argumentum ad populum is not a convincing argument; it is a major logic flaw. What others believe is not proof of anything.
Some few thousand believe the earth is flat based on what they see as convincing argument.
Posts by vienne
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83Russell's Pyramidology Originated In Edinburgh Scotland
by cofty inthe edinburgh city observatory sits atop calton hill at the east end of the city centre adjacent to burn's monument, scotland's national monument modelled on the parthenon, and nelson's monument with the time ball that falls at 1pm every day except sundays.. .
the second astronomer royal of edinburgh was charles piazzi smyth (jan. 1819 - feb. 1900).
smyth was a man of many and varied interests including meteorology, producing weather observations that still form an important part of uk climate records to this day.. building on the work of james taylor, smyth became fascinated by the great pyramid of egypt at giza.
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vienne
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83
Russell's Pyramidology Originated In Edinburgh Scotland
by cofty inthe edinburgh city observatory sits atop calton hill at the east end of the city centre adjacent to burn's monument, scotland's national monument modelled on the parthenon, and nelson's monument with the time ball that falls at 1pm every day except sundays.. .
the second astronomer royal of edinburgh was charles piazzi smyth (jan. 1819 - feb. 1900).
smyth was a man of many and varied interests including meteorology, producing weather observations that still form an important part of uk climate records to this day.. building on the work of james taylor, smyth became fascinated by the great pyramid of egypt at giza.
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vienne
Crofty? He/she ... It's she. Its Rachael de Vienne, PhD to be exact. And ... again ... you didn't offend me at all. And I didn't mean to offend you.
A thread where my writing partner and I are discussed [for the eternally curious] https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5116004591992832/who-b-w-schulz-anyone-know
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Russell's Pyramidology Originated In Edinburgh Scotland
by cofty inthe edinburgh city observatory sits atop calton hill at the east end of the city centre adjacent to burn's monument, scotland's national monument modelled on the parthenon, and nelson's monument with the time ball that falls at 1pm every day except sundays.. .
the second astronomer royal of edinburgh was charles piazzi smyth (jan. 1819 - feb. 1900).
smyth was a man of many and varied interests including meteorology, producing weather observations that still form an important part of uk climate records to this day.. building on the work of james taylor, smyth became fascinated by the great pyramid of egypt at giza.
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vienne
Well ... I didn't mean to offend Crofty and I'm not upset at what he said. But thanks for defending me. All I meant is that this is widely known, not that everyone should know it. It is interesting and important. As Mr. Schulz and I observe in Separate Identity, pyramidology has no rational or factual basis, even if widely believed in the Russell era.
Sparrow, I don't know of anyone who denies the pyramid monument is connected to Russell. Many will tell you it's not his tomb or head stone, and it isn't. I think the usual objection is to the claim that it is Masonic. It isn't.
I think the significance of the pyramid monument is often missed. For Russellites it was a symbol of divine revelation to mankind, a proof of divine favor. Some Russellites still see the pyramid that way. This is irrational. And unscriptural too. But like many questionable fads, a host of religious people believed the same thing at one time. Like phrenology, it was once viewed as 'science,' but other than by a few essentially irrational people, it is now seen as quackery.
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Russell's Pyramidology Originated In Edinburgh Scotland
by cofty inthe edinburgh city observatory sits atop calton hill at the east end of the city centre adjacent to burn's monument, scotland's national monument modelled on the parthenon, and nelson's monument with the time ball that falls at 1pm every day except sundays.. .
the second astronomer royal of edinburgh was charles piazzi smyth (jan. 1819 - feb. 1900).
smyth was a man of many and varied interests including meteorology, producing weather observations that still form an important part of uk climate records to this day.. building on the work of james taylor, smyth became fascinated by the great pyramid of egypt at giza.
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vienne
From Separate Identity, vol 1
The Witness of the Great Pyramid
They were introduced to speculations about the Great Pyramid of Giza at least by 1875.[1] How soon they adopted the view that the pyramid was God’s “great stone witness on the border of Egypt” is unknown, but it must have been in this era. As with so much else, claims made about Russell’s belief that the Great Pyramid was a secondary witness to the divine message are often wholly or partly false. One writer suggests that Storrs introduced Pyramidology to “the Millerites,” and that belief centered in Adventist bodies. Those who lack persistence and skill as researchers, the lazy and polemicists may have an interest in limiting belief to “fringe” groups, but this distorts the record. Pyramidology was discussed in America at least by 1861.[2] Believers were a diverse group that ran the spectrum from Astrologers to Thomas De Witt Talmage, a popular Presbyterian and Reformed pastor, who had “no doubt” that Isaiah’s reference to a stone witnesses on the border of Egypt meant the Great Pyramid.[3]
Charles Piazzi Smyth, Astronomer Royal for Scotland, popularized and elaborated the theories of John Taylor, who without visiting the pyramid suggested that it was constructed by Noah. Smyth traveled to Egypt, examining and measuring the pyramid. He penned Our Inheritance in the Great Pyramid which was published in 1864. It attributed the Great Pyramid to Melchizedek and gave it a scientific and religious import. Smyth’s theories gained a following among Egyptologists, not the least of whom was William Matthew Flinders Petrie. But when Flinders Petrie traveled to Egypt in 1880, making his own measurements he found so many flaws in Smyth’s theory that he abandoned it, calling it “lamentable nonsense.” By the end of the 19th Century no reputable Egyptologist supported it.
