I was on the compuater being studious for an upcoming talk. It had to do with 607 BCE and I stumbled upon the 587vs607BCE website. It was an eye opener. Then I started to do more and more researach. A couple of months later we went back to NY and visited family and went to Bethel (This trip had been planned long before), We new a couple who were there and met for lunch with them. My son who was 17 at the time said you know this is just a big corporation and we all agreed and then cut our visit short and went into the City to see more of the sites we really wanted to see.
lv4fer
JoinedPosts by lv4fer
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61
Where were you when the realization hit, that the WTS was not in the truth?
by whyizit ini was listening to a testimonial by valerie acuff and she said that she was sitting in an assembly, looking around at the crowd and thinking to herself, "this is your family, these are your people.".
she said at that moment she heard a voice inside say, "these are not your people, this is not your family, get up and leave now, and don't ever go back.
" so she took her two children at that very moment and left, and she never went back.
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WHO HAS READ C.O.C.? WHAT WAS AN EYE OPENER FOR YOU?
by juni ini am half way through the book and am finding some surprising information.
i was always told that the gb met on wed. and prayed before considering their decisions on things, but was i surprised that different ones were given the assignments and to use if they wanted other "worldly" written things and then were off on their own to work independantly or w/another to come up w/the book, etc.. also, the malawi and mexico difference in treatment.
brothers lied to escape military service in mexico.
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lv4fer
C of C. It was a great book. I think the manner in which it was written, without anger was incredible when you consider what he saw and what he experienced. I had already pretty much made up my mind, but if there was any doubt this was the clincher. I also read his second book. When my husband read the second bood In Search of Christian Freedom, also a great read and it was all but over for him, although like myself he already had serious doubts. I would recommend it to all Witnesses and XJW's alike, although the former probably won't read it.
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Do JWs Consider You To Be An "Apostate"?
by minimus inwe all know that our simply being here is considered an act of apostasy by witnesses.
whether they know you frequent such boards or not, are you considered an "apostate" by the witnesses?
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lv4fer
Oh yes, I was told that I think too much. That is why I am an Apostate. What a novel idea, thinking. That was what led to my demise. An elder actually told me that.
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YOU EVER FEEL SCARED IT IS THE TRUTH?
by Cordelia injust wondered as im prob about to give up so much, coz i dont think it is the truth but its come as such a shock!.
my family believe it so much, my dad feels he can answer any question i have, and being brought up in it sometimes it scares me.
coz my family believe it so much, .
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lv4fer
NO, ah No and Not at all, oh did I say NO! Really, when I was in I wasn't scared because I thought it was the Truth, then when I realized it wasn't the truth it was all over, and I have no doubt it is NOT the Truth.
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who attends a church now?
by meems101 in.
i'm interested in knowing how many, after leaving, started to attend a church.
if so, what one and how did you decide?
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lv4fer
I go to a Non-Denominational Church. It is really big, I like the pastor he is very down to earth. I don't go all the time just every once in a awhile. I would never sign a membership card or anything, Jesus has my membership card!
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My Dad died this evening
by Mulan ini thought i would let you know that my dad, passed away a little while ago, tonight, january 23. they called me at 6pm to tell me.
he had been failing rapidly for the past month, and had completely lost his hearing and was totally blind.
the dementia was extreme too, and he still knew me on thursday, but didn't wake up to know me in the following days.
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lv4fer
So sorry to hear of your dad's passing. My heartfelt prayers for you and your family.
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You guys might enjoythe "Logical Fallcies" paper for class I'm taking
by lv4fer ini wrote this paper for my logic class at university of phoenix.
we had to pick 3 logical fallacies explain and give examples.
show where an organization or business uses them.
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lv4fer
I wrote this paper for my Logic class at University of Phoenix. We had to pick 3 logical fallacies explain and give examples. Show where an organization or business uses them. Would you guys grade my paper! I had to keep it under 1200 words.
Jehovah’s Witnesses use fallacious reasoning to argue and debate the tenets of their faith. A Jehovah’s Witness who has tried to convince them that their religion is the true one have at one time or another approached most people. The Witnesses mislead many because people do not scrutinize the arguments that they use and do not carefully think things through. Another reason it is helpful to understand the reasoning they use, is so that a person can be better equipped to expose this illogical thinking to the Witness in order to free them from this religious cult. They employ many logical fallacies and I have chosen three that are most commonly used.
One way they mislead people is by attacking the person. In using this fallacy, they say something negative about the person rather than by arguing against what the person is saying. They will use this type of fallacy when they want to discredit a statement made by someone that other people believe to be true or in fact has been proven to be true, is wrong because it goes against what Jehovah’s Witnesses believe. If they can discredit the person saying it, then the statement cannot be true. If a person used information from a book that was written by a reliable source to prove a point, a typical reply would be “Maybe that book you quoted makes a good case, but I heard the author is a drunk."(Campbell, 2004), obviously, you cannot believe anything that author says because he is a drunk. In their publications, they use this fallacy quite frequently to discredit other religions by saying the religion is bad because look at this person who belongs to it therefore anything that organization does or says is wrong.
