Posts by NikL

51

To those taking a stand and not attending the Memorial tonight

by doubtfull1799 in

i salute you.

many of you, like me, are probably under enormous emotional pressure, whether from a lingering false sense of guilt from your indoctrination, whether from "invitations," and assumptions that you'll naturally be coming, or whether from outright emotional blackmail, even begging and pleading.

i am thinking of you whoever you are, all of you, even though i don't know you in person.

NikL

Tip a hat to those that don't attend.

Say a prayer for those of us that will (including myself.)

1

This weeks Congregation Bible Study

by NikL in

jw
friends

another week of a "bible study" wherein the bible isn't studied.. the continuing whitewashing re-imagining of the societies history brings us to a study of things that have been discovered to be bad due to the ever increasing light shone upon the bible students.. this week we considered the cross and how the bible students used it for many years before discovering it's pagan roots and unacceptability in pure worship.. nothing new here.what got me was the end of the study where they used one of the parables of jesus and applied it in a weird way.. i was going to give my observations on it but tadua over at borean pickets did it nicely.... the god’s kingdom rules portion this week is chapter 10 para 12-19 pp.103-107.

the theme: ‘the king refines his people spiritually’.

this week’s portion deals with how the organization treated the cross.. like the issue of christmas, it took from the 1870’s to 1928, nearly 60 years for it to become clear the cross had no place in pure worship.

NikL

Another week of a "bible study" wherein the bible isn't studied.

The continuing whitewashing re-imagining of the societies history brings us to a study of things that have been discovered to be bad due to the ever increasing light shone upon the bible students.

This week we considered the cross and how the bible students used it for many years before discovering it's pagan roots and unacceptability in pure worship.

Nothing new here.

What got me was the end of the study where they used one of the parables of Jesus and applied it in a weird way.

I was going to give my observations on it but Tadua over at borean pickets did it nicely...

The God’s Kingdom Rules portion this week is Chapter 10 para 12-19 pp.103-107
The Theme: ‘The King Refines his People Spiritually’
This week’s portion deals with how the organization treated the Cross.
Like the issue of Christmas, it took from the 1870’s to 1928, nearly 60 years for it to become clear the cross had no place in pure worship. Yet in recent weeks, the claim was made that Christ inspected his people and accepted them as cleansed in 1919, some 9 years previously. The claim just does not hold water. It is another case of spiritual food not at the proper time, with all its implications for the Governing Body as a claimed faithful and discreet slave.
Talking about the Cross (including the use of the Crown and Cross pins) paragraph 14 states “We came to recognize that what we once cherished as symbolic or representative of the death of our Lord and of our Christian devotion was really a pagan symbol”. Have things changed? Not really, in the last few years, the icon JW.org has been promoted heavily. For many Kingdom Halls, the JW.org logo is the most prominent feature on the building’s sign. Casual passersby can be forgiven for thinking the Kingdom Hall is some corporate building or conference hall rather than a place of worship. In addition, while witnessing we are encouraged to point the public to JW.org for the answers instead of directly to the Bible. Do we see a pattern? Cross and Crown pin, Watchtower pin, JW.org pin. The desire to be identified by symbols instead of actions. We should be clearly identifiable by our Bible based conduct, not a piece of jewelry or a corporate style logo.
In paragraph 17 and 18, the kr book briefly examines Matthew 13:47-50. Once again a claim is made that some invisible work has been going on without any proof.
Matthew 13:48 states the “[fishermen] hauled it [the catch] up onto the beach, and sitting down, they collected the fine ones into vessels, but the unsuitable they threw away.”
“Unsuitable” is the translation from the Greek word sapros which means “rotten, useless, corrupt, depraved, overripe, overdone, unfit for use”. Bear this definition in mind as you read the following section to see that the original Greek word has a much stronger meaning than the NWT choice of “unsuitable”.
So the fishermen [angels] are harvesting, not crops but fish.
When are they separated? Immediately.
Does the following sound a bit far fetched? Is there any opportunity for the unsuitable fish to wiggle into the sea, swim off, metamorphose in to fine fish, and come and jump back into the net on the beach ready to be put into the vessels with the rest of the fine fish? Or are they thrown away, discarded as rotten, useless?
In Verse 49 Jesus gives the explanation as “in the conclusion of the system of things [Greek – the consummation of the age] the angels will go out and separate the wicked from among the righteous and will cast them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be”.
Is there any opportunity here for the wicked to say to the angels, “Wait a minute, I want go off to become righteous, then you can re-separate me, and not cast me into the furnace.”? No, there and then they are thrown into the symbolic fiery furnace—destruction, just like the weeds that are burned.
Now contrast the scripture verses you have just read with the explanation in paragraph 18: “Throwing away “the unsuitable” [note: It should be “the rotten fish”]. Throughout the last days [note: It should be the consummation or completion of the age, not a long time period], Christ and the angels have been separating ‘the wicked from among the righteous’”.
The footnote reads in part: “The separating of the fine fish from the unsuitable fish is not the same as the separating of the sheep from the goats.
Why not? No explanation is given or referred to as to why the different interpretation.
“The separating or final judgment, of the sheep and the goats takes place during the coming great tribulation. Until then, those who are like unsuitable fish may return to Jehovah and be gathered into containerlike congregations.” It also references Malachi 3:7 “‘Return to me, and I will return to you,’ Jehovah of armies has said. And you have said: ‘In what way shall we return?’” – par. 18
According to this, the way to return is: the rotten fish dying on the beach in the rubbish heap have a chance to wiggle into the sea, swim off, metamorphose into fine fish, return, and jump back into the net on the beach ready to be put into the vessels with the rest of the fine fish.
Is this not a perversion of the words of our Lord? A fine, instructional parable is being subverted to support the needs of the Organization.