James K. Walker, president of the Watchman Fellowship, suggested that Pyramidology was “a major source of revelation” for Russell, writing that Russell admitted to this. As is true of most of what Mr. Walker writes, this is absurd. At least one writer claims that Pyramidology attracted Adventists primarily, and many claim that pyramid belief was rank superstition, occultism, or connected to the Masons. All of this is wrong, some of it out of context and some contrived. Certainly, Walker’s claim that Russell was dependent on pyramid measurement for his chronology is false. Ron Rhodes described Russell’s belief that the pyramid fulfilled Isaiah’s prophecy as “cornerstone component” of his belief system. This is also false.
In 1881, Russell wrote that he had “great respect” for the teaching of the Great Pyramid, adding, “We do not build our faith upon it. It has well been called ‘A Miracle in Stone,’ and it commends itself to us as a work of God, and not planned by men, for it seems in every respect to be in perfect accord with God’s plan as we are finding it written in His Word; and this it is, that causes our respect for it.”[4] It is no more true that Russell found in the pyramid a cornerstone of his theology than it is of Clarence Larkin, the Baptist expositor, who also saw the pyramid as God’s stone witness on the border of Egypt.
Russell was introduced to Pyramidology through his One Faith and Millennialist connections. Storrs, writers for Age-to-Come journals, and others promoted Smyth’s ideas and added thoughts of their own. Thomas Wilson’s Our Rest focused on the dual themes of Christ’s return and the Great Pyramid. Russell could not have avoided the discussion. The quotation above shows us that he read J. A. Seiss’ Miracle in Stone when it was published in 1877. Seiss published on the theme in 1869, but while Russell may have read that tract we cannot prove he did. The nature of the Great Pyramid was the subject of lectures, pamphlets, books and public discussion. If it later became the pet theory of fringe religion and occultists, it was not that in this era. We honor Isaac Newton for his science. We forget that when everyone else believed Phlogiston was a scientific reality, he did too. If he were alive today, we’d raise our eyebrows and scoff. Context is everything here. Put in context, Russell’s adoption of Smyth’s theory made him a man of his times. He believed it when others did.
Seiss, whose works are still published, is honored as a serious and scholarly exegete. Others of repute in the religious world found the theory attractive. A long list of favorable reviews of his Miracle in Stone appeared in the religious and secular press. The Illustrated Christian Weekly expressed some reservations but recommended it. The Reformed Church Messenger approached it in the same way. So did The Christian Intelligencer. Messiah’s Herald wrote, “We’re glad that it is being studied by men of learning and piety; and those who have a taste for study in that direction, will find many things in this volume to help them.” We do not know how Russell was introduced to Seiss’ book. He probably heard of it from various sources. The Pittsburgh Dispatch reviewed it, saying: “The lectures of Dr. Seiss are as remarkable for the polished beauty of their construction, as for the information which they contain. That mysterious pillar, the Great Pyramid of Gizeh, its relation to ancient history, modern discoveries, and Bible connections, are thoroughly canvassed in this volume.” If we are to fault Russell at all, it is for believing the theory long after its defects were apparent.
[1] The Great Pyramid, Bible Examiner, 1875, page 233 ff.
[2] 1861 New York Tribune Almanac, page 3.
[3] T. De Witt Talmage: Lesson of the Pyramid, The Peekskill, New York, Highland Democrat, October 24, 1891.
[4] C. T. Russell: The Year 1881, Zion’s Watch Tower, May 1881, page 5.
Pyramid
A pyramid shaped monument was installed in the Bible Student cemetery in Pittsburgh. The cemetery is occasionally described as Masonic. It’s not. There is a Masonic temple nearby built years later. There is no connection. The pyramid was intended as a general monument with the names of those buried in the Watch Tower plots engraved onto open books. Rather than being a Masonic symbol, the open book motif derives from the book of Revelation. Those who want to cast Russell as part of some great Masonic conspiracy claim the pyramid embodies the “all seeing eye.” It does not. The pyramid symbol refers to Russell’s belief, shared by many others who did not otherwise hold his views, that the Great Pyramid at Gizah was a divinely inspired testimony in stone to Bible truth. We trace the development of this idea in Chapter Three. The use of the pyramid as a monument was suggested not by the back of the US dollar which had an entirely different design in 1920, but by the grave marker for Charles Piazzi Smyth, a prominent pyramidologist and Astronomer Royal of Scotland.
