jwfacts has an article that explains why the great crowd must be in heaven.
i am also aware that many of these are the same arguments that stemmed from the 'awakenings at bethel' so my statements are not simply attacks of jwfact's character (since these arguments are probably not original) but rather his copy and paste of what others have said instead of verifying it as 'fact' for himself.. so here are jwfacts arguments:.
1. he shows that russell and rutherford (at some point) believed that the great crowd were in heaven.. 2. each term that describes the great crowd of revelation 7 is else used to described the anointed by the wt.
Recovery I have a question: Do the elders in your congregation know that you read and post on this site? Mine do not because I do not think that I will benefit my family by exposing myself. Why don't you sit with your group overseer and go over some of your concerns.
Perhaps he can even instruct you on how you "..ought to give an answer" in defense of the truth here on JW.net
when you were active jws did you ever give to charities?
anyone else you know in the cong.
as for me, i do give on occasion and when i am able to.
When you were active JWs did you ever give to charities? Anyone else you know in the cong. do it?
As for me, I do give on occasion and when I am able to. Red Cross, PBA, Local Firehouse, even Salvation Army during Christmas..lol
some have figured out, but i am a poster that previously used another name.
but even then i did not give many details about myself.
i barely cracked 100 posts.. but i have never done a thread to explain why i am here.
Welcome..back I guess. Enjoyed your story, I too was "happy" in the truth until I realized that being an elder was all political and the WTS shielded filthy pedophiles. I look forward to hearing more.
i wanted to get a list of arguments that illustrate how the watchtower society is or isn't following 1st century christianity today.
thanks again everyone!.
For the record I have been a pioneer for many years. And there is no "secret information" given to pioneers or elders. It can all be found in various WT publications.
besides the policy letters that instruct elders to call the legal dept. in all cases of pedophilia. I don't see that backed up in the bible and most R&F are not aware of that policy.
i wanted to get a list of arguments that illustrate how the watchtower society is or isn't following 1st century christianity today.
thanks again everyone!.
That precahing the good news is an absolute requirement for all christians and your activity must be recorded on a publishers record card for the elders too look at and judge your spirituality. Show me in the bible where either of those things are necessary to gain salvation.
[if gte mso 9]><xml> <o:officedocumentsettings> <o:allowpng /> </o:officedocumentsettings> </xml><![endif].
[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:worddocument> <w:view>normal</w:view> <w:zoom>0</w:zoom> <w:trackmoves /> <w:trackformatting /> <w:punctuationkerning /> <w:validateagainstschemas /> <w:saveifxmlinvalid>false</w:saveifxmlinvalid> <w:ignoremixedcontent>false</w:ignoremixedcontent> <w:alwaysshowplaceholdertext>false</w:alwaysshowplaceholdertext> <w:donotpromoteqf /> <w:lidthemeother>en-us</w:lidthemeother> <w:lidthemeasian>x-none</w:lidthemeasian> <w:lidthemecomplexscript>x-none</w:lidthemecomplexscript> <w:compatibility> <w:breakwrappedtables /> <w:snaptogridincell /> <w:wraptextwithpunct /> <w:useasianbreakrules /> <w:dontgrowautofit /> <w:splitpgbreakandparamark /> <w:enableopentypekerning /> <w:dontflipmirrorindents /> <w:overridetablestylehps /> </w:compatibility> <m:mathpr> <m:mathfont m:val="cambria math" /> <m:brkbin m:val="before" /> <m:brkbinsub m:val="--" /> <m:smallfrac m:val="off" /> <m:dispdef /> <m:lmargin m:val="0" /> <m:rmargin m:val="0" /> <m:defjc m:val="centergroup" /> <m:wrapindent m:val="1440" /> <m:intlim m:val="subsup" /> <m:narylim m:val="undovr" /> </m:mathpr></w:worddocument> </xml><!
[endif][if gte mso 10]> <style> /* style definitions */ table.msonormaltable {mso-style-name:"table normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-priority:99; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin-top:0in; mso-para-margin-right:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:10.0pt; mso-para-margin-left:0in; line-height:115%; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; mso-bidi-font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"century schoolbook","serif";} </style> <![endif].
even if they are conditional friends
This is so true, and if you are an elder even more so. Kiss ass brothers and MS's love to be your "friend" until they leech on to a more prominent elder who can actually help then "reach out" lol. such bullshit.
during my first few years at bk, i spent a significant amount of time at jcah.
i am really trying to make at least one connection with someone i know personally.
lol.
What exactly happened to Ricketts? All I heard were rumors....something about stealing funds.
id like to know what personally convinced you jws are wrong about a particular doctrine/practice, that they are not gods true.people and/or what made you leave emotionally/physically.
.
What first got me considering that they are wrong is the fact that they dare to use the 2 witness rule in the bible to justify not calling the police if a child is molested or raped. It is pharisaical to put a rule in place of someone elses welfare.
Jesus himself showed how wrong those pharisees were by critisizing them for not doing things out of compassion on the sabbath. So they seriously would let a child rapist go unpunished because, "well it is his word against that 5 year old girl.. nobody else complained". Haven't they heard of spirit of the law.. idiots. Jesus said you would get saved by:
1. Loving Jehovah
2. Loving your neighbor as yourself. Period!
Is it showing love to Jehovah by abusing that 2 witness scripture? Is it loving to allow a filthy pedophile free to rape other children?
Anyway after I struggled with that then rest falls into place.
i never believed that in 1975 or by the end of the 20th century, we would see the great tribulation occur.
some witnesses would listen to fred franz' talks where he clearly told his audience that 1975 was the end of 6000 years and the beginning of the jubilee....or something like that.. was there something that you never truly accepted that you were supposed to believe as a jehovah's witness?.
Romans 8:1- Therefore those in union with Christ Jesus have no condemnation
So only 144,000 humans out of thousands of years of history are not condemed. Really?
Also
Ephesians 4:11 And he gave some as apostles, some as prophets, some as evangelizers, some as shepherds and teachers,
So why do we all need to go out in the ministry. The word some means something else to the governing body I guess.
Those are my main "pet peeves"
this was a question that sprang to my mind as i watched raypub's (eric's) j.c video.
can't wait for the rest of it by the way !.
it was so obvious that all those on that j.c, like i would think 99.9% of elders , put loyalty to the gb/wt before jehovah, jesus the bible or truth.. they are simply company men through and through.. the average r&f jw seems to me to believe they are serving god, and that comes higher on their list than the wt, you can see this by the way they pick and choose which of the myriad rules they obey.
I find that it depends on the elder. Back in my kiss ass heyday as an elder I was a total WT/FD&S goon and if you as a R&F member didnt measure up you were beneathe me.
Later as I became more moderate and started to realize that being an elder is a political office only I eased up tremendously. Now I truly consider myself trapped as an elder due to pressure from wife and other family members. I hate it and I decline "privileges" as much as I can, I try to treat all with respect, and the other elders are slowly getting tired of me. lol.. I can only hope that soon stab me in the back and I can sit back and do jack squat.
