Jerryh

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Posts by Jerryh

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  2

  Jehovah's Witnesses View of Jesus Compared to the Early Church by Cofty

  by Jerryh in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  cofty, just saw your post which you updated from 16 years ago.

  if i understand your current view of the bible it's that it is without merit and should not be believed.. i respect that but at the same time your ability to summarize the doctrine is first rate.

  this is not a defense of the trinity or of the deity of jesus - that's a whole different thread.. your op is great.

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  Jerryh

  thanks...take care
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  Jehovah's Witnesses View of Jesus Compared to the Early Church by Cofty

  by Jerryh in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  cofty, just saw your post which you updated from 16 years ago.

  if i understand your current view of the bible it's that it is without merit and should not be believed.. i respect that but at the same time your ability to summarize the doctrine is first rate.

  this is not a defense of the trinity or of the deity of jesus - that's a whole different thread.. your op is great.

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  Jerryh

  Cofty, just saw your post which you updated from 16 years ago.

  If I understand your current view of the Bible it's that it is without merit and should not be believed.

  I respect that but at the same time your ability to summarize the doctrine is first rate. You also said :

  This is not a defense of the trinity or of the deity of Jesus - that's a whole different thread.
  

  Your OP is great. I realize trinity discussions can be a black hole but given the 9 bullet points, would you say

  the trinity was a reasonable thing for the early church to deduce?

  Jerryh
  
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  18

  Evolution is a Fact #35 - Nature Red in Tooth and Claw

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  genes only get copied to future generations if the bodies they help to build succeed in surviving and reproducing.

  these sort of genes thrive in the gene pool and genes that build unsuccessful bodies don't.

  this blindingly obvious fact is at the very core of understanding evolution by natural selection.. being born, finding food and shelter, escaping predators, fighting opponents, attracting a mate and raising the next generation - the challenges faced by living things are daunting.

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  Jerryh

  I'm enjoying the conversation, thanks
  

  Me too, though I have not been able to express my bewilderment at molecules evolving free will.
  

  The christian narrative characterises a beautiful newborn baby as a worthless sinner "deserving of wrath" because an ancestor ate a piece of fruit.
  

  Cofty, no doubt you know the Christian answer to this. Even the JWs cite "age of accountability".

  Much more important though is what happened on the cross shows the worth of babies.
  

  At what stage in our evolution we acquired the capacity to make moral judgements is difficult to say.
  

  I get the picture that you are a thoughtful man which is why I entered this conversation in the first place.

  Some things are difficult to say. Let me end with a hypothetical question. I understand you reject the

  Christian story so I realize this is hypothetical. If it was true. If is was true. Would it be a good deal?
  
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  18

  Evolution is a Fact #35 - Nature Red in Tooth and Claw

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  genes only get copied to future generations if the bodies they help to build succeed in surviving and reproducing.

  these sort of genes thrive in the gene pool and genes that build unsuccessful bodies don't.

  this blindingly obvious fact is at the very core of understanding evolution by natural selection.. being born, finding food and shelter, escaping predators, fighting opponents, attracting a mate and raising the next generation - the challenges faced by living things are daunting.

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  Jerryh

  Thanks for your patience. In the Christian narrative we see when "immorality" arose.

  Whether a person accepts it or not we still have the narrative.

  In the narrative where impersonal energy gels into the Higgs bosen- quarks - Hydrogen - water

  amoeba - etc. when did amoral become immoral? not a gotcha, I am interested.
  
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  18

  Evolution is a Fact #35 - Nature Red in Tooth and Claw

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  genes only get copied to future generations if the bodies they help to build succeed in surviving and reproducing.

  these sort of genes thrive in the gene pool and genes that build unsuccessful bodies don't.

  this blindingly obvious fact is at the very core of understanding evolution by natural selection.. being born, finding food and shelter, escaping predators, fighting opponents, attracting a mate and raising the next generation - the challenges faced by living things are daunting.

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  Jerryh

  uuumm no I associate "thing" with molecules.

  Red necks don't know many words but, status maybe. The thesaurus is no help.

  I'm thinking of morality, whether natural or supernatural. It is just that I as a believer in God

  have to admit that I see through a glass darkly. I do not have quick easy answers and saw in this

  thread a chance to get the viewpoint of some folks the see things from a different starting point.

  I am not down on J. Bruce Irsay, I just saw an article on the Titanic and then this thread. Bruce did

  what came naturally. My starting point comes from Ephesians 2:3, no surprise. Bruce and I share

  a natural birth defect that is not molecular and 1 Corinthians 11:31 applies.

  The more I think about it, free will better refers to what I was asking about. I see an unbridgeable

  gap between what a hyena naturally does and what I naturally do, not singling out Mr. Irsay but using

  him as a useful example. We can say what he did was natural but was it evil? What do you think?
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  18

  Evolution is a Fact #35 - Nature Red in Tooth and Claw

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  genes only get copied to future generations if the bodies they help to build succeed in surviving and reproducing.

  these sort of genes thrive in the gene pool and genes that build unsuccessful bodies don't.

  this blindingly obvious fact is at the very core of understanding evolution by natural selection.. being born, finding food and shelter, escaping predators, fighting opponents, attracting a mate and raising the next generation - the challenges faced by living things are daunting.

