Posts by MacHislopp

12

3-New Files For You!

by Atlantis in

jw
friends

2019-11-s-77-e-notice of disfellowshipping or disassociation.

https://docdro.id/me8ocou.

2020-01-s-52-e-bi- assignment to view special talk.

MacHislopp

Hello Petra,

many thanks for the files. Many friends in various part of Europe

will be delighted with the material.

Greetings to all - the team - and you,

JC MacHislopp

PS Have a relaxing time, by the river/lake side!

41

147th Gilead prt. 3 - this could stumble people

by neat blue dog in

during gerrit loesch's talk just released, he goes on a long list of the false end times predictions throughout the millennia.

i didn't expect it, but then he goes into the precursors to the bible students who, when their dates failed, changed christ's presence to have happened 'invisibly'.

then it goes right into the jws, and he reads the quote from millions now living will never die about how we can 'confidently expect' the resurrection in 1925, and then the life everlasting book that predicted 1975. of course, he doesn't say how it's still going on, namely with the overlapping generation and its' accompanying convoluted chart, but still, this is more than they've ever said on the subject, especially recently.. it almost sounds like a forced statement, to address any backlash from people reading 'apostate lies' online, because he also says how the gb 'humbly' admitted mistakes, referencing the non-apology after 1975 that disturbed raymond franz.

MacHislopp

Hello neat blue dog ,

thanks for the topic. Very, very interesting !

Please allow me to add the following about the gb member Gerrit Lösch (born 1941)

He was a pioneer since November 1, 1961 and was circuit and district overseer in Austria between 1963 and 1976. In 1965/1966 he was invited to the 41th Gilead class.In 1967 he married to Merete and sometime after that they entered to the Bethel in Vienna, Austria, where he stayed 14 years. In 1993/1994 was called to the world headquarters of Jehovah's Witnesses in Brooklyn, where he worked for the Executive Committee and Service Committee. Gerrit Lösch knows well the WTBS' activities in Europe and speaks German, English, Rumanian and Italian. On July 1, 1994 he was appointed as a member of the WTBS Governing Body..

See also on youtube : https://youtu.be/7R4f9ygxDbk (only 5min 50 sec)

A talk by Gerrit Lösh given in Italian – with english subtitles - during a special Convention on May 22nd ,2005 in the city of Monza, near Milan, Italy. He expresses the official WTBS view on higher education.

By the way, LISTENER , is it possible to have the complete transcript of his talk on the 147th Gilead school graduation?

Greetings to all,

JC MacHislopp

15

How can a building dedicated to God, be sold?

by krismalone in

i was just wondering this morning about all the kingdom halls and branches being sold to "babylon the great" and other businesses.

every single kingdom hall and bethel branch that has been sold was "dedicated to jehovah" by the watchtower corporation.

a special meeting with a guest speaker gives a talk and then offers a prayer dedicating the building to yhwh.

MacHislopp

Hello krismalone,

I do agree with you 100%! Imho you have made an excellent analogy

and what I do like the most is:

" What about Ananias and Saphira who verbally said they dedicated funds to God yet they kept a portion for themselves and God killed them? "

Just think about the million,s and millions of US dollars that the Society

gained -TAX FREE -with all the buildings sales, many "Bethels" all over

the world, thousands of KHalls, and Assebly Halls etc etc.

All dedicated " to Jehovah " ...forever!!!

All the best to you,

JC MacHislopp

19

The Craziness of an Average Bible Study

by Number 6 in

last week i posted a thread asking about who knew any "real anointed" and got some cracking replies.. that got me to thinking, as someone brought up in the 70's and 80's in the watchtower religion, my experience of bible studeis in their homes and those who made it to the hall were mostly batshit crazy or at least people with some serious quirks.. i'll relate a few, none of whose names i remember with any clarity.. in our cong we had an older couple who were from london, but who had been in the 1950's in the circuit work in the mid west usa.

they brought along some woman one night they had started a study with who told everyone cheerfully she was a recovering alcoholic and this was her cure (coming to the meetings).

this went on for a few weeks until one night they brought her to the memorial and she was royally pissed, and i mean barely able to stand; and went up to the platform table and necked some wine.

MacHislopp

Hello everyone,

an interesting post. Ding made an excellent point :

"study would quickly transition from them answering my questions to me answering the WT's questions" Very true indeed.

Allow me to complete the title of the post

“ The Craziness and the Hidden rocks of an Average Bible Study”.

I am not alone in beeing convinced of the importance that every ' baptism candidate' in the Jehovah's Witnesses organization, should be aware of the Legalistic and Judicial aspects of his/her future in the Jws organization. Allo me to explain:

In the early 90's “brother “ Philip Brumley, legal Counsel for the WTBS Inc. dealt with the subject of the WTBS Inc. ***legal right *** to disfellowship a member of any of the Jehovah's Witnesses congregations.

