Posts by roxanesophia

77

Association: Am i being lied to?

by roxanesophia in

i don't hesitate to bring up with the girl i study with, my criticisms of the religion, and one of those is the association.

i keep reading on here that jw's don't make friends outside the cult, and this is what i used as an excuse for stepping further away from being baptized.

she tells me it's not true, and they can have what ever friends they want.

roxanesophia

I don't hesitate to bring up with the girl i study with, my criticisms of the religion, and one of those is the association. I keep reading on here that JW's don't make friends outside the cult, and this is what i used as an excuse for stepping further away from being baptized. She tells me it's not true, and they can have what ever friends they want. Now, I don't BELIEVE that's true. My suspicion is I'm being told this because they know it's putting me off getting baptized and they have no real control over a study until they become a member so no one brings up the truth early in the game. Am I right in assuming that?

17

Reasons "love bombing" ceases

by roxanesophia in

i study with a highly esteemed pioneer & elder's kid and i've learned on here that pioneers are right up there when it comes to gossip, as are elders kids, so i've got a double whammy.

unfortunately i didn't learn that until after i'd trusted her.

call me a moron but i'm totally drawn in by the kindness.

roxanesophia

Hmmm.... I guess they're not obeying the rules then. It's a group of young people at someone's house, much like the old done-away with book study. Some of the people there live together, but then they invite others. NO ELDERS though

17

Reasons "love bombing" ceases

by roxanesophia in

i study with a highly esteemed pioneer & elder's kid and i've learned on here that pioneers are right up there when it comes to gossip, as are elders kids, so i've got a double whammy.

unfortunately i didn't learn that until after i'd trusted her.

call me a moron but i'm totally drawn in by the kindness.

roxanesophia

Thanks for the explanations sizemik and Witness My Fury (great name, by the way), surely that procedure is written in the bible, SOMEWHERE...

Really people keep trying harder and harder to be the best witness they can be to get that feeling back of being wanted, but unless you break into one of the cliques, you won't do it.

I'm so angry that my study conductor has neglected to tell me this stuff. Sounds like highschool again, but much worse, because it's grown men and women and a relationship with God is at stake (not that i believe that crap anymore. God isn't there anymore than he's in the church of Satan). So much for the love they have amongst themselves. Just sounds like continual judgment, then locked into that awful environment and forbidden to seek outside association with people you'd actually truly get along with and have something in common with other than field service.

You should have a bible study of your own you two lol

That's an awesome idea. Oh... but we wouldn't get very far!
Also, i'm in the habit of saying "Jehovah God" which she hates because she doesn't believe it's a real name.

So we're starting with an apostate luncheon. I txt , figuring he'd jump at the chance to associate with fellow demons, but he's too busy helping witnesses spread false gospel.

6

Counting time

by roxanesophia in

forgive me if it's a stupid question, but it's on my brain now that i don't trust the motives of witnesses out to recruit a new fruit loop to the bowl.... .

can they count their time driving "interested ones" to meetings?

.

roxanesophia

OH GOOD GOD. Is that why so many people stay so long after the meeting to talk to new ones.

Or are so desperate to accompany people on studies...

21

Are Jehovah's Witnesses Chrsitians?

by TimothyT in

despite being a jw for 20 years, this has just flashed up into my mind?.

of course jesus is important in the lives of jw's, but they worship jehovah!.

hence, are they christians or jehovians?.

roxanesophia

I don't think they are. THEY think they are. Therein lies the problem.
The doctrine actually doesn't give much to Jesus at all - first they eliminate the bible teaching that he is mankind's mediator, and then they exclude 98% of witnesses from partaking of his 'body and blood' though the bible doesn't say anything about only a select group being "worthy."

The NWT doesn't even respect Jesus enough not to twist his words. "Today you will be with me in paradise" - every other bible vs "I say to you today, you will be with me in paradise." A subtle, but significant difference.

I think all religion is man-made crap (and when i said this to a witness they said "Good thing we aren't a religion.") , i just think anyone who believes in Christ and accepts him as their savior is a Christian.

