Posts by Knowsnothing

8

Book Study/Congregational Book Study?

by PublishingCult in

i know the book study arrangement had been deleted in 2009, however, i am hearing that a similar meeting has been ressurrected and being called the "congregation book study".

http://www.jw-archive.org/2010/09/usa-2010.html?m=1.

can anyone clarify, please?.

Knowsnothing

Hey PublishingCult, it's simple really. The Borg mentioned that because of work, gas prices, other miscellaneous stress, etc., that they decided to condense it with the theocratic ministry school and the field service meeting.

So the weekly line-up would be, for example, Sunday- 30min Talk/60min Watchtower study

Wednesday- 20min congregation book study/20-25min TMS/30-45min FSM

I'm glad they freed up a night. Going 3 times a week was bummer. The CBS is the same ol crap as the book study, but in the hall.

BUT(and this is a big one), there is a "mandatory" Weekly Family Worship Night. It already technically existed, but it was far from mandatory. I use it mainly to study for WT, CBS and FS. It's supposed to be a pleasurable experience, like if you have kids, re-enact Biblical scenes, etc.

But screw that. Like I said, I use it to study things we have to study.

19

Watchtower Bethel Application from 2004

by Marvin Shilmer in

jw
friends

watchtower bethel application from 2004. questions asked tell their own story.

today i posted onto my blog the watchtower bethel application from 2004, available at: http://marvinshilmer.blogspot.com/2011/03/watchtower-bethel-application-from-2004.html .

marvin shilmer.

Knowsnothing

"Do you believe that spiritual food from Jehovah is being provided through the "faithful and discreet slave" class and are you in harmony with it's teaching? (Matthew 24:45-47)"

VOMIT!!!

22

DF Question

by TheLoveDoctor in

if 1 elder definetly knows how i feel of governing body and some of thier doctrine, he knows as i admitted viewing and researching apostate liturate can they still disfellowship me if i refuse to meet?

right now the 1 brother would talk to the body they would need 2 witneses or one more brother to determine if thier should be a jc yet i know and they know it would be obviouse for the need for one, could the just form one and if i refuse to meet could they df me anyway?.

Knowsnothing

Ya dude. Your screwed.

One elder's word is all it takes to DF in this case, as you admitted to him. Also, by refusing to show up, it's as if you admitted such, by default.

Mentally prepare yourself, keep us updated, and find support!

42

What Are Their Motives?

by headisspinning in

i have a question.

if jws are a cult, what is the motivation of the leaders?

what are they getting out of controlling all these people?.

Knowsnothing

There's a deference in those that serve God out of love and those not with a pure motive. The faithful and discreet slave doesn't profit from the good news nor have they ever.

True, some are preaching the Christ through envy and rivalry, but others also through goodwill. The latter are publicizing the Christ out of love, for they know I am set here for the defense of the good news; but the former do it out of contentiousness, not with a pure motive, for they are supposing to stir up tribulation [for me] in my [prison] bonds. Philippians 1:15-17

Allow room for us. We have wronged no one, we have corrupted no one, we have taken advantage of no one. I do not say this to condemn you. For I have said before that you are in our hearts to die and to live with us. I have great freeness of speech toward you. I have great boasting in regard to you. 2 Corinthians 7:2-4

-------------------Spade

There are some assumptions here. Even if the slave has a good motive, it does not mean they have divine appointment. After all, how are we to judge that all non-JW Christians aren't with a pure motive?

You, along with other posters, unanimously agree that the slave really isn't even the rest of the anointed, merely the GB. Why doesn't the GB out-right say they are the slave, instead of insinuating the anointed class really has any importance?

Are you sure they've wronged no one? Not directly, at least. But their enforcement of man-made policy sure has.

I would have to agree, however, that I really don't see how they benefit monetarily. They aren't exactly living in the lap of luxury. They have their basic necesities covered.

As for exwhyzee's post, I feel that is the most accurate description of what is really going on. The WTS is "captive to a concept".

