ScenicViewer

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Posts by ScenicViewer

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  41

  Returning to God - For those with minds of Reason

  by mankkeli in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  this was taken from a watchtower study article and without doubt, i am definitely sure it will be beneficial for the majority here: now take your spoon and approach the table, the food is ready.. .

  returning to god.

  13 those who see themselves in the position of the prodigal son, however, need not remain in this wretched state.

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  ScenicViewer
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  21

  The "Generation." what is the latest New Light Regarding It? CO from Fresno Area Confused Me!

  by AvocadoJake in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the co who is covering the central valley, mentioned how easy this concept is to understand.

  in his talk, he said many of the friends had made a "big deal, over little.

  he used the "titanic analogy, used the space shuttle analogy.

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  ScenicViewer

  I am not familiar with the Titanic and Space Shuttle analogies. I would be interested in hearing more about them.

  However there have been 6 understandings of what the 'Generation' is in Watchtower history.

  1) From C.T. Russell's time.

  A generation of contemporaries, "people living contemporaneously ... In other words the signs mentioned will occur within a generation - epoch in the close of an age" (Studies in the Scriptures, Vol 4, p. 602, 603)

  2) From Judge Rutherford's time.

  The anointed. "The irresistible conclusion therefore is that Jesus referred to the new creation [the anointed] when he said: "This generation will not pass away..." ...some members of the new creation will be on earth at the time of Armageddon" (W 2-15-1927, p. 62)

  3) From the early 1950s.

  The 1914 generation. Those born before (later changed to during) 1914. "Some persons living A.D. 1914 when the series of events began will also be living when the series ends with Armageddon. All the events will come within the span of a generation." (W 9-1-1952, p. 543)

  This view was held the longest, for several decades from about the early 1950s until 1995.

  4) From 1995.

  The general population of earth's wicked people. "Therefore in the final fulfillment of Jesus' prophecy today, "this generation" apparently refers to the peoples of the earth who see the sign of Christ's presence but fail to mend their ways." (W 11-1-1995, p. 19)

  This was the least comprehensible one to me. I never really saw how it made much sense. It seems to be similar to the first view, a general generation of people living contemporaneously when the end comes, but witht the emphasis on them being wicked.

  5) From 2008.

  The anointed. "As a class, these anointed ones make up the modern-day "generation" of contemporaries that will ot pass away "until all these things occur."" (W 2-15-08, p. 24)

  This one seems to be another throw-back, to the second view, a re-adoption of previously abandoned 'old light'.

  6) From 2010.

  The overlapping generation theory. "He [Jesus] evidently meant that the lives of the anointed who were on hand when the sign began to become evident in 1914 would overlap the lives of other anointed ones who would see the start of the great tribulation." (W 4-15-2010)

  I suppose with this view, the Watchtower could keep 'overlapping' the generations as far into the future as they needed to, and still call it 'the generation' that Jesus referred to.
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  83

  What was your most DISTURBING event as an elder ? (Per T.O.S. no full names please).

  by Balaamsass in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i'll start the ball rolling.

  dealing with kids in any type of judicial manner.

  i would do everything i could to get parents to "deal with it-kindly" at home.

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  ScenicViewer

  The elder told me the 3 verses he planned on using [on shepherding call]...

  One of the sons said he...didnt feel it was the truth. The elder got really...annoyed...

  Suffice to say he still carried on and used the very same 3 verses he planned to use, even though now they were meaningless.

  This is proof the elder was not qualified to be an elder, nor a spiritual leader of any kind. Jehovah's Witnesses are full of elders like this. What a shame.
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  45

  "Extreme physical abuse" only grounds for separation, NOT divorce.

  by cedars in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  forgive me if i'm a bit slow with the title to this thread.

  the true absurdity of the cult that robbed me of my intellect for so long is still beginning to dawn on me.. i'm doing more research into domestic violence as part of a response to the notorious "wife beating" article in the feb 2012 watchtower.. i was shocked to find a question from readers in the w75 5/1 p286-288 which basically said that a battered wife would not be scripturally free to divorce her husband.

  my first reaction was that this stance must have changed since 1975, but then i dipped into my own memory from serving as an elder, and of course, adultery (including porneia) is given as the only scriptural grounds for divorce down to this day.. please can somebody correct me if i'm wrong, preferably with a reference?

