LittleToe

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Posts by LittleToe

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  21

  Don't Walk..Don't Talk..

  by Englishman in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  im just throwing this one into the ring to see what you think.

  i know the wtbts are always beating the drum about not forsaking the gathering of ourselves together as some have the custom, but do they really want jws actually talking with one another when they arent around to monitor the conversation?.

  if you think about it, jws would appear to have had their opportunities for social intercourse severely curtailed.

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  LittleToe

  MeatPie:
  Can you email me?
  I wouldn't ask without good cause.
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  169

  X-JWs Who are now bible Christians

  by clash_city_rockers in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi folks,.

  i'm just sort of taking role call to all those x-dubs who are now brothers and sisters in christ.

  i think it is wise for us to rise up and be counted so that we know who each other are.

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  LittleToe

  Clash:
  I appreciate your zeal, and I sense that you, too, are a brother in Christ. You are keen to evangelise, but do so in a manner that befits a different audience.
  Please don't take this the wrong way, but I think that Plm may have hit the nail on the head when she called you on your reliance on men.

  Churches can be a stepping stone to finding Christ, but upon being called the Christian may easily succumb to the advances of men, tradition, theology, etc.
  It is a very slippery stone indeed, when one starts to put these ahead of our Saviour. In many respects you would be safer getting out, rather than falling upon the treadmill of pleasing men.

  Is it acceptable to be men pleasers, just because those men are within the congregation? Else, would it be wrong only when they exist outside of our tradition? How do you feel about Arminianists, can you view them as brothers in Christ?

  My salvation didn't depend on any doctrine other than accepting Christ.
  I don't think your example of having a good or bad relationship with God holds true. I think you'll find that the confession highlights that man is alienated from God (since the fall) and comes into a relationship (communion) with Him. Whether that is rich or poor will likely be a result of drawing close to Him, or otherwise.

  Whilst I appreciate the Westminster Confession of Faith (also the Institutes, and Berkhoff's Systematic Theology) I hold it as a subordinate standard to the inspired word, as I imagine you do yourself.
  You will not bludgeon me with the Confession, nor any word of man.
  I'll happily consider your other points in another thread, if you wish.
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  169

  X-JWs Who are now bible Christians

  by clash_city_rockers in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi folks,.

  i'm just sort of taking role call to all those x-dubs who are now brothers and sisters in christ.

  i think it is wise for us to rise up and be counted so that we know who each other are.

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  LittleToe

  Clash:
  I'm at work and I haven't got time to read your incredibly long post, right now, but I shall. I shall also offer you a proper reply afterwards.
• 
  169

  X-JWs Who are now bible Christians

  by clash_city_rockers in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi folks,.

  i'm just sort of taking role call to all those x-dubs who are now brothers and sisters in christ.

  i think it is wise for us to rise up and be counted so that we know who each other are.

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  LittleToe

  Gumby:
  I'll take a stab at your questions, if you like. I don't promise to be right or coherent, but...

  1. The way the God of the bible works...Killing millions in the old testament...turning the other cheek and loving your enemy in the NT?
  A pretty tough one, this.
  Viewed from 21st century eyes, with modern day sensibilities, most of history seems barbaric.
  The Old Testament needs to be interpreted by looking at the New Testament (new light? ~ducks and runs~).
  I imagine that the Calvinist viewpoint would be that God foreknew that they would not accept Him, so had them destroyed prematurely.
  I have to humbly confess that this is one that I am continuing to study. Maybe someone else can help with this one...

  2. Why is their less than a handfull of historians/writers...other than Jesus believing Jews... who wrote about Jesus, who overturned the Roman world?
  Have you a list of historical works during the period of the first century?
  I am lead to believe (but couldn't confirm the veracity of this) that there are more writings about Jesus than Julius Caesar.
  At the end of the day, the religious systems that sprung up to promulgate belief in Jesus far outlasted Emperor worship.