6

Counting time

by roxanesophia in

forgive me if it's a stupid question, but it's on my brain now that i don't trust the motives of witnesses out to recruit a new fruit loop to the bowl.... .

can they count their time driving "interested ones" to meetings?

.

roxanesophia

Forgive me if it's a stupid question, but it's on my brain now that I don't trust the motives of witnesses out to recruit a new fruit loop to the bowl...

Can they count their time driving "interested ones" to meetings?

17

Reasons "love bombing" ceases

by roxanesophia in

i study with a highly esteemed pioneer & elder's kid and i've learned on here that pioneers are right up there when it comes to gossip, as are elders kids, so i've got a double whammy.

unfortunately i didn't learn that until after i'd trusted her.

call me a moron but i'm totally drawn in by the kindness.

roxanesophia

IsaacJ22, your story is awful! Apart from the getting out of it part. I'm glad I came here, and i'm glad i have the brain to see through all the false love. MAYBE, these people i'm accusing of backstabbing me in every breath are genuinely good people, but after reading your experience, thats not a risk i want to take. Mostly they use cult talk at the moment like "You're one of us." But then say I'm not because I'm not baptized. Oh please, they surely think I'm an idiot. Well , i know they do, because I'm a reader, writer, researcher, and my knowledge extends past what the Watchtower teaches, and they think they are superior as far as education goes when the 'God' they serve strives to keep them stupid. SO SAD! I figure that because i do have have the knowledge i have and have no plans to give up researching everything I read, I'd probably be disfellowshipped before my hair dried.

And i have felt like you did... Are they the right religion? If so why do i feel so unhappy? It was almost turning me off God. Like i mentioned in my first post, when i thought it was in my heart to do 'Jehovah's will' and i was preparing to meet with the elders, I prayed, and all this 'apostate' stuff that makes all the sense in the world comes to me. My teacher clapped her hands with glee as if the devil was doing his job. OH SPARE ME. And when i wasn't progressing fast enough, she says i must own something satanic or be watching something, reading something, involved in SOMETHING that the devil is using to hold me back. And this genuinely freaked me out for a few nights...

And ASTOUNDING, that even though you can be in their hall, progressing, and being treated like gum on the back of an elders shoe, the second you abandon them, they're concerned and loving. Which, when i was in a worse state, totally would have fallen for. WOW... thats really bizarre. I shudder to think what i almost got myself into.

as far as association goes, i think i'm being kept away at this stage from spiritually strong people, AND on the flipside the spiritually weak ones. It's like I'm bad association to the former group, and too good for the latter and they might stumble me with their behavior. I can tell because in the hall, someone will join me and the person i'm talking to depending on who it is. I can get stuck talking to 80 yr old women for an hour with no escape person in sight, but as soon as i'm with a guy, suddenly people are flocking around.

Also, I've been around my teacher and her friends (other elders kids) when they're discussing someone in a bad way and then stopped when they noticed me. I know they know i'm not going to tell on them because i'm the outsider (and god does it feel that way!) so i think it's more about them not wanting to expose me to their nasty side yet. Im pretty sure they've had txt message conversations instead right in front of me. I'm an observer, albeit a overanalytic slightly paranoid one, but i'm right at least some of the time! she gave me her phone once to call someone for her and it took everything in me not to look at her messages.

Oh and my favourite moment was when i came to a meeting, sat down with an elders daughter i genuinely get along with (i think) and a MS dashed from the book counter up to the elder at the front and they were talking and looking at me. Took everything in me that time not to give them the finger. For curiosity's sake: how far up an elder's ass is an MS?

