how could anyone feel good about a paradise built on the bodies of 6,000,000,000 massacred people?
how could you join this religion and feel like you are doing "the right thing", be happy about such a paradise, rejoice in its righteousness, goodness, and wholesomeness?
i can understand being raised (forced) in it, but joining it?!
I used to wonder what would happen if there were too many people ressurected to live comfortably on the one planet, but I put it to the back of my mind thinking that "Jehovah will know what to do"!
Crazy but I did! But that is what they ALL do, if there is a tough question, leave it to Jehovah. That way they NEVER use their own brains.
As soon as you do start using your brain and thinking for yourself, you have to leave the religion or your conscience will drive you insane.
Nowfree
since leaving the jws reality can be hard to get used to these are somethings i found hard to adapt to:.
1) starting to celebrate celebrations like birthdays and christmas(i dont mean that christmas is a disadvantage its just getting used to the whole idea).
2) tell others im not a jw because all i used to do is try to convert them and now im telling them i was mislead and dont beleive it anymore.. 3) should i swear,lie,etc.
Suddenly I had a lot of spare time to fill.
My weekly JW schedule was sort of like this:
Monday: full time work and then prestudy for the bookstudy in the evening.
Tuesday; full time work then meeting
Wednesday: full time work, and doing housework in the evening or preparing for a talk on the ministry school.
Thursday; full time work, and going to the meeting in the evening
Friday: full time work, and early night ready for ministry the following morning.
Saturday: ministry in the morning, felt knackered in the afternoon.
Sunday; meeting in the morning, ministry in the afternoon.
And then back to Monday!
After nearly two years of readjusting, I am going to try and do some social things after work, like going to the gym (or something!!). I also have more time to cook a decent meal in the evening, rather than a take-away at 10pm after the meeting!
Life is definitely more enjoyable, and with more purpose than ever before!
Nowfree
i am the mother of a 25yr.
old daughter...she has broken off her engagement to her young man..after discovering that they have a few differences in beliefs...she is sick at heart and so am i..after a year of dating they got engaged...then a year later..she dicovers he is an inactive jw...they lived together...and she has a two year old baby..he is not the father...but he is a wonderful man..and really was very good to her and my grandson...my grandson calls him daddy...well the issures started popping up...all of the sudden...he is a jw...and he doesnt celebrate...anything...not so much said..as he doesnt show for the festivities...sort of passive restance...long story short..they started discussing..issures..and my daughter freaks over the not accepting transfusions...her precious baby...not save his life!!
!...she is not a staunch christian...but she has absorbed beleifs having been raised in my church...now she is laying here with tears...and trying to figure out how they can make this work....he says that she can raise the baby in her beilfs...and they could just each beleive what they beleive...she is in that same mode..her heart hurts..and she wants to figure out a way that all this will work...she keeps asking me...she is twenty-five...i am her monther...i am heartsick...i want my daughters happiness...for the long haul...we discussed about the words warning of being unevenly yoked...i was hoping prehaps she could get some of your experinces....and your insight....thank you....
Hello Waido,
My marriage broke up for the same reasons - I was a JW, my exhusband still is a JW, and our daughter required open heart surgery. Obviously the blood issue came up - I couldn't agree with it, and a month after our return from the hospital I just stopped attending all the meetings. Because of my fears of my daughter being brainwashed into beliving the JW teaching on refusing blood I asked my husband NOT to take her to meetings. He agreed for about 4 months, and then became very objectionable, abusive, and took her to meetings. He also asked me to leave our home. The police advised that I take my daughter and stay with my parents (also exJWS). I ended up taking him to court to get an order preventing him involving our daughter in any JW activities while she is with him, he also is not allowed to prevent medical staff administering treatment they see fit (obvoiusly including blood transfusions).
I tried really hard to get the JW and non JW thing to work, compromising as far as I could without it endangering my daughters physical or long term mental health. But the JW way of life is so restrictive and controlling that compromise DOESN'T WORK. They are not allowed to do it. Life styles and principles are so different.