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  Jerryh

  Hi Cofty

  I know about Christian theism but I am hoping for non-christian non-believer thought

  which technically is still theism I guess. I am not asking about why might be called evil. I am asking

  about evil. Red tooth and claw evil. Enjoy your posts btw.

  http://www.c-span.org/video/?312542-1/words-sally-satel Leads to a good talk on neuroscience.
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  18

  Evolution is a Fact #35 - Nature Red in Tooth and Claw

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  genes only get copied to future generations if the bodies they help to build succeed in surviving and reproducing.

  these sort of genes thrive in the gene pool and genes that build unsuccessful bodies don't.

  this blindingly obvious fact is at the very core of understanding evolution by natural selection.. being born, finding food and shelter, escaping predators, fighting opponents, attracting a mate and raising the next generation - the challenges faced by living things are daunting.

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  Jerryh

  it is an uncomfortable thing to view but a perfect paradigm of evolution.
  

  Half banana referring to "survival of the fittest"

  there is no sentimentality in the real scientific world of nature.
  

  I was never a JW and visit this board only to gain from others experience. I am a Christian, not much of one,

  but that's another story. I see that many posters here have rejected the existence of God based on the

  "problem of evil". This problem is not new of course and has its own name (theodicy) and is unlikely to

  be settled in a forum post. I usually visit here for JW insight but in this thread I see an opportunity to ask

  for another kind and I am genuinely asking. In the USA April 15 is evil but that also another story.

  This man was J. Bruce Ismay. You can read about Bruce at Wikipedia. Was he evil on April 15 1912?

  Can you identify with Bruce in any way? Any sentiment at all? Was Bruce only driven by a proven scientific

  principle? Please don't hear this as questioning evolution. It takes more pesticides / antibiotics. Case closed.

  Next case. Evolution exists and is a topic for consideration. Evil exists and is a topic for consideration. Was

  J. Bruce Ismay, Leslie Van Houton, me and you altogether molecules? In my culture there are few

  people openly unbelievers, hypocrites aplently but that still another story. I honestly am asking, how do

  self professed unbelievers explain evil?
  
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  13

  A Chance To Plant A Seed That We All Have

  by dubstepped in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i'd like to brainstorm something with the rest of you.

  this summer at the regional conventions we all know by now that a talk on shunning is going to be given.

  we all know what that talk will likely point to.

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  Jerryh

  Dubstepped, I am pretty new to this forum and was never a JW. I lurk here in the hope of gaining some insight that may be useful to me in relating to some family converts. I was never inside a kingdom hall but one time. I attended my grandson's wedding. I love 2 converts, daughter / son-in-law and (2 born ins?) granddaughter / grandson and the key word there is love.

  Often when someone posts any thoughts that grab me I go and review their other posts to get a feel for their approach to things generally. In the last few minutes I read your story. Among other things I know your name is Mike, so hello Mike. One thing that comes through is that you are a man of love and still quoting scripture.

  You are good with words also. Case in point "authentic person inside" "soft chocolate center"

  "basic humanity" I encourage you to go forward with this project, it sounds good.
  
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  15

  Is it true: the memorial will stop after the last anointed have passed away?

  by FinchAndWeston in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i heard that the memorial will stop after the last anointed have passed away ... is this information true/false?

  just curious.

  it's secondhand.

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  Jerryh

  *** w80 7/1 p. 31 Questions From Readers *** Questions From Readers
  ● Why does the November 15, 1979, issue of The Watchtower (pages 26, 27) speak of the “new covenant” being near the end of its operation, when Hebrews 13:20 speaks of this covenant as being “an everlasting covenant”?
  The Watchtower stated: “Evidently the new covenant is nearing the end of its operation for the purpose of producing 144,000 spiritual Israelites who meet God’s approval for being associated with Jesus Christ in the heavenly kingdom, the ideal government for mankind. When the last of these approved spiritual Israelites cease to be ‘men’ because of earthly death and a resurrection to a share in the heavenly kingdom, then the mediatorship of Jesus Christ will cease also.“
  Note that The Watchtower did not say that the benefits of this new covenant would cease. Those who live on earth will benefit in an everlasting way from the fact that this new covenant fulfilled its purpose in producing 144,000 spiritual sons of God who will reign as joint heirs with Christ in the heavens.
  
  *** w83 8/15 p. 23 par. 14 United Fruit Bearers ***
  Just as the anointed “branches” of the “true vine” must remain in union with Christ, the “other sheep” must remain in close union with “the faithful and discreet slave,” Christ’s anointed “brothers.” Only thus can they hope to ‘inherit the Kingdom prepared for them from the founding of the world.’—Matthew 25:31-40
  
  
  
  
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  20

  If God is all powerful why did it take six days

  by James Mixon in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  if god is omnipotent (all powerful) why did he take six days (or six thousand years jw.org) to.

  crete everything.

  why not speak everything into existence all at once?

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  Jerryh

  ahem
  

  http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2016/03/why-watching-comb-jellies-poop-has-stunned-evolutionary-biologists