73

If God exists and ordered a Purge how would you react?

by sabastious in

the reason why god killed everyone in the days of noah was because of the demons who came to earth.

according to the story their direct presence and impact on us had a poisening effect.

we became corrupted and god felt the need for a total purge.. that's what the witnesses say is happening today.

Knowsnothing

See this is where I just can't agree. Again while reading history all I see is progress. Sure it's up and down all the time but eventually we learn our lesson and are better for it. The unfortunate fact is that sometimes we don't learn our lesson before our time is up and we end up harming many in our life. For every person that tears down there are two to build back up that's what I see when I look at our history compared to now.

-Sab

Just to add to your comment Sab, God actually didn't want us to progress, at least not according to the story of Babel. Although I doubt they could have constructed any tower taller than the skyscrapers we have today. Why doesn't God frustrate humans' plans today? In fact, I see no reason why God saw fit to frustrate man's plans to begin with. To me, that smells anti-freewill.

It's either God's way, or the highway.

28

They Gotta Know They are Running a Cult - a Rant

by OnTheWayOut in

i go back and forth on this one.

do the governing body members or some higher-ups behind the curtain of the wizard really know they are running a scam of a dangerous mind-control cult?

or are they victims of their own cult?

Knowsnothing

I think cognitive dissonance, which has always been included in these types of discussions, is the answer. Like you've all said, so much of their lives are invested in it, their old age(they have no where else to go at this point), that they simply can't accept the truth. The lie they know must become truth. At all costs. And that's where the magic lies.

Doesn't matter how many times they have been wrong, what they have been wrong about, and the fact that there is no such thing as Divine Revelation (least not for them), the organisation, the religion, the belief is true.

The thing of it for me is, how do they deal with knowing they don't have Divine Revelation nor Direction, yet believing so. There is no, nada, zip, zilch confirmation or tangible fact to prove so. Thus, cognitive dissonance.

Do I believe they know this is fake? Maybe a couple. Unfortunatley, the with the way life works, perhaps some of them haven't had any extremely bad, or eye-opening experiences within the org or themselves to shake their worldview. And then too, senility sits in for some, and at that point, why the overhaul in belief? Perhaps some really did try to live good, decent lives, and never saw anything that disturbed them. You have to remember too, that the GB aren't the sole ones responsible for things happening or getting done. Nor do they directly deal with all the crap either, such as letters asking questions and such, thereby having some isolation from the world and reality. They live in their own world. The only problem is their little world very much affects millions of lives.

That's my view on it.

13

What are the people at Bethel like? What's the GB like?

by doubtful in

i can't even count the number of times i've heard people say how incredibly humble and down-to-earth and caring the exectuives at bethel are.

i've had one first person encounter with a gb member..i forget his name although i would be able to identify him in a picture.

he did seem genuinely nice.

Knowsnothing

http://freeminds.org/organization/brooklyn-bethel/freddy-klein-and-the-apostate-books.html

In general, that website will give you the break-down.

There is one story passed along about Knorr is his later days seen wearing a funny t-shirt saying "Hell" or "Damn" or something to that effect.

Also, please view the following link and download, if only temporarily, the document. If you can't read CoC, you must read this.

http://jwfacts.com/watchtower/experiences/anderson.php

The Watchtower is not the perfect lil place one might have thought it to be. History shows any person, and especially any organisation, is prone to corruption, power-trips, etc. No exceptions.

23

My Brother said: I need to get out of satan's santanic world and get back to the kingdom hall

by Joliette in

please ask me why was my brother on the jehovah's witness official facebook page, telling the faithful dubs on there why he doesnt understand why he satan keeps calling him back to the world, and then talks about why he needs to start going back to the hall.

then he gets on his facebook and talks about how gay people should die a slow and painful death???

wtf.

Knowsnothing

Since when does the WTS have an official Jehovah's Witnesses Facebook page? This is news to me.....

