr. gladden is objective in his wrting.see wikipedia for gladden bio.

excerpts, printed by waking lion press.

Mat

That is true, but the Dead Sea scolls and the Nag Hammadi discoveries have changed a lot of ideas about early Christianity. They were all dicovered only in the 1940's and 1950's. I would prefer to read a book that takes them into account.

And the Ugaritic texts!

41

2 Thessalonians issue

by Mat in

reading a great book, jeus interupted, that i reccomend, but i came accross an interesting issue about second thessalonians.

ehrman argues that he does not think 2 thessalonians was written by the same person who wrote 1 thessalonians, and gives his reasons:.

if paul meant what he said in 1 thessalonians, that jesus return would be sudden and unexpected, it is hard to believe that he could have written what is said in 2 thessaloniansthat the end is not coming right away and that there will be clear-cut signs to indicate that the end is near, signs that had not yet appeared.

Mat

Hi DD. Ok, if you say so. This was not meant to be a challenge to people's faith. I guess I got it wrong. People just mis-read what Paul meant in 1 Thess, and 2 Thess just clarifies the misunderstanding. I don't really belieave that, but I'll go along with it for the sake of peace.

48

Ok I left the WBTS..... now what?? kingdom hall withdrawal

by sister x in

jw
friends

so my last meeting was in december 2010. i was attending the english and spanish halls for a year and just english for 6 yrs..... lots of meetings.

i had only two friends at the hall and no boyfriend/husband.

i live in a town where i know no one, no family and when i became a witness i left the one job (air force) where i had people who cared about me..... now im alllllll alone!

Mat

Hi Sister X- I suggest you read books on the bible and philosophy and science. That should help with the God shaped hole (as I call it) when you leave. Have you read The God Delusion? The only trouble with another religion is you might just end up in the same situation again.

The lonelyness is another matter. Of course you need to make more new friends. I wish I could advise on that, but I have to admit (at the risk of sounding sad) I haven't found it that easy. A new job might do it, find a club or interest/hobby group in something you like (such as art, tennis, swimming, yoga, gardening, etc) Perhaps take up a course in something at a local college or university. There is internet dating, but I think most the people on that are fake (at least among the women, but presumably the same with men). Then there is just going to a night club and picking people up, but that isn't something I've found very good. You might think that crass- but regardless it is an option.

Hope that is some help. I'm sure we all here empathise with you, maybe meet up with some here if they are local.

44

WHO WROTE THE BIBLE by Washington Gladden, PT 1

by Quentin in

am currently reading this book.

would like to share some excerpts from same.take note mr. gladden is objective in his wrting.see wikipedia for gladden bio.

excerpts, printed by waking lion press.

Mat

Ok, question for all Bible Scholar types- What is the latest book on this information? What book is most up to date? Thanks.