He might find this for you to read
Awake 1972 May 8th, pages 27-28
?Your Word Is Truth?
When Did Babylon Desolate Jerusalem?
SECULAR historians usually give the year 586 B.C.E. as the correct date for the desolation of Jerusalem. Why, then, do Jehovah?s Christian witnesses speak of this event as occurring in 607 B.C.E.? It is because of confidence in what the Bible says about the duration of Jerusalem?s lying desolate.
The Scriptures assign a period of seventy years to the desolation of Judah and Jerusalem. After describing the Babylonian conquest of Jerusalem, 2 Chronicles 36:21 reports: ?All the days of lying desolated it kept sabbath, to fulfill seventy years.? By means of his prophet Jeremiah, Jehovah had declared: ?All this land must become a devastated place, an object of astonishment, and these nations will have to serve the king of Babylon seventy years.??Jer. 25:11.
Was this really a period of seventy literal years? Yes, that is the way the prophet Daniel, toward the close of the period of Jerusalem?s desolation, understood it, saying: ?I myself, Daniel, discerned by the books the number of the years concerning which the word of Jehovah had occurred to Jeremiah the prophet, for fulfilling the devastations of Jerusalem, namely, seventy years.? (Dan. 9:2) Note that here Daniel speaks of the ?number of the years? of devastation as seventy. Surely he could not have done so if the seventy years were symbolic or an inflated round number.
Additional evidence is provided in the book of Zechariah. We read: ?When you fasted and there was a wailing in the fifth month and in the seventh month, and this for seventy years, did you really fast to me, even me?? (Zech. 7:5; 1:12) The way this question is framed, with reference to specific months, certainly indicates that a period of seventy literal years was involved.
That the Jews in ancient times understood the seventy years as being literal and involving a total devastation of the land is apparent from the works of Josephus, a Jewish historian. In his Antiquities of the Jews, Book X, chap. 9, par. 7, he tells that ?all Judea and Jerusalem, and the temple, continued to be a desert for seventy years.?
When the Israelites were able to return to Judah and Jerusalem, that desolation ended. There is general agreement that Babylon fell to Cyrus on October 5/6, 539 B.C.E. From the Scriptural record at 2 Chronicles 36:21-23 and Ezra 3:1-3, which tells of Cyrus? decree liberating the Jews and their return to their homeland, the indications are that the Jews arrived back in their homeland around the early part of October of 537 B.C.E., ending the seventy years of desolation. Jerusalem must, therefore, have been destroyed seventy years earlier, in 607 B.C.E.
Various attempts to harmonize the date 586 B.C.E. with what the Bible says are therefore unsatisfactory. None of such attempts fit the Bible?s testimony that Jerusalem and Judah lay desolate for seventy years.
The 586 B.C.E. date is based primarily on what is known as ?Ptolemy?s Canon,? which assigns a total of 87 years to the Babylonian dynasty beginning with Nabopolassar and ending with Nabonidus at the fall of Babylon in 539 B.C.E. According to this Canon, the five kings that ruled during this period were Nabopolassar (21 years), Nebuchadnezzar (43 years), Evil-merodach (2 years), Neriglissar (4 years) and Nabonidus (17 years). In line with the number of years thus assigned to each ruler, Jerusalem?s desolation in Nebuchadnezzar?s eighteenth year (nineteenth year if counting from his ?accession year?) would fall in 586 B.C.E.?2 Ki. 25:8; Jer. 52:29.
But how dependable is Ptolemy?s Canon? In his book The Mysterious Numbers of the Hebrew Kings, Professor E. R. Thiele writes:
?Ptolemy?s canon was prepared primarily for astronomical, not historical, purposes. It did not pretend to give a complete list of all the rulers of either Babylon or Persia, nor the exact month or day of the beginning of their reigns, but it was a device which made possible the correct allocation into a broad chronological scheme of certain astronomical data which were then available. Kings whose reigns were less than a year and which did not embrace the New Year?s day were not mentioned.? (Italics ours.)
So the very purpose of the Canon makes absolute dating by means of it impossible. There is no way to be sure that Ptolemy was correct in assigning a certain number of years to various kings. For example, while Ptolemy credits Evil-merodach with only two years of rule, Polyhistor assigns him twelve years. Then, too, one cannot be certain that just five kings ruled during this period. At Borsippa, for instance, were found names of a number of Babylonian kings that do not appear elsewhere.
