Then make it. It's not Witness doctrine.
Posts by vienne
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101Who is the mediator for jehovahs witnesses?
by atomant inlm getting conflicting advice.ls it the 144000 or jesus.l was always under the impression it was jesus.lf its the 144000 then when they pray the jw;s should be praying through the remnant not in jesus christs name but in the 144000;s name..
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vienne
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101
Who is the mediator for jehovahs witnesses?
by atomant inlm getting conflicting advice.ls it the 144000 or jesus.l was always under the impression it was jesus.lf its the 144000 then when they pray the jw;s should be praying through the remnant not in jesus christs name but in the 144000;s name..
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vienne
This is what the Bible says about Jesus as mediator: “Therefore he is the mediator of a new covenant, so that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance” -- Heb. 9:15.
This is not the work of reconciliation. This is an organizational covenant, just as the old [Mosaic] covenant was organizational. The question is, then, are the Great Crowd under the new covenant, or is there a separate "Israel of God," limited in number? If we answer as Jehovah's Witnesses do, that only a limited number are in the New Covenant, then all else is not. Jesus did not negotiate a covenant with them. If we answer as some others do, that every Christian is part of the new covenant, then the Great Crowd has Jesus as its mediator.
However we answer, an organizing covenant is not the work of reconciliation. That's Jesus' role as atonement sacrifice, and in that role, John the Apostle calls him the propitiatory sacrifice for all. The two terms are distinct both in English and in Greek. Purposely confusing them, as some are doing here, persuades only the choir.
Being exact and accurate in our criticism matters.
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101
Who is the mediator for jehovahs witnesses?
by atomant inlm getting conflicting advice.ls it the 144000 or jesus.l was always under the impression it was jesus.lf its the 144000 then when they pray the jw;s should be praying through the remnant not in jesus christs name but in the 144000;s name..
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vienne
A mediator is a go between who stands between God and another party. He negotiates a covenant. A propitiator is a reconciler, a peace maker. As I said before, in witness theology they keep those concepts separate because they believe only a small number are in the New Covenant, but all are reconciled to God through Christ.
Some of you are confusing the two terms to cause outrage. The real issue is this: are there two classes of Christians, one destined to heaven and the other to a paradise earth. That question has been debated for several centuries, but within traceable Witness history it has been an issue since the mid 19th Century.
Witnesses do NOT teach that 'the earthly class' is without a savior, salvation or reconciliation. They do NOT teach that salvation comes through the anointed or a governing body. We may reject Witness theology, but we should be honest about it. A false outrage is wrong.
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101
Who is the mediator for jehovahs witnesses?
by atomant inlm getting conflicting advice.ls it the 144000 or jesus.l was always under the impression it was jesus.lf its the 144000 then when they pray the jw;s should be praying through the remnant not in jesus christs name but in the 144000;s name..
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vienne
In Witness theology, Jesus as mediator is only mediator of the new covenant between God and the heaven-bound congregation. Jesus as 'propitiator' [reconciler] brings relief from sin and reconciliation to all men. [1 John 2:2] The GB are not seen as filling these functions. There is a confusion of terms in some previous posts.
JWs see the governing body as the appointed administrators of the entire body of believers. A knowledgeable Witness [My experience suggests they're a rare species] will cite Ephesians 4:11-14 to show what a believer's relationship to Witness authority structure and its purpose is. The GB seems to believe that the congregations and individual adherents should be unquestioningly subservient to their opinions.
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Rough Draft Chapter from our Next Book
by vienne ina few of you follow our research into watch tower history.
i've posted a rough draft of a chapter from upcoming volume 2 of separate identity.
on-point comments are welcome.
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vienne
After discussing this with someone who knew Hudson, I now know that he arrived at both dates via hearsay. This is not solid research. I will explain the alternate date in a footnote. Thanks for your thoughtful comments. Also thanks to Gorb and Smid for their nice comments.
A bit of rough draft of my Introductory Essay is up now ... That's a work in progress. In it I try to redirect writers to the actual elements of Anglo-American religious history that are the antecedents of Russell era Watch Tower belief. Too many of those with academic pretensions ignore what history should tell them.
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Did the WTBTS really print this stuff?
by Giordano ini am not going to delve into the opinions and information provided by the good folks on this forum on matters of health and science in another post.
instead i want to make clear that the wtbts provided a fountain of information on this subject.
feel free to add any other misinformation you received.
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vienne
C. J. Woodworth was enamored of Bernar McFadden's heath cure regimen. This was the last-gasp era of electro cures and eclectic 'medicine.' Many took the Golden Age's claims seriously, and in fact the GA simply repeated what others said.
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Rough Draft Chapter from our Next Book
by vienne ina few of you follow our research into watch tower history.
i've posted a rough draft of a chapter from upcoming volume 2 of separate identity.
on-point comments are welcome.
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vienne
Hudson wrote:
The January HERALD very interesting. Two points in the list of dates of events 1879-1918. Start of British work shown as 1895; was in fact 1881 when Bender and Sunderlin came from USA to distribute Food for Thinking Christians in 18 or so cities of Great Britain from London to Aberdeen. First British organized class Glasgow 1883, London 1885. By 1900 there were nine classes in London area aggregating some 500 brethren. First British convention 1892 with 400 present. By 1900 a goodly number of classes all over the country. The other point, opening of London Tabernacles shown as 1900 was in fact 1911.
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Rough Draft Chapter from our Next Book
by vienne ina few of you follow our research into watch tower history.
i've posted a rough draft of a chapter from upcoming volume 2 of separate identity.
on-point comments are welcome.
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vienne
I should add that there is nothing in Zion's Watch Tower to prove either date.
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Rough Draft Chapter from our Next Book
by vienne ina few of you follow our research into watch tower history.
i've posted a rough draft of a chapter from upcoming volume 2 of separate identity.
on-point comments are welcome.
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vienne
My copy of Hudson's work says 1883. The 1882 date may come from a revision but seems unrealistic to me. I will check further. And get back to you if I find anything different.
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Rough Draft Chapter from our Next Book
by vienne ina few of you follow our research into watch tower history.
i've posted a rough draft of a chapter from upcoming volume 2 of separate identity.
on-point comments are welcome.
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vienne
A few of you follow our research into watch tower history. I've posted a rough draft of a chapter from upcoming volume 2 of Separate Identity. On-point comments are welcome. enjoy ...