Marilyn

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Posts by Marilyn

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  17

  The LOVE problem

  by Mazza in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  why is practising "love" so difficult for christians?

  given the theme of the bible is about love and given that christians are constantly expounding the virtues of believing, why is there such a problem following this most basic of christian teachings?

  it's a huge problem, apart from isolated instances of exceptional goodness which are found radomly occuring throughout all humanity - christians do not have a good track record with this most simple concept of their belief system.

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  Marilyn

  A Inquiry, trust me I could match you story for story of terrible totally unchristian, unloving behavior within my particular corner of Watchtowerdom. I didn't see thru WT doctrines, with their blindingly obvious faults. I just had a gut full of people behaving contrary to what they stood for. I watched it year after year and at some point I said to myself "wait a minute.....?". I just couldn't hack the attention to scripture that bore no resemblence to the outcome. I decided that we were no better than the others and in fact it we were very likely worse (if my congregation was representative). And though there were a few real sweeties in the Org, some of those "taking the lead" set the worst example.

  I'm twenty years "out" and am generally oblidging, non-bitchy with no need for hypocritical behavior. I have the occassional laugh at some one else's expense if they are deserving or acting like a pratt!, but generally I don't have to interact with nasty mean spirited people, the way I did as a WT slave. So I was just wondering why christians find love or even decency, so difficult?

  Marilyn
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  10

  How Do You Handle Hypocrisy?

  by GinnyTosken in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  how do you handle hypocrisy?

  appears in the november 15, 2001 watchtower.

  the article intrigues me because instead of a clear-cut condemnation of hypocrisy, the article wavers back and forth.. first, the writer defines hypocrisy:.

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  Marilyn

  It would be good to see them differentiate between 'theocratic warfare' and hypocrisy. A Questions from Readers or a Young People Ask perhaps?

  Marilyn
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  17

  The LOVE problem

  by Mazza in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  why is practising "love" so difficult for christians?

  given the theme of the bible is about love and given that christians are constantly expounding the virtues of believing, why is there such a problem following this most basic of christian teachings?

  it's a huge problem, apart from isolated instances of exceptional goodness which are found radomly occuring throughout all humanity - christians do not have a good track record with this most simple concept of their belief system.

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  Marilyn

  Dear Inquiry, Since posting my question about love, I've changed countries (can you believe I'm sitting at this board rather than unpacking?). I thought I better check to see if I had any more comments (24 hours on) and found yours. I haven't even finished reading it all yet, but will as soon as I let you know WOW so far! I want to post this before you Americans are tucked up in bed. So hope my password is the same. (Its been a while since I've posted from here!). Here goes..

  Marilyn (Mazza)
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  32

  Comparison of Mormonism and JWism

  by alex in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i'm thinking that the mind-control games are very very very very much the same between mormonism and jwism.

  i've lurked here for a while and thought i'd introduce myself.

  my name is alex and i'm an unbelieving mormon who lives in utah.

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  Marilyn

  Hi I'm an exjw of many years. I have recently been in discussions with a Mormon lady from Utah, who's been trying to help me to know her God. In the end she asked me to meditate quietly for an hour each day and try to tune into God in order to get a response from him. She's been pretty careful to avoid commenting on Satan or other weird stuff (I spose there is plenty of time for that later) - but I was interested that she thinks I'll get divine inspiration by meditating and praying. I told her I couldn't do it as it represented surrender - and relinguishing control of my mind. I don't really know what happens when you do this, but I presume self delusion sets in and you start imagining all kinds of stuff.

  I'm really interested to hear about the Mormons and what they believe. For some reason I always thought they were more harmless than JWs. Maybe not?

  Marilyn
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  14

  Change another's views -- or not?

  by CPiolo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a short while ago, maximus and a few others were discussing the ethics of tying to influence another regarding their belief system.

  many came down on the side of caution, if not downright abstention.

  if a person lived in a vacuum, i might be inclined to agree.