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  ScenicViewer

  Blondie's comment,

  But as long as his first wife lives without a mate, he will not qualify to serve in a responsible position in the congregation. He is not “a husband of one wife” because he had no Scriptural right to divorce his first wife.—1 Timothy 3:2, 12.

  My how times have changed. I'm thinking of Pastor Russell and Judge Rutherford, both Watchtower Presidents who were separated from their wives for many years. Neither wife remarried, but that didn't keep Russell and Rutherford from being the highest officials in the Watchtower.

  The Society often makes an issue of being united in belief, being 'fitly united in the same mind, and in the same line of thought' (1Cor 1:10). It claims to be the only truly united religion on earth. The fact is, sometimes the Society can't even agree with itself. Where is the unity in that?
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  42

  LeavingWT's DA letter

  by irondork in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  the blood issue has been an ongoing arguement between the roomie and me.

  not heated, by any means, but she keeps qouting back established wts reasoning on the subject.

  "it's feeding, jason.

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  ScenicViewer

  @bft123 who said,

  -- I have personally known people who inject alchole into their body,

  -- I personally know people who pretend to be witnessess, so that they dont have to take blood,

  -- or dont want to go to war,

  -- or when they are in Jail, and dont want to be raped by their inmates, who respect jehovahs witnessess, and will not bother them

  Do you really know people who have done all of these things? I have been associated with the Watchtower since 1969, and I don't know even one person like you describe. I'm not saying you don't know them, just that to know even one person like this is unlikely, but to know so many people like this would be amazing.
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  93

  What's The Biggest Difference In Today's JWs And The Witnesses From Decades Ago?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i believe today's witnesses lack zeal, resolve, "love" of the "truth"......just to name a few things.. years ago, witnesses were excited to knock on doors and tell people they were gonna die if they didn't accept paradise.. now, when you see jws in service, they all look zombied out.. it's a slowly dying religion that will last probably forever like an ancient rotted out tree..

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  ScenicViewer

  Back in the 1970s we had,

  -- Home book studies, with actual homes to meet in.

  -- Magazine subscriptions, which were so important to spiritual growth that every member of the family was told to have his own, to both magazines.

  -- 5 day District conventions.

  -- 3 day Circuit assemblies.

  -- A drama almost every day at District conventions.

  -- Food service at Conventions and Assemblies.

  -- Fudgesicles galore at Conventions.

  -- Great burritos at Assemblies.

  -- Plenty of books and literature released at conventions.

  -- Many more people getting baptised, regardless of what the published numbers say.

  -- 5 meetings a week.

  -- More lively meetings.

  -- Longer meetings.

  -- A reason to go door to door (or so we thought).

  -- More and better association.

  -- Eager anticipation of CO & DO visits and Special Talks.

  -- 2 or 3 Theocratic Ministry Schools, now 1 (where I attended).

  -- 5 talks in the TMS.

  -- 100 hr per month regular pioneers (now as low as 30).

  -- 75 hr per month vacation (auxiliary) pioneers.

  -- 25% of publishers in Japan was a pioneer.

  -- A much more thorough knowledge of the Bible.

  -- The ability to use scriptures at the door.

  -- Witnesses that knew what they were supposed to believe (I'm shocked at how many are clueless about WTS teachings now).

  -- Lots of janitors.

  -- Lots and lots of information moving us to "preach the word, be at it urgently" because "the time left is reduced" (2Tim 4:2, 1Cor 7:29).

  Now, everything else has been reduced too, including zeal, enthusiasm, association, hours in ministry, no subscriptions, number of meetings, length of meetings and more. If Witnesses today maintained the 'theocratic' schedule of days gone by, the KHs would be even emptier than they are now.

