these words were done to death when i was a witness.
is it still a popular turn of phrase?
later it was slightly changed to "your bible trained conscience".
ISP, Your thinking is excellent. Why then did none of us follow this line with JW authorities? Why didn't we just say, "I'm sorry so & so, but I feel this or that course is right by Jehovah". e.g. celebrating birthdays for example. You almost make me think that we are partly to blame for letting them dictate to us the way they did.
Marilyn
for weeks now, i've been trying to put together a disassociation letter - incidently, it's you lot that have put me up to this - and it's nearing completion but i'm feeling nervous about sending it.
the fast approaching christmas celebration thingymajig is kinda egging me on as i want to blaze christmas lights everywhere and not feel nervous about the possibility of a visit from the po who drops the mags in to me fortnightly (i'm generally 'not in' ... ahem ...).
i would appreciate your for's and against's - to either convince me to go ahead, or to think again and stay the execution ...
Don't DA yourself! But don't expect to slip away unscathed either. Me and hubby tried that, but they came after us 2 yrs down the track and d'fd us. Now, had I been a bit more careful in what I said to my siblings, I think I'd have got away with it and still been included in family gatherings to this day. I paid a huge price for shooting my mouth off about my disillusionment with the WTS. With the wisdom of hindsight, I'd still slip away, but I'd watch what I said and to whom I said it. It's really no big deal to keep your opinions to yourself, as they don't get what you say anyway.
Remember this too that DA and DF are one and the same thing. The end result is the same and they don't afford honour to anyone who leaves, no matter how they leave. So just play them along and keep the peace and maybe one day you will have a chance to help someone you love on the inside.
Marilyn
i'm feeling silly, so here's some of my favourite silly uk place names, courtesy of http://www.jump-around.com/tools/place-names/.
assloss.
balls cross.
In Hong Kong they have Fuk Yuen Street!
i was looking for the scripture about who will inherit god's kingdom and can't find it because i packed up all my books and stored them.
is there mention of gluttony being one of the things that will keep you out?
proverbs 23:20 says a drunkard and a glutton will come to proverty.. proverbs 28:7 says one having companionship with a flutton humiliates his father.. so if i can't take blood transfusions, be a drunkard, lie with same sex people, etc.
Judith, I have a friend who was disfellowshipped for reviling. How often is reviling cited as a reason for d'fing? I suggest to you that if the elders don't like a person enough, they will find a reason to disfellowhip that person. unfortunately most people the elders don't like are not fat so they can't use gluttony against them. In the case of my friend, according to the elders he reviled his ex wife, who incidentally had had an adulterous affair with a brother and divorced my friend and claimed half my friends considerable wealth. Usually reviling is expected in such circumstances, but the elders chose to disfellowhip my friend, basically because he was wealthy and they weren't!
Marilyn (I hope you understood all that - it's such a weird story, but every word of it is true and shattered a life! The good news is that it finally helped my old jw friend to see the truth about the truth!)
these words were done to death when i was a witness.
is it still a popular turn of phrase?
later it was slightly changed to "your bible trained conscience".
:::::::::I think what has been so healing since I stopped going is the way my conscience is more attuned to what seems wrong and what seems right.
ARoarer, this has been the case for me too. I very much liked this point.
Marilyn
these words were done to death when i was a witness.
is it still a popular turn of phrase?
later it was slightly changed to "your bible trained conscience".
These words were done to death when I was a witness. Is it still a popular turn of phrase? Later it was slightly changed to "your Bible trained conscience". Which really meant WTS trained brain. We were supposed to do everything according to our conscience which was meant to imply freedom to decide what felt right for us as individuals. Nothing could be further from the truth. The only thing that felt right was if we did exactly what they (strongly) suggested we should do. And if our conscience misdirected us we could look forward to being on the recieving end of some dirty looks at best and some stiff 'admonition' from the elders at worst. Was there anything at all that was actually left to our conscience?
Marilyn
back in the 70's, when i was df'd for associating with other df'd people, a lot of us recently df'd ones met up for a mini apostofest at sandy balls in the new forest.. we had a great time, lots of barbies, lots of wine, lots of folk songs by bob dylan,tom paxton and harvey andrews.
we could all strum a few chords too.
her ladyship could bring me to tears with her rendition of cat steven's father and son.. there were also some other common factors besides the folk singing and wine drinking.
Hey Kent, I'll have to look out the photo of David and me sitting on his bright red Bug Eyed Sprite, with our witnessing uniform on. My skirt was regulation knee length! "They" didn't like to tell us to dump the car as we were so new in. I think we must be the exception to the rule - we had the car when we came in. My two brothers also had sports cars. We all had to ditch them in the end though. It was sooooooooooo sad. One of my brothers has since bought another one and he's an elder. I sure hope Englishman is right that it's a sign. David bought a 1956 MGA five years ago, but we were already OUT 15 yrs by then. A 15 yr overdue act of rebellion? Hardly. More like an attempt to capture our lost youth (lost to the WTS!)
Marilyn
the wt organization claims that its organization was formed by the faithful and discrete of jesus christ and therefore formed by holy men of god.. they also say that all other religions are not from god but from the devil to deceive the rest of mankind.. so in essence they claim to be the only organization on earth that has holy men of god in it, the rest are from the devil.. so what do you think of this organization when it disfellowships from itself other holy men of god and proceeds to call them apostates, wicked and evil?.
do they lose their holy man status for doing that?.
if someone lived a trillion x longer than you, and had a billion x more reasoning ability would he come to the same conclusions as you?.
:::::::::::::::So what do you think of this organization when it disfellowships from itself other holy men of God and proceeds to call them apostates, wicked and Evil?
Don't forget that Jehovah's Witnesses claim to have existed prior to 1874, in fact according to them there have been faithful/holy men & women down thru the ages since Jesus's time. They just weren't called Jehovah's Witnesses. Neither did they believe everything Jehovah's Witnesses believe - probably less than 10% of it in fact. However, ignoring how "apostate" these men and women were, in their beliefs, JWs claim them as their own when they are put on the spot about why JWs only came into existence in 1874. Usual double think meal from the F & D class.
Marilyn
who really fit this description of apostasy?.
*** w80 8/1 17-22 remain "solid in the faith" ***.
remain solid in the faith.
Dear Francios, You said: "It means a falling away from a proveable religious truth". I have never come across any proveable religious truth. I've certainly come across truck loads of religious viewpoints, all of which are proveable to those expounding them. IMO truth is in the eye of the beholder.
Marilyn
by all means, spend 4 bucks and get the december issue.
of life extension magazine!
(unless life doesn't.
Hi Metatron, the reduction of calories is quite a lot if I recall? I saw a program about it recently. Even the scientists doing the research say they can't reduce their intake sufficiently - though there is one guy who's been on the diet over 5 yrs and is giving good chemistry results. He's pretty miserable though - I saw him interviewed when he first started out on the program - he was a lot more enthusiastic then than he was in the interview a few months ago. I think his girl friend stuffs down Big Macs in front of him. He's only allowed something like 1200 or 1500 caloreis a day (forgotten which is which for males and females).
My parents adopted a cat from uncaring neighbours. It had gone hungry for years. Even then my parents didn't lavish it with food. The cat lived till she was about 23 or more. She may have gone longer but in recent years they used to be quite generous with her food. I put it down to her eating sparsely during her life.
Marilyn