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  Marilyn

  :::::::::As a matter of fact several have privately asked if you are
  available for some commericals!

  My fee is: A good meal x 4, and 2 of your good bottles of Californian wine!!! (that's 2.5 glasses each - hardly enough do you think?)

  Danny, I'm not sure you have my current email address. This is it incase you want to get in touch when I'm not around here for a while. [email protected] I always enjoy your perspective on so many issues and feel we have much in common. Isn't it annoying that so many of us exjws get on so well, and yet we're spread all over the damned planet!!??

  love M.
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  14

  Change another's views -- or not?

  by CPiolo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a short while ago, maximus and a few others were discussing the ethics of tying to influence another regarding their belief system.

  many came down on the side of caution, if not downright abstention.

  if a person lived in a vacuum, i might be inclined to agree.

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  Marilyn

  Oh DannyB, it's always so nice to see you! (figuratively)

  The wine district of California sounds wonderful. I'd be seriously interested to see if you Americans are keeping pace with us Aussies. :-) I've drunk plenty of French wine (hell, why be modest? I've tried Chilian, Italian, Spanish, German, American, Portuguese, NZ and Aussie wines aplenty ) and I wouldn't give you tuppence for French wine. Cept their champers of course. They make the best champagne!! I'm not sure if we don't develop a taste for our own countries wine. I think Australian wine is superb and better than all the rest. But is that because it suits the Australian lifestyle, diet etc? Sadly I'm off wine at the moment. I'm begining to think there are no pleasures left in life! Enjoyable food is bad for my HDL or LDL or whatever the L it is!!! And before you say sex - that's not as good without some wining and dining first!! (yeah I know you men think these are unnecessary optional extras - but us ladies like some romance as a side serve!!)

  With regards how contageous JWism is - as with disease, there has to be a predisposition (a mutant gene). Looks like your family should get tested - they might have developed a vaccine for it?!! I should do a count of my lot. We aren't too far behind you. What ticks me off is when I find the really intelligent ones (I'm thinking my cousin's husband) has now come on board. I would never have thought it. There is only one cousin left in the whole bloody lot of them who hasn't succumbed (besides me who succumbed but didn't stay the distance). Oh, and one niece has quit. Mmmm, thinks are looking up!!!

  Marilyn
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  14

  Change another's views -- or not?

  by CPiolo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a short while ago, maximus and a few others were discussing the ethics of tying to influence another regarding their belief system.

  many came down on the side of caution, if not downright abstention.

  if a person lived in a vacuum, i might be inclined to agree.

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  Marilyn

  ::::::::::::::Nobody just wakes up someday and decides to become a member of this religion, including
  many people who were 'born' into it. Something is missing in their life, and they think the Witnesses
  have it. Does this person feel (rightly or wrongly) that they are not loved enough, that their opinions
  and feelings don't matter enough?

  Dear gsark, I think you and I hold totally opposing opinions. I hope I don't offend you by expressing mine. IF people become JWs or whatever, because of something lacking in their lives, how do you explain pockets of JWs (or whoever) in our communities? These pockets consist of relatives, husbands or wives of JWs and their children. Then there are their neighbours and friends - I converted my neighbour and my work mate and my boyfriend - all of whom were regular people, who had the unfortunate expience of knowing me. Me being a magnetic personality who went to town on them!!! My boy friend (now husband of many years, is one of the most stable people (a professor of education) I've ever met. As smart as he was at the time, he had no previous experience to call on to protect himself from a pretty young woman who he hoped to have sex with, if he just played his cards rightl. I droned on and on and on and then some, and eventually I turned his mind. You've seen the routine in operation? He objected, I ignored his objections - and kept repeating the same crap until he became familiar with it and eventually the familiarity became confused with reality. And my poor boy friend was in!! or under or hooked!! The funny thing is that ten years later when I told him I was having difficulties with it - he, an MS, just said that's ok, cause I am too. He was happy to leave just as easily as he was talked into it.