The monument was installed in 1919, some years after Russell’s death. One source suggests Russell designed it, a Bible Student convention report saying: “The Pyramid, as you will note, has an open book carved on each side, intended by Brother Russell for the names of Bethel workers as they ceased their work and were laid at rest, awaiting the great Resurrection of the first-fruits of the Lord.”[1] A Bible Student web page takes pains to blame the pyramid monument on Rutherford rather than Russell. Neither of these statements is correct. The monument was designed not as a memorial to Russell but “as a memorial to the society.” It was “designed by Brother Bohnet, and accepted by Brother Russell as the most fitting emblem for an enduring monument on the Society’s burial space.” According to Bohnet, work started in 1914. The pyramid’s purpose was not Masonic.[2]
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83
Russell's Pyramidology Originated In Edinburgh Scotland
by cofty inthe edinburgh city observatory sits atop calton hill at the east end of the city centre adjacent to burn's monument, scotland's national monument modelled on the parthenon, and nelson's monument with the time ball that falls at 1pm every day except sundays.. .
the second astronomer royal of edinburgh was charles piazzi smyth (jan. 1819 - feb. 1900).
smyth was a man of many and varied interests including meteorology, producing weather observations that still form an important part of uk climate records to this day.. building on the work of james taylor, smyth became fascinated by the great pyramid of egypt at giza.
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vienne
The Pyramid isn't Russell's tomb. He's buried under a fairly ordinary headstone near by.
Some of Smyth's books can be found at books.google.com
None of this is news.
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Latest son of thunder video on YouTube and the 07 letter to the elders.
by Crazyguy inin his video he mentions an elders letter sent to germany in 07 , i believe.
in this letter if i'm understanding it correctly the elders are being instructed to send most of any information on hand about child abuse in their congregation to headquarters and any thing else they have at home or in their personal possession to destroy it.
this seams to be the most obvious case of wt telling their elders to destroy information.
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vienne
Can we see a scan of the original German language letter?
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Mystery Letters of "Human Apostate" talk 2013 summer convention and its connection to Lev.5:1
by Bill Covert ingreetings from redding calif. my name is bill covert.
i am one of those viet nam war felons for having to refuse communtiy service in lieu of military induction per direct instructions from ny, so i have been around for a while.
i am the writer of the letters mentioned in the human apostate talk of the 2013 conventions.
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vienne
Bill,
I know this isn't at all pertinent to your post, but do you descend from William R. Covert, a 19th Century evangelist and debater?
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chasing me for a report
by Phoebe ini'm fairly new on here and i've told a lot of my story but to recap, after 60 odd years i've stopped going to the meetings.
my husband had already left the truth years ago and my children didn't become jws.(phew!).
i had a horrendous childhood growing up as a witness which included sexual assault by a close relative, also a jw.
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vienne
Did the Apostles report their time preaching?
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She's here and early! 27 weeks 1day.
by Darkknight757 inso as of july 2nd my wife delivered by c-section our little one pound, three ounce daughter izabella.
it was a very scary night that started with a decel and turned into multiple decels that greatly concerned the doctors.
by early morning they felt the need to take her for her safety.
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vienne
My first was a preemie, but not so early as yours. Liz was 32 weeks. So I understand the tension and worry. I pray she thrives. What a beautiful baby.
Rachael
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Pastor Russell letters?
by vienne inmost of those who read my comments and posts here know i'm not a witness but a historian who writes about them.
as my writing partner and i near completion of volume 2 of separate identity, we need scans of any letters, post cards or what have you written by russell, any of his associates or any pre-1916 adherent - no matter how insignificant they may appear.. can you helps with this?
we also need clear scans of watch tower convention programs from that era.. i appreciate any help that comes my way.. rachael.
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vienne
Of course we want documents related to other participants in the Watch Tower movement. We found a tract published by B. W. Keith. We'll quote it in full in volume 3. We found a handwritten biography written by one of the earliest colporteurs. We will quote portions of it in volume 2. If you read volume 1 of Separate Identity you saw bits of letters written by J. C. Sunderlan. We have a portion of J. H. Patons diary. These are not regular printed publications. They're harder to find, and but give us insight into Watch Tower history in ways printed material does not.
Items that may seem insignificant to you may add to our research in unexpected way. A letter to Paton printed in the 1913 World's Hope came our way. It changed everything we knew about an early adherent. We're rewriting a section of a chapter destined for vol 2.
Never think anything is irrelevant.