  3. What about the fact about the Catholic church being the librarians of which HOLY BOOKS would make up the bible as we know it.....I thought God would decide that ...if a book is what he wanted.
  I suspect that the are many more ispired writing than just the canon of 66 books that we call the Holy Bible. I've personally been drawn to various books of the apocrypha (Ecclesiasticus, Esdras, etc.).
  The Catholic church may have chained up certain volumes, but the Holy Spirit can teach all things that are beneficial for us.
  It's pretty hard to get too far beyond the two laws, and they have been preserved (and laid up on most peoples hearts, regardless of religious persuasion).

  4. It has been said, many bible stories are identical to pagan myths....Is it possible the Jews were influenced by much of this and if this were true...would make the bible an absurd story book of a fanatical group called JEWS?
  If you were to receive a vision of things far more advanced than you could truly comprehend, how would you describe it? Surely it would be in term that you understood or could describe, and that could be received by your contemporaries.
  For example: Try describing a helicopter in terms understandable to someone from the 1st or 10th centuries AD.

  I don't feel THREATENED to inquire here
  ....do you?
  Nope. And at the end of the day people will believe what they want to believe. That's freewill in action.

  Sorry about the unusually long post, guys.
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  169

  X-JWs Who are now bible Christians

  by clash_city_rockers in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi folks,.

  i'm just sort of taking role call to all those x-dubs who are now brothers and sisters in christ.

  i think it is wise for us to rise up and be counted so that we know who each other are.

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  LittleToe

  PointBlank:
  It was your testimony that I was following. It sounds fairly similar to my own. I perhaps didn't format my reply appropriately.
  As for doctrinal issues, I couldn't give a monkey's!
  As a Spirit filled Christian, I'm pleased to call you brother. Period!

  BillyGoat:
  "I am a work in progress"
  Aren't we all .
  Amen to that.
  And you are correct - the whole obligation of man hangs on the two laws steeped in love.

  Just to reiterate and expand on something that I wrote earlier:
  The letter to the Hebrews (chapter 6) was written to Christians who were being encouraged to mature and move on from the elementary doctrines.
  The bottom line is that you can still be a Christian with merely the milk of the word.
  We are all at various stages, and may press on or suffer atrophy, but nonetheless it is not for any to declare that we are or are not Christians. That is a call that has been made to us personally.

  Granted we will likely start producing the fruits and works that are nourished by the Spirit, but that measure is not one to be judged by others.

  I sincerely believe, by virtue of my own experience, that if we have difficulty understanding or accepting something that is not a salvation issue, the Holy Spirit will let it pass (maybe just for the moment, maybe for our lifetime - who knows?).
  To the extent that you seek out understanding, approaching it with a fresh slate and in obedience, the greater your comprehension may be.

  When I first began to be taught in this manner 1 Kings 3:9 was brought to my attention.
  Sure I wanted knowledge and understanding, like Solomon, but I saw in that verse that something more was needed. I needed a heart that would be obedient to the thing heard, if I was to climb above what I had been indoctrinated with.

  For those that neither believe in the supernatural, nor that the Holy Spirit can "teach all things", please don't bother to flame me on this point. It's a matter of personal belief and you will have difficulty disproving it, just as I would likely have difficulty proving it to your satisfaction.

  All of the above comes with the disclaimer that I may be completely mad and not have the foggiest idea what I'm talking about, but I love my Father and my Brother, and believe that the Holy Spirit continues to comfort and teach me day by day.
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  7

  "Home Is The Sailor.."

  by Englishman in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i mentioned last week that we had held a wake for my friend and quiz partner, knocker john the sailor and submariner.. this afternoon saw the completion of our good-byes, as knocker was cremated after an amazing funeral.

  first off, the coffin arrived draped in the royal navy ensign, then, to the music of moonlight serenade, we all trooped into the chapel.

  a lady stood to take the service, and, suddenly i realised that knockers last wish was to take place.. about a year ago, i posted how knocker and i had attended a funeral for someone else, and how marvellous the funeral had been because it had been a non-religious service.

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  LittleToe

  That's a great poem, too.
  Robert Louis Stevenson was one of Scotland's finest.