Nevertheless, someone may ask, Is there not an ancient astronomical tablet, ?VAT 4956,? that places the thirty-seventh year of Nebuchadnezzar?s reign exactly in the same year as does Ptolemy?s Canon?
It should not be overlooked that the source of corroborative evidence should bear the earmarks of dependability. Can this be said about ?VAT 4956?? Not really. The text is not an original and it contains numerous gaps. Certain terms found therein cannot even be understood now. Twice in the text the notation hi-bi (meaning ?broken off, obliterated?) appears. Thereby the scribe acknowledged that he was working from a defective copy.
Even if, despite these problems, the astronomical information presents a true picture of the original, this would not establish the correctness of the historical data. As Ptolemy used the reigns of ancient kings (as he understood them) simply as a framework in which to place astronomical data, so the copyist of ?VAT 4956? may, in line with the chronology accepted in his time, have inserted the ?thirty-seventh year of Nebuchadnezzar.? As admitted by the German scholars Neugebauer and Weidner (the translators of this text), the scribe evidently changed words to conform with the abbreviated terminology common in his day. But he was both inconsistent and inaccurate. So he could just as easily have inserted other information to suit his purposes. Hence both Ptolemy?s Canon and ?VAT 4956? might even have been derived from the same basic source. They could share mutual errors.
Opposed to Ptolemy?s Canon and ?VAT 4956? stands the unanimous testimony of Jeremiah, Zechariah, Daniel and the writer of 2 Chronicles, that Judah and Jerusalem lay desolate for seventy years. Thousands of ancient manuscripts of these writings contain the identical testimony. So, because of the problems inherent in Ptolemy?s Canon and ?VAT 4956,? it takes more faith to accept them than it does to accept the Bible?s testimony, which would place the desolation of Jerusalem by the Babylonians in 607 B.C.E.
[Footnotes]
For additional details, see the book Aid to Bible Understanding, pp. 327, 331, 339, 348.
Mamacat
JoinedPosts by Mamacat
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27
Gave 586/587 evidence to elder today
by SeymourButts ini decided to take the big gamble today and stopped to visit an elder relative of mine.
the gamble wasn't the visit, but what i did while there.
i am many years da'd, but still have a fairly good relationship with most of my family.
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Mamacat
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Making new friends after fading
by M@el5trom inwhat are some good methods for finding and making new friends after fading away?
i know this is critical to help myself and my wife to move on, and we both have suffered from depression partly because we are isolated to each other for now.
we are good friends, but we both feel the need for others also.
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Mamacat
We recently moved to a new area, and I've found people here through a group on www.meetup.com They have all kinds of groups on there for different interests.
I mostly look for and hang out with other moms so my 3-year-old gets some interaction with other kids, and I do too. I've seen couples groups on there and tons of other more specific interest groups.
Maybe you could invite someone over for dinner from work? I know someone my husband works with is having a wrestlemania (I think that's the name) party and invited a bunch of people over for the day to watch it on pay-per-view. -
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What is the WORST TEACHING of Jehovah's Witness religion?
by yesidid in.
i have my ideas, but i am very interested to know yours.
yesidid
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Mamacat
The whole "worldly" thing always bothered me. Growing up thinking that everyone is not a JW is going to die "very soon."
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Question for other Parents....
by rwagoner inhowdy all.... .
i have a 6 yo son who is in the first grade.
he was born 10 weeks preemie, was an only child up until about 6 months ago and spends a lot of time with adults - especially me...his goofy but loving dad.
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Mamacat
The role playing really helped my oldest son, who used to shy away from talking to most kids. He's worn glasses since he was 2. Even with adults, it was the first thing they always mentioned when talking to him, and then my son began thinking of himself as "the kid with glasses". We rehearsed things he would say if someone made fun of them, and it worked for him. He was going through a phase where he didn't want to wear them to school, and I discovered it was because of teasing. He would say something like "Well I do like them, because they help me see better," and then try to talk about something else to get the focus off his glasses.
Actually, when Harry Potter came out, other kids would tell him he looked just like him, except with blond hair. Since the kids liked Harry Potter, they didn't think of glasses as being so weird anymore.
Good luck with your son. Maybe there is something he is being teased about and that's why he shies away from the kids at school? Or maybe the teacher treats him differently? I ask my boys about different kids in their class and try to gauge their observations of them. You will be able to tell who is being mean or teasing them by the answers. -
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Question for other Parents....
by rwagoner inhowdy all.... .
i have a 6 yo son who is in the first grade.
he was born 10 weeks preemie, was an only child up until about 6 months ago and spends a lot of time with adults - especially me...his goofy but loving dad.