  Personally I think we all possess the qualities of vulnerability and mood disorders etc that could be blamed on our willingness to join a cult. But more than anything, I believe it's a case of being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Other people get conned out of money, or into marrying unwisely or into wrong careers or into buying houses - into all sorts of things. Being converted to JWism was just our bad luck. No weaknesses, just bad luck, bad timing, and too bad.

  Marilyn
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  14

  Change another's views -- or not?

  by CPiolo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a short while ago, maximus and a few others were discussing the ethics of tying to influence another regarding their belief system.

  many came down on the side of caution, if not downright abstention.

  if a person lived in a vacuum, i might be inclined to agree.

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  Marilyn

  Dear CP, I thoroughly enjoyed reading your post. Perhaps you're not 100% correct in your opinions - but I don't know who is. I just enjoyed your willingness to see both sides. I'm so sorry for your situation - another thought might be that even if you can get thru to your wife re the problems with her religion, there isn't something trouble free waiting here on the outside for her to join up to. Life is difficult - whether you are deluded by religion or not. I'm speaking as one who left the Org with my husband twenty years ago, when our children were very little. My husband is a Phd academic, with a load of commonsense to boot. I'm a fairly sensible person and our son and daughter appear to have turned out halfway decent! We are comfortably off, and thus far in good health. Just the same, life requires concentration and enginuity. It's no picnic for many. Sometimes I wish I had some delusion left to me, but all I have is my 5.30 glass of wine, which I'm not even supposed to partake of because of a family medical condidtion. :-(

  I'm beginning to think that we need more practical advice for people coming out of our old religion. Coping skills by psychologists, exercise regimes to help cope with the anxiety of reality, and financial advice for those who are hopelessly behind. And yes I even think that for many, it's best we leave them where they are - as the transition is just too hard.

  Marilyn
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  21

  The WTs Biggest Deceptions

  by individual in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i was just wondering what do the members of this board think the biggest deception in the teaching of the watchtower society is?.

  one of the biggest deceptions for me, one that stuck like a thorn in my side was their deception on earthquakes, hence my previous thread on the last days.

  the wts, as i recall, published supposed proof of the increase in earthquakes since 1914. i was so angry when i found out that this was an outright lie.

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  Marilyn

  The one that did it for me was "by the love you have amongst yourselves, all will know you are my disciples". I thought that if this is true then I'm in the wrong religion. There is more pettiness, jealousy, intolerance, judgmentalism, unforgiving attitudes and back biting than in any other community group that I've had experience with.

  Marilyn
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  16

  When did y'all find all this stuff out?

  by bigboi in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  was it before you left or after you left and what promtped your investigation?.

  for me it happened a few days before christmas of last yr. it was right after my roommate purchased his computer.

  i looked up jehovah on ms encarta, clicked on a link and as they say the rest is history.. i had just lost my job so i was able to spend a lot of time researching and looking into all kinds of shit.

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  Marilyn

  Just like larc, our departure predated computers. I'm just so darned proud of me and hubby for seeing thru it without any assistance from anyone. It took many years of sitting thru every meeting and getting mad about some of the ignorance biggotary and stupidity. Eventually I told my husband how I was feeling and instead of him disagreeing with me, he added a whole new list of doubts to mine. We both instantly doubled our doubts by chatting with each. There was a lot of months of talking and confusion and procrastination on our part, but once we started to see the light, there was no closing it out. The only real problem was breaking the habit of ten years of WT routine. We told people that something about our teachings didn't sit right with us - that we were acting on our gut feelings. It was like a set of scales where the level of doubts was far outweighing the level of belief. We went thru the motions for a fair while after we were pretty sure it was wrong - so when we finally stopped, we were very sure of ourselves.

  That was in 1979!!!! We got on line in 1996 and immediately looked up JWs. Wow - we then learnt the extent of the WT con.

  Marilyn

  Marilyn