  I'll charge a glass to your departed friend, too.
  Sorry to hear of your loss.
• 
  169

  X-JWs Who are now bible Christians

  by clash_city_rockers in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi folks,.

  i'm just sort of taking role call to all those x-dubs who are now brothers and sisters in christ.

  i think it is wise for us to rise up and be counted so that we know who each other are.

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  LittleToe

  Seems there are personality issues that I was unaware of before I entered this thread. I would still have entered it, though, merely because the title demanded a response.

  PointBlank:
  I can follow what you're saying, as my case was similar. I came to Christ as a devout JW elder. It was another couple of months before I came to understand the Trinity doctrine.
  It was shortly after that that I came to realise that some issues are salvation issues (like accepting Christ and being born again) and some issues are not (like believing in hell, or not).
  Romans 8 is a pivotal scripture, in this regard.

  I think Calvin was genuine and had his head in the right direction, but many of his followers have not.
  HyperCalvinists abound, and they are very mislead, IMHO.

  RR:
  If you have been called by the Father to a faith in Christ by Holy Spirit, I can happliy call you "brother", regardless of your doctrinal persuasion.

  Clash:
  Your demeanor and dogmatism do neither you or the gospel any credit.
  Sorry, bro, but you either need to lighten up or realise what really are the fundamentals.

  Did you never hear of the story of the Calvinist whose main detractor (an Arminian) died. Upon being told by a colleague "You'll never see HIM again", he replied "You are right, because he will be so much nearer the face of God than I" (inaccurate quote from memory).

  I can't stand dogma - absolute truth is held by one alone!
  Was that a dogmatic statement???
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  28

  personality test

  by BATHORY in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  g'day cyber junkets.. now this personality test is good, very good.. i would be very interested to see the results from most posters.. i came up a type 5, the investigator.

  so accurate.. i can see simon as type 9, englishman as the definative 7, alan .

  fur-burger is a natural 8 ( with a definite twist of 6 ), princess is a 4 through and through and naeblis, well....he thinks he is a 3 but he is really a hardcore 5.. well was i close ???.

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  LittleToe

  It places me as a 2 (Helper), with the next nearest a 9 (Peacemaker).
  Seems about right.

  Never been into flattery, though. I detest it.
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  37

  Second death-what does it REALLY mean?

  by FRUSR8TD in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  in this thread... http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=28021&site=3.

  bleep said:.

  how can you be suffering when your dead?.

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  LittleToe

  Larsguy:
  The way you reasoned that is sooooo JW.
  Did you read all of that out of the "Reasoning Book"?
  IMHO you don't even address the issues, you sidestep them.

  Gawd I am so irritated by your post!!!!
  It's as if you are using all the Wt mechanisms to make your point, whilst avoiding the issues raised!!!

  For example:
  "Death in the Bible is a state of total unconsciuosness"
  Is it?
  That's the definitive absolute meaning of this word, is it?

  "This sounds like a lake of lava..."
  The argument that follows is based on your subjective interpretation of what John reports seeing, sidestepping what it actually says.

  "So I think there is a basis to believe..."
  "I acknowledge...But..."
  "deals with a time when the Rich Man is simply condemned but still active..."
  Speculation presented as fact.
  How is he "simpy condemned but still active", when Jesus has just stated that they both died?

  "This might have to do with the concept..."
  More speculation presented as fact.

  Now I'm not yet convinced that there's an eternal place of torment, and should probably get around to doing some serious study on the subject. Howerver it seems to me that the JW's haven't done all their homework, either, and are blatantly ignoring many scriptures.
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  10

  EMERGENCY ELDERS MEETINGS

  by biblexaminer in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  well, it seems that in many areas, the elders have been meeting alot more than usual this weekend.. abnormal times for elders to meet that is.

  and long meetings.. i wonder what that's about?

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  LittleToe

  I understand that the pioneer meeting was held late Saturday morning, this visit. That is unusual.
  I could only guess that the elders had a Saturday afternoon session, as well as the usual business on the Friday night.

  For the last few visits there have been extra sessions on such things as the Data Protection Act, etc.
  It's becoming a bit humdrum.