46

Pray for our Brothers in Japan

by doubtful in

this is my first post.

the first portion is my story, and toward the end, you will find the section pertinent to the title of this thread.

(starting with the portion in bold print).

Knowsnothing

I'm sorry that I've digressed so much, and you must have grown weary of all this complaining by now, but this is the first time I've written down these thoughts in such a systematic way. Please forgive me.

Anyway, now at the age of 21, after having taken an interest in logic, critical thinking, and a little bit of science, I have decided to investigate my doubts, to see if there were any rational basis for them. And I've found that there are huge gaping holes in much of the docrtine, logistical impossiblites and contradictions in the bible, and unethical journalism commited by the society. So now I feel like my world has come crashing down on me. I feel as if I have been lied to my entire life (I haven't determined if the governing body is criminal and insincere or just naive), and been given a false hope about the future. I never put much stock in the assertion that Armageddon was necessarily iminent beyond any shadow of doubt as most witnesses steadfastly believe, but now that I know 1914 is all a crock, I feel no sense of urgency at all. Yet I at least hoped that eventually the new perfect world would come in my lifetime, rid me of my poor health, and allow me to never have to die and cease to exist. Now that powerful hope is gone. I am depressed beyond all comprehension. -------------------doubtful

You have nothing to be sorry about. Everyone has to vent. In fact, I'd say my experience is somewhat similar to yours. I myself have been through much depression. It is a slow process, and one day I hope to leave the borg. At least here you can speak you mind freely, objectively. Apostasy is merely reality.

If your looking for the pdf, here is the best I can do for you. I only read a portion of it myself, but it is a must read. You can't get this kind of perspective anywhere else. Ray was at the top, and saw how the organisation worked first-hand. When I read it, it was far from the fantasy world I imagined Bethel or anything of the like to be.

http://www.paradisecafediscussions.net/showthread.php?tid=2617

44

What Was Meant By 'Abstain From Blood'?

by headisspinning in

i have always been very hardcore about my aversion to blood and have never even considered the possibility that this was merely a dietary restriction.

i always bought into the analogy of a doctor telling a patient to abstain from alcohol... it wouldn't matter whether this individual drank the alcohol or took it intravenously... it would all be in direct contradiction to the doctor's orders to 'abstain' from alcohol.. or the other analogy is to an apple pie... if you weren't to eat the pie, it would not be okay to separate it out into the main parts (or 'components)... ie.

the flour, the apples, the sugar or the cinnamon... if they were taken from that pie, you were eating the pie.. so maybe you can see where the questions popped up for me.

Knowsnothing

@ Headisspinning:

Allow me to quote from the "Questions From Readers," The Watchtower , May 15, 1983, pp. 30-1.

Despite pressures to water down God’s requirements, true Christians know that life is a gift from Jehovah God and must be used as he directs. They obey God whether it seems physically practical now or not. For example, Acts 15:28, 29 commands Christians to abstain from idolatry. Thus a true worshiper threatened with death if he refused to share in idolatry would not argue that since “an idol is nothing,” he should not lose his present life over just a symbol. (1 Corinthians 8:4) The three faithful Hebrews set the proper example of obedience, as did the early Christians who accepted death in the arena rather than put incense on an altar.—Daniel 3:1-18.

Similarly, if a problem arose concerning blood, as when an accident or an operation causes extreme blood loss, the Christian cannot compromise his integrity. He obeys his Life-Giver with full assurance that if, despite the best alternative medical treatment, his present life should be lost, his eternal life is not endangered. Jesus told his followers: “Do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; but rather be in fear of him that can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.”—Matthew 10:28.

-------------

OK, those comments I highlighted are BS. So they allow fractions now, but yet somehow, whole blood or the 4 major components are compromising integrity?

Something that helped me get my mind straight on this was organ transplants. They were wrong about that, and they are wrong about blood transfusions. Don't let a couple of men in suits make decisions for you. All they want to do is control your conscience. And they can, and have done it to all of us, at the flick of their magic wand.