I have heard so loud speculating which included pounding of fists on table to make a point. Old timers loved to do this.
That would have made it less cult-ish and a lot more interesting. What kept me going to the meetings was "at least they discuss the bible and have other insightful discussions." No they don't. They read whats written... then read it again. And they take bible verses out of context that only decreases my bible knowledge, not expand it. That's when i realized that staying in it wouldn't benefit me in the slightest. I'm better off in the catholic church they condemn so often because at least whole chapters get read. Speaking of that, JW logic had such an impact on me, i was thinking my grandmother who is the most christian woman, better than 98% of the JWs I've met, was damned without question because not only did she go to the catholic church every week without fail, she gave them money - which you actually saw them use to help in the community. I love how JW's get pissed off when people judge them and they'll say "If they only came to a meeting, they'd see they are wrong about us." when they judge every other religion and wouldn't step foot in their churches to see that THEY'RE wrong.

Anyway, here's an update: Last visit to the hall i told a woman i don't need a religion to serve Jesus Christ. Her loving response was "But you wouldn't get very far."

And I asked an elder what would happen if someone took a blood transfusion as a baptized witness.

Me: "That's instant disfellowshipping, right? Hardest time of their life being sick and all, and then shunned on top of it."
Him: "Well.... uhh, no... no... well, let's say they'd definitely get a talking to."

LIAR.

17

Reasons "love bombing" ceases

by roxanesophia in

i study with a highly esteemed pioneer & elder's kid and i've learned on here that pioneers are right up there when it comes to gossip, as are elders kids, so i've got a double whammy.

unfortunately i didn't learn that until after i'd trusted her.

call me a moron but i'm totally drawn in by the kindness.

roxanesophia

Thanks guys for the insight into JW logic, it all makes sense (now if only their doctrines could). I suspected what was going on, but just need confirmation and i appreciate what everyone has to say.

Stick to your guns and ask questions, especially the hard ones.

This is exactly my strategy for getting the hell out. I was prepared at one point to stay in this sham for the association and because i am attracted to the morals, can't deny that. But i can't teach lies and i can't be a slave to a false prophet. And I'm sure the "you'll never be good enough" will kill me slowly and then i'm terrified of the fact there's no honorable way to leave in future. It just makes me so sad to know people who have put their entire life on hold, believing nothing else in life is important enough to pursue, believing they are doing the will of God. But i have faith in the prophecy that false prophets and sheep in wolf clothing will be dealt with.

they are under cult mind control I honestly think this is already started working on me. I've been in and out of this religion for years and always kept it at arms length. Sporadic meeting attendance and studying. It was never really in my heart to commit to it and the second it was, i learned THE TRUTH. HA! But I'm already using their terms and every time i saw a nice person i assumed they were a JW or should be (sick, i know) and while i once found meetings boring, since i started going regularly, I think i actually like them. I was explaining this to a worldly friend... I said "I can be so convinced i'm not going, then the time rolls around, something snaps in my indoctrinated brain, and i have to be there. I go. I JUST GO!" Scary, eh?

The JW's use terms such as "sheeplike" and "teachable"
Don't I know it. I've also heard "You have to have faith that whatever you don't understand, you don't have to." Damn, good way to brush off my doubts, but i'm not that stupid. Also, brothers were calling on my actual brother until they found out he is intellectually disabled, therefore no easy convert. Dropped him like a hot plate.

Most JW's talk at length about interested ones and studies behind their back. UGH! I try to remember "a celebrity is known to persons he's glad he doesn't know" or something like that to deal with this one. But i figured thats how it worked. Why do they do that? I just found it laughable, when i wasn't pissed off, that elders and MS and other pioneers already knew what i told them in some cases. And god knows what they know that i never told them. Oh well... it's that judgment that is going to make me walk from this religion, so good on them. Well, that, and because it's the whore of babylon.

"But you're doing so well" = what made you become a Satan-influenced trouble-maker all of a sudden?
Hahaha. Yeah they're pretty terrible at being subtle. My other favorite phrase he used when i was discussing doubts was "But you've been here, you've seen it for yourself, you know it's the truth, the people on the internet are there to make your life hard." It's so condescending. It's like trying to reason with a starving lion. No, actually, I believed it when i wasn't there.

Studying with the JWs comes with too high a price, that is if you value your freedom as an individual.

