Sulla

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Posts by Sulla

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  35

  Why you love America

  by jamesmahon in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  it struck me, as i guess it has a lot of people, that there are so many threads from both americans and the rest of us that seem to descend into america bashing.

  i thought it might be quite nice to have a thread solely (and i mean solely - if this just turns negative i will call foul) on what we think is great about america.

  as a brit who has lived and been over a number of times there are many parts about america that i think are great and thought is would be healthy to have a positive thread for a change.. so a starter for ten (with a few gross generalisations thrown in):.

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  Sulla

  Aircraft carriers. We've about a dozen of those monsters.
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  24

  What race or ethnicity would you think this old guy is?

  by SweetBabyCheezits in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i mean, to be so well-muscled at a wrinkly old age.... look at them gunz.. .

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  Sulla

  I believe my cousin blared this at max volume in his camaro -- black primer paint job, fuzzy dice on the rear view, joint in the ash tray. He was so cool.

  A chimp, given the slightest chance, will rip your face clean off. That Disney movie with the cute baby chimp is nothing but propaganda from the chimp-controlled Holywood propaganda cartel.
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  24

  What race or ethnicity would you think this old guy is?

  by SweetBabyCheezits in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i mean, to be so well-muscled at a wrinkly old age.... look at them gunz.. .

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  Sulla

  Fucking chimps. I hate 'em. Damn them all to hell!
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  195

  Theistic Evolution

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  thoughtful christians including scientists like francis collins and kenneth miller accept the evidence for evolution unconditionally.

  the only thing that distinguishes their understanding of life from the views of dawkins is that they believe god planned and started the process intentionally.. just a word about the subtle but vital distinction between "theistic evolution" and "intelligent design".... over-simplifications alert - intelligent design is creationism in disguise.

  it is a modern twist on the "paley's watch" argument.

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  Sulla

  Sulla, it is interesting that you mention written tales of dieties of other cultures having interacted with humans in the same paragraph as your citing the written tale of your deity having interacted with humans but apparently don't equate them.

  Not sure what you mean. I think that the old gods really did exist: Zeus really was some amazing guy (or set of guys) who was viewed as a god after his death. Gilgamesh (or his composite) really existed and he had a mother who was considered to be extra special in some way. I'm partial to Girard's approach to violence, sacrifice, and religion. In this view, the main problem to be solved for men is how to live together without society devolving into some sort of Hobbesian nightmare. Communal violence is the answer. Of course, it is also the problem. But that's another discussion, I guess.

  But your point is again intriguing, how ancient is the idea of a deity that is remote, distant and only accessible unidirectionally through prayer? Has any cult actually attempted worship of a deity without some form of occassional claim of active presence?

  I don't know: Plato, maybe? Pythagoreans? Not too many, I don't think. That's one reason I think Girard is on to something.

  I'd hazard to guess a psychological necessity behind doctrines like the presence through the eucharist, or Dionysus proving his presence through annually changing water to wine. The perrenial absence of the deities is perhaps just too much to swallow without some form of reassurance of invisible prescence through rite and miracle.

  Well, yeah. Unless you are some freaky Gnostic or Platonist or something. That's one reason sacrifice has been the way in which people worship throughout 99.999% of human existence. A corpse is real.

  I really know of no practising Christian who doesn't believe that Jesus (or angel) isn't at least once in a while bodily nearby.

  Heh. You should hang out with more Protestants, they don't do the Real Presence so much. Hell, most Christians don't really think Jesus even has a body now! True story: My old parish had a poster they put up during stewardship month (when you sign up for various activities for the year: teaching Sunday school, food drive, whatever). It said, "He has no hands but yours." The point being that Jesus, being a spirit, cant go around lifting canned peas to stock the food bank. After a week or two, they changed it out to a slightly different slogan: somebody had pointed out that the first poster was actually heretical in that it denied the Resurrection. The central claim of the Christian faith being that Jesus most emphatically does have hands now.
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  32

  Why womenz are dumber than menz

  by Dogpatch in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the glorious insight of the old farts at bethel :.

  why womenz are dumber than menz (and should not be trusted...).

  in fact, (unwritten but implied) they should be beaten)!.