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Mamacat
Your son sounds mature for his age to me, and there's nothing wrong with that! It seems everyone wants to label everyone with a disorder anymore.
I have an 8 year old son who loves TMNT, and my 10 year old loves Harry Potter. When the first HP movie came out, all his friends were talking about it, and he must have been in the first grade then. Your son sounds well rounded to me.
I taught my sons to make friends/conversation by saying "What's your name? My name is ...." Then, "I really like your (bookbag, t-shirt)" LOL It sounds lame, but it worked. My sons would then speak to kids who had on a character or something they liked, and they had things in common..which is important in becoming friends. Maybe he just needs a little help with what to talk to the other kids about. We used to "rehearse" how to start a conversation.
My youngest son is 3, and he is way into the Robots now, and other kids his age don't seem amused when he starts talking like a robot. Personally, I think it's cute, but they give him the "you're weird" look lol But, he also likes trains and firetrucks and race cars...things most of them like. Once they change the game they are playing to something like trains, he goes out of Robot mode and into whatever they are doing.
Part of being friends is accepting each other differences and similarities, and in the future, those other kids will overlook that he likes something they don't like.
Maybe you could help him find other kids that like some of the same things he does, though. -
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Question for those who work in food service...
by Elsewhere intoday i went out to get lunch at a little shop that sells sandwiches.
i got one, but they were closing so i could not eat it there.
i decided to go to a nearby barns & noble bookstore with a starbucks style cafe.
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Mamacat
I don't know that it is against the health code, but in many places, all businesses have the right to refuse service to anyone they choose for any (or no) reason.
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Is Organized Religion Something You'd Be Involved In Again?
by minimus indo you believe in christianity, the bible, god-----or are you in the "i'm not sure what to think" class?
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Mamacat
I do believe in God. I like to think he is a loving spirit though, and so I don't truly believe most of the Old Testament represents the God I believe in.
For a long time after leaving the JW's, I didn't pray or speak about God at all. Lately, I have found myself praying for people who I think I need help and asking Him to keep my kids safe, etc.
I've been toying with the idea of attending a local Christian chapel here. I've spoken to the pastor, and the church seems liberal and more in line with what I believe than any organized religion. I'd like my sons to learn about God and Jesus, and I'd like to feel that I can be forgiven for my sins in the present time. We'll see where it goes though. -
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Question for those raised a JW
by New Worldly Translation ini was wondering if anybody feels like i do that if i hadn't been raised a jw i would never have embraced the religion.
i know it's easier to say in hindsight after i know the truth about the org but honestly i don't think i would have given them the time of day.
i'm not a religious person or even a spiritual person and being a jw always caused a conflict in my mind.
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Mamacat
I don't think I would have ever bought into their "truth."
I take the logical approach to things, not emotional. I've always believed if something sounds too good to be true, it probably isn't.
No one in my family other than the JW's are religious. I can't see myself thinking of God first in every situation.
I probably would have been polite to any who came to my door, though, at least at first. I like to read, so I can see me taking magazines if they seemed interesting. -
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What was the most INTENSE thing a householder did to you while in Service
by GetBusyLiving inwhen i was about 10 years old me and my service partner called on a guy that came to the door with a shotgun.
he just said in the most deadpan voice you can ever imagine: ""if you don't get off my doorstep within the next 30 seconds im going to have to use this.
" that was some scary shit.. we bolted.
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Mamacat
This man came to the door, and he was having a good conversation with my mom. Then, he said he had just gotten out of prison for attempted murder, and he was looking for God. When I heard 'prison' and 'murder', I got scared, and I took a step backwards from his door, which caused me to fall backwards down the stairs, and my skirt was around my waist. I was so embarrassed, so I excused myself to sit in the car.
Maybe my reaction was a bit rude, but I'd never met anyone who had been in prison before. I got spanked for it and told not to judge people. My mom had a return visit with him for some time, and I dreaded going with her to that man's house. -
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Did You Feel Stupid Going From House To House??
by minimus indid you just hate going door to door or were you one of the few that loved the work?
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Mamacat
I felt like an idiot. I used to just wish if someone opened the door, they just wouldn't try to argue any doctrine with me, because I didn't know the answers. If I had to waiver from my rehearsed presentation, I was screwed.