Posts by aristeas

20

The Section on Berossus in WT Oct. 1, 2011 "When Was Ancient Jerusalem Destroyed?"

by AnnOMaly in

p. 29 - "was berossus really an accurate historian?.

berossus wrote that assyrian king sennacherib.

followed "the reign of [his] brother"; and.

aristeas

Thank you, Ann, for your update. I don't understand why they are now trotting this 'defense of 607' thing out again. From things I've read here and eslewhere, I thought they were putting this whole 607/gentile times thing way back on the back burner. After all, they've taken the 1914 stuff from the copyright page out of the current mags and they've funneled off this stuff to an appendix in the current newbie book. Why in the world would they be binging all this stuff up in the WT again???

And Billy, you certainly do have the 'ultimate truth' down!

12

Shepherding Calls Question

by garyneal in

just a brief question concerning this practice.. my wife is about to get her annual shepherding call.

frankly, i did not know that this routine practice existed.

what is the purpose of it?.

aristeas

Gary,

Is your wife active? Are you a Witness? If so, are you active? One of the reasons why they make calls is because of the CO visit. Hence the 'twice a year' noted above in Lore's comment. When the CO visits, he's got a set procedure (directive from HQ) and one item is to check on those who are known inactive ones in the territory, sisters with unbelieving husbands, etc. It could be b/c of this policy.

Zetterholm book

by aristeas in

i've been a member of this forum for over 2 months now and it has been a real experience.

there seems to be a large number of ex-jw atheists or deists here.

while lacking faith, these people appear to have a variety of views that may perhaps be classified as more 'objective' than others with a believer's perspective (still in the wt fold but secretly looking around, having left it but still believe in god, or who have left but joined some other group).

aristeas

I've been a member of this forum for over 2 months now and it has been a real experience. There seems to be a large number of ex-JW atheists or deists here. While lacking faith, these people appear to have a variety of views that may perhaps be classified as more 'objective' than others with a believer's perspective (still in the WT fold but secretly looking around, having left it but still believe in God, or who have left but joined some other group). Possibly the former group then is more attuned to the view of critical biblical scholars who give more credence to facts of history than the thoughts of ancient or modern people of faith. Therefore, the following comments may appeal more to the first group, but I encourage those who still have faith to consider the following observations too and try to be as objective as possible.

I've been reading a book about the apostle Paul by Swedish biblical (and admittedly secular) scholar Magnus Zetterholm. The book, Approaches to Paul, is apparently a textbook for students in a college course on Pauline studies, but it is written in such a way that the average intelligent non-expert can follow along. It attempts to break down and explain the currents in the last 40 or so years of scholarly study of Paul. At the beginning Zetterholm gives a history of Paul's life as modern critical scholars can reconstruct it (meaning a non-acceptance of just taking as fact what the biblical texts say).

Two statements caught my attention enough to share them here. First, on p. 13 in speaking of the book of Acts, Zetterholm states: 'In Acts, the historiography is totally subordinate to the theological message'. Now to those who have experienced what most have here, DOES THAT SOUND FAMILIAR??

Consider the second quotation: 'The fact that Paul was nurtured in an environment that saw new interpretations of the biblical texts as the natural part of the divine revelation is an important aspect when trying to understand his way of reasoning' (16).

Again does this strike a chord with you?

38

Something the "Watchtower" left out

by Doug Mason in

the october 1, 2011 watchtower article when was ancient jerusalem destroyed?

includes the following statement.. .

there is also strong evidence from cuneiform documents that prior to the reign of nabopolassar (the first king of the neo-babylonian period), another king (ashuretel-ilani) ruled for four years in babylonia.

aristeas

Doubly posted --- sorry!

38

Something the "Watchtower" left out

by Doug Mason in

the october 1, 2011 watchtower article when was ancient jerusalem destroyed?

includes the following statement.. .

there is also strong evidence from cuneiform documents that prior to the reign of nabopolassar (the first king of the neo-babylonian period), another king (ashuretel-ilani) ruled for four years in babylonia.

aristeas

A general, rather than a technical question:

I thought the GB was sitting on the 607-1914 chronology, sort of ignoring it in the hopes that if they didn't talk about it much, critcism and discussion of it would eventually die. This is one of their established policies they sometimes employ. Some observers here even said that Rolf Furuli was irritating to them b/c he was so vocal taking on this lost cause.