Quote:

“I represent the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York, Inc., the parent organisation of the congregations of Jehovah's Witnesses throughout the United States.

C. Relation between the Congregations and its members.

It is axiomatic that the essence of the relationship of a religious society with its members is held by the courts to be the agreements of the parties, and generally, a profession of faith, adherence to the doctrine of the religious society and submission to its government.

76 C.J.S. Religious Societies 11 (1952).

A party having voluntarily assented to become a member of a congregation thereby nsubjects himself or herself to the existing rules and procedures of said congregation and cannot deny their existence.

All who unite themselves to such a voluntary religious organisation do so with the implied consent to this government and are bound submit to it?"
end of Quote
Quite strong, legalistic words which call for some observations:
°°° Many years ago the term " religious, religion" etc. was referred exclusively to the false " worship "?.but today the recognition of " beeing an organized religion " brings, in many countries?numerous a d v a n t a g e s !
All these ' well couched ' words/expressions but where is Jehovah, and where is Jesus Christ in the matter etc.?
This kind of material/informations, does not appear in any of the WTBS Inc. publications avalaible at the Kingdom Hall, including the ' secret' manual for elders only .

Although clear instructions, about the procedure, in the case of a ' prospective baptism candidate' are given in Watchtower articles like the following one:
*** w96 1/15 17 Jehovah's Sheep Need Tender Care

9 As an unbaptized publisher progresses spiritually, he may make a dedication to God in prayer and want to be baptized. (Compare Mark 1:9-11.) He should make his desire for baptism known to the congregation?s presiding overseer, who will arrange for elders to review with the publisher the questions on pages 175 to 218 of Organized to Accomplish Our Ministry.

The four parts into which the questions are divided may be covered in three sessions by three different elders if possible.

If they agree that the unbaptized publisher has a reasonable understanding of Bible teachings and qualifies in other ways, they will tell him that he may be baptized. As a result of his dedication and baptism, he becomes “markeed” for salvation.”Ezekiel 9:4-6.
*** w89 1/15 17 How Baptism Can Save Us

9 Jehovah?s Witnesses do not follow unscriptural writings, such as that just quoted, but elders do hold discussions with those desiring to be baptized.

Why? To make sure that these persons are believers who meet divine requirements and who have made a dedication to Jehovah. (Acts 4:4; 18:8; 2 Thessalonians 3:2)

Discussing questions in the book Organized to Accomplish Our Ministry helps to determine whether a person qualifies for baptism.
*** w88 6/15 28 Becoming an Ordained Minister-God's Way

To help the new believer further, Christian elders arrange to meet with him and spend time reviewing the basic teachings of the Bible. This, for one thing, assures the elders that the prospective Christian has acquired an accurate knowledge of God's purposes.
In conclusion at which moment the " candidate for baptism " is told of the full implications derived from - becoming a baptized member " ?
At which moment the " candidate for baptism " is told of the full impact of what happens in case - in the future - the baptized person should be guilty of a 'serious sin' and the body of elders, through the action of a 'judicialcommittee, would take any kind of action against him/her.

Does the baptism candidate fully understand the implication and the meaning of a 'judicial committee'?
They need to know – be made aware - that:
*** In all judicial proceedings, in the JW's congregations there are

no public trials, only 3 (or more elders), the accused one, and for only part of the time, any witnesses.
*** No one else is allowed to hear what is said.

*** The witnesses are not required to testify publicly.
*** Contrary to the standard procedure used in any of the nation's courts, where to preserve/safeguard the integrity of the event and eliminate any possible misunderstanding or deliberate mis-representation of the testimony

given, stenographers are employed for the transcription and/or the recording of all the judicial proceedings in all JW's judicial proceeding this is strictly forbidden.

Furthermore, the 'baptismcandidate' has been informed and is fully aware of all the possible implication and the consequences of a judicial decision toward himself/herself, his/her family, close friends, members of the congregation, in case of a - far reaching - decision should be taken by the body of elders?

i..e. shunning, disfellowhipping .-
All this should be clearly explained , well before the 'bible student' begins to ' prepare ' for baptism. Obviously such explanation should not be made in 'a couple of words', but in such a manner which would rule out any possible misunderstanding concerning the practical implications and consequences of becoming affiliated with:

" the theocratic organization of Jehovah's Witnesses and his submission to it. "

Therefore he/she should well known what does it mean in real life, for any Jehovah's Witnesses to be: " shunned " or " disfellowshipped " or "dissociated "!

*** w88 11/15 17 Helping Others to Worship God

9 The two elders will inform the student that when he qualifies for and shares in the field service, he may turn in a field service report and a Congregation?s Publisher Record card will be made out in his name.