Amen.

58

Just a quick Poll...Do you think the GB is sincere?

by NikL in

jw
friends

i've been thinking about this the past few days and curious what the honest consensus is here just for fun.. show of hands,.

is the governing body.... a: completely sincere.

they really do believe what they teach.. b: somewhat sincere.

NikL

I've been thinking about this the past few days and curious what the honest consensus is here just for fun.

Show of hands,

Is the Governing Body...

A: Completely Sincere. They really do believe what they teach.

B: Somewhat Sincere. They may have started out sincere but got jaded by power and money etc.

C: Completely insincere. They know they are teaching falsehoods and they either don't care or maybe that is their plan as per some of the conspiracy buffs among us.

D: Other...Please elaborate

10

WT about elder positions

by Gorbatchov in

jw
friends

yesterday, visited the hall for family reasons.. wt was about elder positions, educate younger brothers, delegate your work etc.

the usual story about the body of elders, give younger people a change and don't get atached to your position.

what was evident: 90 percent of the answers came from the sisters.. the elders looked like the house cat just eaten tweety.. never heared so much theory and knowing it will be fully ignored.. why make it a 45 minute issue for every tom, dick and harry?.

NikL

Yeah, it was a really weird study. As most are these days.

I was thinking about it during the study, that there used to be fairly deep if not accurate studies. At least they were targeted at the congregants at large.

These days the studies are pigeon holed to certain groups much of the time.

A while back they had a study targeted to those missionaries in foreign lands with heir children. How much more of a specialized audience can you get?

6

Why is the memorial Sometimes not on the Night of the passover?

by NikL in

jw
friends

do the jaydubs follow a different calendar?.

sometimes it is not in line with the jewish celebration and it should be no?.

NikL

Do the JayDubs follow a different calendar?

Sometimes it is not in line with the Jewish celebration and it should be no?