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  Sulla

  Excuse me, but extraterrestrials are wll-known to have these really ginormous skulls. And, of course, they are far more intelligent than we. Same goes for homo ergaster and all the rest.
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  52

  Leaving Jehovah's Witnesses is NOT the same as the doctrines leaving you

  by Terry in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  if you grow up speaking english and you move to mexico you don't automatically speak spanish, know customs, understand currency, possess skills.

  for self-support or have any special insight into latino mindset.. .

  why would you expect leaving jehovah's witnesses would leave you any less ill-equipped to navigate the real world?.

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  Sulla

  Just a reminder that, bad as the JW effort at removing your ability to think is, at one time everyone here wanted it to happen. Even born-ins found the sense of complete rightness and complete knowledge intoxicating and desirable.

  The problem is not that they harmed your thought processes as much as it is that we allowed and wanted it to happen. The problem is not in our stars, but ourselves.
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  195

  Theistic Evolution

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  thoughtful christians including scientists like francis collins and kenneth miller accept the evidence for evolution unconditionally.

  the only thing that distinguishes their understanding of life from the views of dawkins is that they believe god planned and started the process intentionally.. just a word about the subtle but vital distinction between "theistic evolution" and "intelligent design".... over-simplifications alert - intelligent design is creationism in disguise.

  it is a modern twist on the "paley's watch" argument.

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  Sulla

  I would imagine many more people would believe in a deity that was as accessable.

  It is interesting, peacefulpete, to note that the oldest stories make the gods immediately accesible. In the Iliad, Ares actually fights next to Hector; Gilgamesh actually goes and has a conversation with his mother (who is a goddess) prior to leaving on his quest. And, of course, the ancient teaching of the Christians insists that God is really present in the Eucharist. The concept of a Christian God who is not physically present is a late innovation.

  Of course, Jesus doesn't cook me breakfast. But he did for other people. So, that's something.

  Your overall point that I think you are making, is valid' that pure reductionism cannot equip people to interact and live joyful lives.

  I think I would actually go further: I don't think pure reductionism is a useful way to interpret reality.
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  49

  Would You Listen To A Prayer From A JW And Say Amen If They Said A Prayer In Your Presence?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my mom has had visits from various jws and they have asked her if they could say a prayer before they left.

  i respectfully listened to the prayers while i was visiting and might silently say amen if i felt the prayer was appropriate for my mom.. i'm just curious, how would you handle this type of situation?.

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  Sulla

  When I was young and we would visit my grandparents, my dad would ask to say a JW prayer. My grandfather (German atheist) would allow it and remain silent through it, staring straight ahead.

  Fast forward.

  My grandfather dies. A couple days after the funeral my JW parents, my wife and I (Catholic, now), and our daughter are cleaning some things out of his house. We have supper in my grandfather's dining room. My dad prays. My daughter crosses herself; I stare straight ahead while my dad begins, "Jehovah God, our heavenly Father..."
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  195

  Theistic Evolution

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  thoughtful christians including scientists like francis collins and kenneth miller accept the evidence for evolution unconditionally.

  the only thing that distinguishes their understanding of life from the views of dawkins is that they believe god planned and started the process intentionally.. just a word about the subtle but vital distinction between "theistic evolution" and "intelligent design".... over-simplifications alert - intelligent design is creationism in disguise.

  it is a modern twist on the "paley's watch" argument.

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  Sulla

  I'm sure there are multiple viewpoints, NC. Speaking for myself, it seems to me that there was never a paradise with physically perfect people running around -- not in the strictly historical sense, anyhow. The myth of the Fall, to me, suggests a human rejection of the potential of being who we are meant to be. What we are meant to be is one with the One who is being itself. That said, I don't think the Incarnation was plan B.

  Mythically, what was lost was that perfection: a perfect moment of potential, a chance at transcendence if only theoretically. I don't think it could have been any other way: Eve always listens to the serpent, Pandora always opens the box.
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  195

  Theistic Evolution

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  thoughtful christians including scientists like francis collins and kenneth miller accept the evidence for evolution unconditionally.

  the only thing that distinguishes their understanding of life from the views of dawkins is that they believe god planned and started the process intentionally.. just a word about the subtle but vital distinction between "theistic evolution" and "intelligent design".... over-simplifications alert - intelligent design is creationism in disguise.

  it is a modern twist on the "paley's watch" argument.

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  Sulla

  redvip2000, perhaps there is some alternative other than either rejecting Christianity or else holding a fundamentalist Christian view. Maybe some third choice...