The red herring is a fallacy that draws attention away from the central issue at hand. The Jehovah’s Witness use this when debating with someone. If you can shift the focus of the debate, you do not have to debate the issue at hand. A person may ask them, how can you be so sure that you have the true religion? A typical reply would be something like; the bible says, “By your fruits you will recognize them” (NIV, 1995). We all know that Christendom’s preachers are known for their extravagant and immoral lifestyles so it is obvious that they are not Jehovah’s people. This statement says nothing to prove why they think they have the true religion; all it does is divert one’s attention to Christendom’s preachers and their shortcomings. They are taught to use this fallacy in their ministry school. Their ministry school teaches how to convert other people to their religion. They are told that if the householder brings up an opposing point and it is difficult to convince them, divert their attention to something that is easier, perhaps they will not realize you skirted the issue.
“The Slippery Slope also might well be called the "Appeal to Fear." It shows a proposition to be unacceptable by first stating that acceptance of the proposition will lead to an unacceptable result, and then stating that the unacceptable result will in turn lead to an even more unacceptable result.”(Johnson, 2000) Jehovah’s Witnesses do not believe that you can be saved by merely believing in Jesus Christ. “Modern Christendom, according to the Watchtower Society, believes that a simple statement of faith in Jesus Christ earns salvation and allows the individual to spend the remainder of his or her life in libertine indulgence”. (Barker, 2000) It would be typical for them to make a statement like, “so a person could be a murderer, but as long as they believe in Jesus they will be saved”. They have a very all or nothing attitude. They think everything they believe is the absolute truth and from God, if you challenge anything they say they immediately go into defense mode and they are trained for this.
If you have spent any time, speaking with a Jehovah’s Witness you may have found it to be extremely frustrating. You can prove your point to them with a seemingly overwhelming amount of evidence, but they do not budge. There are a few reasons for this. One reason is if you show them something that seems logical but goes against what they believe, they close their eyes in a figurative sense. It is like going to a scary movie and when a scary part comes, you close your eyes, you know what is going on but you close your eyes and it goes away. It is the same with them. Unless you understand that being a Jehovah’s Witness is not only what they believe, but also that it consumes their entire life. “Most people have a handful of beliefs that are "cast in stone". Jehovah's Witnesses, on the other hand, have an entire thought-system that is inextricably intertwined with their daily lives. It is set up in such a way that if you remove one brick from the edifice, the entire building may tumble. They are well aware of this danger, and thus they cannot allow any of their beliefs to be discussed dispassionately. They have a vested interest in proving to one and all (and especially to themselves) that everything they believe is The Truth (or as close to The Truth as it is humanly possible to know).”(Campbell, 2004) If a person shows them they are wrong and they vocalize their disbelief of any of the doctrines to anyone in their church they will be disfellowshipped, and this means loosing any contact with their friends and family members that are in that church.
When you are a Jehovah’s Witness, you have to give up thinking logically. They are told that everything printed in their literature is from God and that the people that write it are spirit directed. Therefore, if a person says anything against what they believe, that person is a tool that Satan is using to pull them away from the “Truth”, or Jehovah’s Organization. They are not allowed to think for themselves. Independent thinking is strongly discouraged. This would leave a person questioning what he or she has been told and then they may leave. This is how they retain their members, fear.
Jehovah’s Witnesses have always been known for their door-to-door preaching. They are trained very well for it during their many weekly meetings that they must attend. They are fully convinced in what they believe and their salvation depends on telling everyone else, that is why they preach door-to-door zealously. Having experienced this religious cult personally, I have experienced first hand how easy it is to fall prey to their teachings. That is why it is so important for people to use good critical thinking skills when listening to one of them. In this way, a person can spot their logical fallacies in order to prevent being deceived by them, perhaps they can help the Jehovah’s Witness and open their eyes to the real “truth”. -
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Bisexuality Quiz
by JH inhttp://www.golivewire.com/forums/viewquiz.cgi?action=624
you are 90% straight and 10% bisexual.. .
out of the 1646 people who have taken this quiz, the average person is 40% bisexual.
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lv4fer
100% straight
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THANK YOU ALL SOOOOO MUCH
by lv4fer inyou know i'm not sure if i've ever thanked all of you.
thank you simon!!!
when i was coming out 3-4 years ago, i don't know how i could of done it without you all.
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lv4fer
I was in such a state of shock, I didn't use any of the info from the site. I just did my part using the garbage from the society. It was like a ton of brick on my head. I really thought I had the truth, then it all just fell apart. I'm happy for it now but there is no description for the feeling you have. It is like someone rips your world out from under you.
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THANK YOU ALL SOOOOO MUCH
by lv4fer inyou know i'm not sure if i've ever thanked all of you.
thank you simon!!!
when i was coming out 3-4 years ago, i don't know how i could of done it without you all.
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lv4fer
Yes, that is the web-site. It is very well done. I actually stumbled upon it while looking for some info for a part I was putting together for the ministry school. What a rude awakening. After reading that, it gave me the courage to question other things and then I found this web-site and everything just fell apart after that. It took me about a year to stop attending meetings completely.