  What memories!
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  42

  LeavingWT's DA letter

  by irondork in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  the blood issue has been an ongoing arguement between the roomie and me.

  not heated, by any means, but she keeps qouting back established wts reasoning on the subject.

  "it's feeding, jason.

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  ScenicViewer

  bft123 said,

  do not use blood if you can help it. as it is the worst thing that you could do to the human body.

  I'd have thought that letting your body die from not having blood would be a lot worse for...uhm, you know...the body.
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  42

  LeavingWT's DA letter

  by irondork in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  the blood issue has been an ongoing arguement between the roomie and me.

  not heated, by any means, but she keeps qouting back established wts reasoning on the subject.

  "it's feeding, jason.

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  ScenicViewer

  @ bft123 who said,

  I knew people who the doctor told them not to drink alchole anymore, or they would die. so instead they started shotting it into their arm with a needle...and died from cirrossis...

  Seriously? You know or knew people....not just one, but more than one....who actually injected themselves with alcohol?
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  93

  What's The Biggest Difference In Today's JWs And The Witnesses From Decades Ago?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i believe today's witnesses lack zeal, resolve, "love" of the "truth"......just to name a few things.. years ago, witnesses were excited to knock on doors and tell people they were gonna die if they didn't accept paradise.. now, when you see jws in service, they all look zombied out.. it's a slowly dying religion that will last probably forever like an ancient rotted out tree..

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  ScenicViewer

  "Hope deferred makes the heart sick..." (Prov 13:12)

  Generation after generation of JWs have had their hopes dashed, experiencing failed predictions for the years 1914, 1925, early 1940s, 1975, and by 2000.

  Add to that the constant harping by the WTS on what is 'just around the corner' by repeatedly using certain 'buzz' words, and it eventually wears people out.

  -- ...soon the earth will be a physical paradise.

  -- Christ will soon bring grand blessings to all obedient mankind on a paradise ear.

  -- ...we are at the threshold of the new world...

  -- What a shame it would be to lose out on the new world when we are now at its threshold!

  -- ...we face the imminent end of the present world system.

  -- In view of the imminent approach of the battle of Armageddon...

  -- With Armageddon rapidly approaching...

  -- Jesus will serve as God's Executioner during the rapidly approaching "great tribulation.

  -- execution of judgment at the battle of Armageddon must follow very shortly.

  -- ...God's kingdom is now established in the heavens and will shortly usher in a new world of righteousness.

  Jehovah's Witnesses the most disappointed people on earth. They have grown sick of hearing such things, even if they are not consciously aware of it.
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  21

  Jehovah's Witnesses Spend Thanksgiving Knocking on Doors

  by koolaid-man in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.wnyc.org/blogs/wnyc-news-blog/2011/nov/24/jehovahs-witnesses-bump-evangelism-thanksgiving/.

  wnyc news blogjehovah's witnesses spend thanksgiving knocking on doorsthursday, november 24, 2011 - 12:00 amby daniel p. tucker.

  one of 80 territory maps used by jehovah's witnesses from a jackson heights kingdom hall to evangelize door to door.. jehovah's witnesses don't celebrate thanksgiving.

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  ScenicViewer

  Jagdish Patel, an elder [said]

  "Usually, on the weekdays, there will be a group of 8 to 10 people going out in the service," he said. "But on holidays, it can be 30, 40."

  I seriously doubt that. This is the puffy kind of exaggerated talk that Watchtower leaders often engage in to make Witnesses appear zealous.

  Idrnomo said,

  THAT'S ODD, In my time as an elder we hardley had any turnout for field service on holidays.

  It's always been the same way here. Precisely because it's a holiday and people will be home, Witnesses tend not to go door to door. They are accustomed to finding no one home, going through the motions, puting in time. Most of them can't deal with finding people home.

  Plus, there is the deep fear that they will not be very welcome since they are interrupting people who are busy on a day that's important to them. And the fear is justified.

  Witnesses tend to take holidays off just like everyone else.

  Elder Patel may be in an exceptional congregation, but in most places Witnesses avoid door to door work on major holidays like Thankisgiving and Christmas.