If all this is true, THEN WHAT IN THE WORLD HAS CAUSED THEM TO DRAG THIS MATTER UP AGAIN???

Excuse me for my ignorance, but if I'm missing s.t. here, please enlighten me!

72

The Ancient Jewish CROSS and the ancient Hebrew letter Taw

by brit-93108 in

the ancient jewish cross by al garza phd is a groundbreaking book just published by createspace (isbn-13: 978-1461133896; april 27, 2011).. i'm about to order this book because it means a lot to me personally.

i was completely unaware of the history or meaning of ancient hebrew letter taw.

shaped like a cross and avoided by various jewish rabbi today due to its ties to jesus christ's death since his execution, taw is a pictorgraph used prior to babylonian captivity meaning "mark," "sign," "covenant," "seal," or more specifically, "sign, covenant, and seal of yhwh god" -- and fulfilled when jesus the messiah finalized the covenant on it through his blood so that we could have eternal life.. is the cross jewish or pagan?

aristeas

THX, LEOLAIA FOR THAT '58 WT QUOTATION

PRECIOUS!

61

What made you leave "The Truth"?

by Chemical Emotions in

for me it was many things.

most concerned certain teachings that invloved genders, children, sex, sexuality and sexual orientations, disfellowshipping, apostates, blood, rape, and few other things, as well as the jw's unloving attitude toward so many people..

aristeas

CE:

I couldn't agree more with willyloman's observation — how right on he is — this is INDEED an excellent thread!

cantleave, designs, Franklin Massey, stuckinamovement, MrDarkKnight, and others who made similar comments:

To be sure the higher up one goes, the more hypocrisy one sees. For me it was not just seeing how unspiritual many leading bros. were or how they they lied and expected others to do so too, but I could not go on teaching the doctrines that I knew other responsible brothers knew were not truthful. I have never come to terms with that.
What does "love rejoices with the truth" mean if the concept of truth becomes so plastic or elastic that it can be bent in any direction to suit the current practical needs? How can the churches be wrong b/c of their hypocrisy and that within the organization be OK to Jehovah? It was Pilate who took a skeptical view of truth, while Jesus seemed to have the opposite view, taking it seriously.

maksym: where did you go?

Quendi: you have a PM.

In general this has been a highly revealing thread for a relative newbie like me, very, VERY insightful.

Thanks so much...

21

I have question about the new light on the statues toes

by Igot2bme in

my son went to the dc this past weekend and we visited on the phone for a bit about what he picked up there.

he of course was sad and worried for us because we no longer have anything to do with the org.

we covered alot of issues that had to do with why i felt that the org did not have gods holy spirit.

aristeas

THANK YOU, ThomasCovenant! That was valuable.

4

Julia Sweeney

by dogisgod in

jw
friends

i just watched julia sweeney on her "god" info.

brilliant and funny.

gotta see her in person.

aristeas

How disappointing... I was hoping that you had news that she had started a bible study has now converted!

7

Biblical expertise of the GB and WT writing committees?

by IsaacJ22 in

i was just wondering if i'm correct about something; namely, that the society's leaders don't appear to know much about the bible from a secular, scholarly, or historical perspective.. i've seen quotes posted here where they claim you don't need to be an expert to interpret the bible's true meaning.

that's not exactly encouraging.

but does anyone know much about their real world, practical knowledge of the bible from a non-religious perspective?.

aristeas

They probably feel that they are like the fishermen of Galilee, uneducated and all that (John's gospel, Acts—sorry don't have chapter and verse handy) but nonetheless chosen by God. After all, it WAS the Jewish intelligentsia of the first century who opposed Jesus and the earliest Christians. The former WERE the biblical scholars of the day. It seems the stress the GB and writing department members put on things is moral more than mental, whereas the (often) secular scholarly element who controls biblical scholarship today emphasizes critical thinking, a long-term academic education, and so on. Unless they're Evangelicals or of similar stripe (and these don't number many in real scholarship), they don't really care much for the Bible's morality.

My two cents for what they're worth...