That's why i can't keep it up. I feel guilt over letting my study teacher go, but then i think.. NO, it's not as if her time has been wasted. She could use me to count her time and look like a better witness. If anything my time has been wasted.

I actually met another study at the KH the other night who thinks it's all crap, too. What a blessing that was. I had been praying to JESUS, that i was doing this for the association and i knew that was bad. Bam. I go to the hall, and i think i've met my new best friend. We plan to exit together. I'd rather have one friend who knows I'm a good person than 20 friends who only know i'm a good person if i'm living up to the orgs standards.

And then i realize i don't even want friends who blindly follow teachings with no research on their own part. I do feel bad for the born ins though. I thought i had it hard but when i thought about it If i leave the cult, i've got the world to go back to, and my family will make me a cake. Born in leaves the cult, they're in a world that never knew them, and they're cut off from entire congregations of 'family.'

17

Reasons "love bombing" ceases

by roxanesophia in

i study with a highly esteemed pioneer & elder's kid and i've learned on here that pioneers are right up there when it comes to gossip, as are elders kids, so i've got a double whammy.

unfortunately i didn't learn that until after i'd trusted her.

call me a moron but i'm totally drawn in by the kindness.

roxanesophia

I study with a highly esteemed pioneer & elder's kid and I've learned on here that pioneers are right up there when it comes to gossip, as are elders kids, so I've got a double whammy. Unfortunately i didn't learn that until after I'd trusted her. But i really like her. Call me a moron but i'm totally drawn in by the kindness. Until i came here i wasn't aware it's never genuine. Can a pioneer ever be trusted to keep things confidential? Is it their duty to report things to elders or MS on the progress, conduct, past, etc on "interested ones"? Am i an idiot to believe they know nothing about my business?

Truth be told, when speaking to MS' (under the impression they were just guys my age who would understand where I'm coming from. WRONG) I've said, without thinking, the things i doubt or don't like. They stood there with fake smiles while explaining it to me, topping it off with "But you're doing so well!" One elder said "I've heard a lot about you" not elaborating on if it was negative or positive. This was our first meeting, i don't know the first thing about him. And maybe I'm imagining it, but the 'love' has cooled off. Dunno if they're annoyed that i had stumbled across the list of topics they can't speak about, or if I'm not progressing fast enough. How long does it take them to mark someone as spiritually weak?

I'm considered worthy association to go to watchtower pre-studies in people's houses but that same person, in the same house won't invite me to any other gatherings there. I feel like they're using my need for friends (now that i've said i have cut ties with worldly association) against me because i'm not out witnessing yet. But it makes me feel awful. You think you're getting along with someone,they take your number and you never hear from them. Also, i have made an effort to introduce myself to people at the hall, having 45 minute conversations with them even only to get to the next meeting and it's like we never even met. I'm quite a shy person so it takes a lot out of me to meet people so i can stop feeling anxious going to the hall knowing there's people in there i can talk to, and it sucks when the ice just cannot be broken. Is this typical JW bullshit?

I also brought up "love bombing" with her, without using that term, but she said "We like new people otherwise it's just people we've known for years and years and grew up with." I dunno if she's lying but she didn't make it sound as bad as I've read it is.

So, for a study initially "love bombed", and hearing "you're doing so well!" left, right and center, what are the typical JW reasons to stop? I thought that was supposed to happen after I'm dunked...

44

Damn you Kingdom Melodies! Damn you to hell...

by unshackled in

jw
friends

i haven't been anywhere near a jw meeting or convention in at least 8 or 9 years.

but this afternoon, i'm doing some weed trimming and suddenly realized i had this lyric playing in my head...over and over.... .

"ours is the god of true prophecy,.

roxanesophia

Unshackled - Welcome to the forum roxanesophia. What song was that with those "This is the way to life, this is the way..." lyrics? Doesn't ring a bell....

Thank you I just had to look up the song in the "Sing to Jehovah" book. It's song 65. I won't write out the whole chorus incase it gets stuck in anyone's head. I don't wanna be responsible for that.