13

Russian Earthquake Forces Putin to Reconsider – Won’t Ban Jehovah’s Witnesses

by ILoveTTATT2 in

jw
friends

ap – april 1st, 2017. russian earthquake forces putin to reconsider – won’t ban jehovah’s witnesses.

in a stunning reversal of events, vladimir putin had an emergency meeting with all un members and made a proposition unbanning jehovah’s witnesses worldwide.. after the devastating 6.9 earthquake in eastern russia, and after receiving nearly one metric ton of letters from jehovah’s witnesses worldwide, putin changed his mind and decided not only to not ban jehovah’s witnesses in russia, but proposed to the un to remove all restrictions from jehovah’s witnesses worldwide.. surprisingly, jehovah’s witnesses were not pleased.. david a. ssholian, the spokesman for jehovah’s witnesses, said that “this reversal is a disaster for jehovah’s witnesses worldwide.

we just can’t be unbanned everywhere, that would be a severe blow for our faith.”

NikL

Bravo!

Very funny indeed. Almost Onion-ish.

I think people outside the English speaking world might not be familiar with the concept of April Fools though.

20

Interesting take on John 3:16

by NikL in

the superstar of all scriptures.

for god so loved the world that he gave his one and only son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.. .

but i just learned something about it.. i try to look at different translations of the bible and the lexham english bible words it a bit different.... 16 for in this way god loved the world, so that he gave his one and only son, in order that everyone who believes in him will not perish, but will have eternal life.

NikL

I think this kind of thinking outside the box nonsense is how people get involved with stupid cults .

Uh...okay. Thanks for that...I guess.

I can't see that it matters either way. If God loved the world at all, it wouldn't be in the state it's in.

Not sure I agree but okay.

Try reading it in The Message Bible.

Yes the Message bible in interesting to say the least. It is so paraphrased though. Makes many scriptures unrecognizable to me.

20

Interesting take on John 3:16

by NikL in

the superstar of all scriptures.

for god so loved the world that he gave his one and only son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.. .

but i just learned something about it.. i try to look at different translations of the bible and the lexham english bible words it a bit different.... 16 for in this way god loved the world, so that he gave his one and only son, in order that everyone who believes in him will not perish, but will have eternal life.

NikL

The superstar of all scriptures.

For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

But I just learned something about it.

I try to look at different translations of the bible and the Lexham English Bible words it a bit different...

16 For in this way God loved the world, so that he gave his one and only Son, in order that everyone who believes in him will not perish, but will have eternal life.

Note the difference?

I found a commentary about this and it makes sense...

The Greek word houtos, commonly translated in Jn 3:16 as "so" or "so much" occurs over 200 times in the NT. Almost without exception it is an adverb of manner, not degree (for example, see Mt 1:18). It only means "so much" when modifying an adjective (see Gal 3:3; Rev 16:18). Manner seems primarily in view in Jn 3:16. Some may think "so loved this world" as "God sooooo loved the world," while the Greek is referring to the manner that God loved the world.

I always understood it as god loved us soooo much that he gave his son. But now looking at this translation of verse 14 and 15...

And just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness,[f] thus it is necessary that the Son of Man be lifted up, 15 so that everyone who believes in him will have eternal life.”[g]

So the message seems to be Jesus is like the snake lifted up in the desert by Moses.

Many of you probably have considered this but it's a new idea to me.

Any thoughts from the scholars among us?

23

11. How can we show our support for the Messianic King? (From book study last night)

by NikL in

the study was on how wt has refined itself over the years by ceasing celebrations of christmas etc.. paragraph 11.

11 what a fine example those faithful bible students set for us!

reflecting on their example, we do well to ask ourselves: ‘how do i view the direction we receive from headquarters?

NikL

he threw bread into the bin after pouring gunk on it.

(GASP!) Spiritual food?

23

11. How can we show our support for the Messianic King? (From book study last night)

by NikL in

the study was on how wt has refined itself over the years by ceasing celebrations of christmas etc.. paragraph 11.

11 what a fine example those faithful bible students set for us!

reflecting on their example, we do well to ask ourselves: ‘how do i view the direction we receive from headquarters?

NikL

2014 I believe Steve