This will demonstrate his affiliation with the theocratic organization of Jehovah?s Witnesses and his submission to it. (This would also be true of all others turning in field service reports.)

Final questionn oes the " bible s t u d e n t " understand, grasps the implication of the WTBS Inc. 3 key words :
*** A F F I L I A T I O N

*** S U B M I S S I O N

***O R G A N I Z A T I O N

Hoping that this could be useful,

Greetings, JC Mac Hislopp

8

2019--2020-- 3 New Files For You!

by Atlantis in

jw
friends

2019-12-12-special preaching campaign in central london.

https://docdro.id/r8mfxeh.

2020 london campaign application form.

MacHislopp

Hello Petra ,

I hope you and all ' th eteam' are doing fine.I'm still recovering but

much better now/

These few lines are to thank you for the "excellent documentation

which is always provided. I do share all these items with many friends

all over Europe.

With a sincere appreciation,

J.C. MacHislopp

67

W5 Investigation

by Christian Gutierrez in

jw
friends

hey guys!

i just want you guys to know that today is a really great day.

there are so many jehovah's witnesses that saw this documentary and were disgusted by watchtowers policy.

MacHislopp

Hello Christian and Katja,

Very good video and very, very true.

Thank you for sharing of sad and painful moments

of your life.

Many in Europe are seeing it. Keep on.

Many greetings,

JC Mac Hislopp

.

18

"We never solicit donations" - really?

by doubtfull1799 in

inspired by this weeks clam article which again "reminds" the brothers pdf their obligation/privilege to donate "voluntarily" i have complied a list of articles or videos in the last 5 years where donations are indeed solicited or encouraged.

the society may argue that these are not actual solicitations because no plate was passed around.

but a donation box is just a more discrete and subtle version of the plate.

MacHislopp

Hello D1799 and all the others,

many thanks for the excellent research. Very useful

in contrast with the statement "we will never beg nor solicit for funds..."

Pinocchio at his best...!

Greetings to all

JC MacHislopp

33

Years REALLY DO FLY BY!

by somebody in

jw
friends

i just realized that i was 39 years old when i joined this discussion board.

i remember the morning conversations that always brought me laughter, and i think there were only a but about 9 or 10 regulars back then!

i will now turn 57 years old in a few months.

MacHislopp

Hello everyone and expecially to Somebody.

I'm very pleased to hear fom you again.

It was quite a while ago!

Greetings,

J.C. MacHislopp

(...just clowly recovering from a difficult moment)

30

WARWICK

by Phoebe in

jw
friends

as it's highly unlikely i'll ever go to warwick, i found lloyd evans latest video fascinating.

i had no idea that the whole 'museum' (if you can call it that) was so big.

notice the credit card machines by the entrance.

MacHislopp

Hello everyone;

having read the comments so far and seeing the video (informative ...above all),

I wish to thank Cedar (John) for all his hard work.

For years he has done a lot to r e v e a l the "truth" behind the WTBS New York

mighty corporation and many of its shady deals and ...lies.

The more exposed the better !

Keep up your excellent work together with your team!!

All the best,

J.C. MacHislopp

18

Question about dfed relatives

by awake!watcher in

jw
friends

does anyone know if there is a wt reference that says associating with a dfed relative is a conscience matter?

i am asking because someone is trying to cause trouble and i was hoping there was an article i could point to to shut them up..

MacHislopp

Hello awake!watcher and all the others,

These below are the Society’s Governing Body directive/rules applicable – since the year 2010 – and to be followed by the BOE in all congregations worldwide.

The material is take from the Elder’s manual entitled :

“Shepherd the Flock of God”—1 Peter 5:2 published in 2010 (Printing edition 2012)

°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°

Matters Related to

Disfellowshipped and

Disassociated Ones

Make yearly visits on those who qualify

Permit them to obtain personal literature at the

Kingdom Hall

Assist those having undue association with disfellowshipped

or disassociated relatives

6. If members of the congregation are known to have undue association with disfellowshipped or disassociated relatives who are not in the

household, elders should counsel and reason with

those members of the congregation from the Scriptures.

Review with them information from the “God’s Love” book, pages 207-208;

The Watchtower of April 15, 1988, pages 26-30; or the article “Display

Christian Loyalty When a Relative Is Disfellowshipped” in the August 2002

Our Kingdom Ministry.

If it is clear that a Christian is violating the spirit of the disfellowshipping decree in this regard and does not respond to counsel, it may be that he would not qualify for congregation privileges, which require one to be exemplary. He would not be dealt with judicially unless there is persistent spiritual association or he openly criticizes the disfellowshipping decision.

116 “Shepherd the Flock of God”—1 Peter 5:2

°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°

Notice the wording, and surely the BOE will apply very scrictly. I do hope this quote might help.

Greetings to all,

J.C. MacHislopp