JWs are not allowed to socialise with exJWS, especially those who are disfellowshipped. This can cause major conflict. All family social gatherings were a a problem. His family wouldn't be able to socialise with me, and my husband wasn't able to socialise with my family (one friend in particular who is DF). We had NOTHING in common. Plus the fact that he doesn't have the intelligence to think issues through - just gets cross immediately, and refuses to listen because everything I would say is "apostate thinking", and the shutters come down straight away.
So now he is living with his parents and I am pursuing divorce proceedings.
All I can advise is that don't try to compromise with a JW because they will NEVER meet you halfway, at least not if they are doing what a JW should be doing.
If you can, draw a line underneath it, treat it as an experience, and start again.
If you need any further info, just ask, and ((((((((((((((((hugs)))))))))))))))) to all of you!
Nowfree
ajwrb was approached early on about working together on these issues.
we took a hard look and opted out for ethical and pragmatic reasons.
though the issues share a common thread (child abuse), they have to be approached in different ways.
I agree that we do live in a democratic world and people do have the right to choose treatment for themselves. However, when an individual is one of Jehovah's Witnesses, they DO NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO CHOOSE TO RECEIVE A BLOOD TRANSFUSION OF ONE OF THE FOUR PRIMARY COMPONENTS WITHOUT LIVE CHANGING RAMIFICATIONS FROM THE RELIGION.
The JW Public Affairs Office issued a Statement to the Media on 14th June 2000, it states "If a baptized member of the faith wilfully and without regret accepts blood transfusions he indicates by his own actions that he no longer wishes to be one of Jehovah's Witnesses. The individual revokes his own membership by his own actions, rather than the congregation initiating the step. This represents a procedural change insitituted in April 2000 in which the congregation no longer initiates the action to revoke membership in such cases. However, the end result is the same, the individual is no longer viewed as one of Jehovah's Witnesses because he no longer accepts and follows a core tenet of the faith."
That statement was issued following the case that went to the European Court of Human Rights (Application no 28626/95 "Christian Association Jehovah's Witnesses v Bulgaria). The applicant (WT Society) "undertook with regard to its stance on blood transfusions to draft a statement for inclusion in its statute providing that members should have free choice in the matter for themselves and their children, without any control or sanction on the part of the association".
That effectively meant that they could no longer DISFELLOWSHIP an individual for accepting a blood transfusion. But the WT Society publicly announced that if an individual accepted a blood transfusion, he would "revoke his own membership by his own actions, rather than the congregation initiating the step". So the end result is the same. The individual would be shunned, cut off from the congregation, from family, from friends.
The Watchtower Society lied to the European Court of Human Rights because THERE IS NO FREE CHOICE IN THE MATTER, THERE ARE CONTROLS AND SANCTIONS. Hypocrites!
Any Jehovah's Witness from the age of 10 and upwards would understand the ramifications of accepting a blood transfusion. They would be cut off from the congregation, if they are not a minor then they may lose their family, home and friends. The pressure to REFUSE a blood transfusion because of such threats would be strong.
In this situation any decision made by a patient would not be made without fear of such ramifications.
Medical staff would have to get the consent of any adult and "older child" before the procedure is carried out.
The following is an interesting point based on Case Law (UK Mental Health Act 1983) which highlights were "consent given by a child" for refusal or treatment may not accurately reflect the INDIVIDUALS TRUE WISHES:
Section 55 (Part IV of the MHA 83) 1-629
(4) For a child to be able to give informed consent, they have to be deemed to be "Gillick competent" - if the treating doctor concludes that the child has reached an age where she has sufficient understanding and intelligence to enable her to understand fully what is proposed and to be capable of making up her mind on the matter. The child must be able to understand the nature of the proposed treatment, its side effects and the consequences of not receiving it. IT is therefore possible for a child to be found to be competent to make a decision in respect of a treatment that may have minor consequences, but not to be competent to make a decision in respect of a treatment that may have major consequences.
(5) The clinician needs to consider whether the decision is really that of the child. "The real question in each case is. "Does the patient really mean what he says or is he merely saying it for a quiet life, to satisfy someone else or because the advice and persuasion to which he has been subjected is such that he can no longer think and decide for himself?" IN other words, "is it a decision expressed in form only ,not in reality?" (per Lord Donaldson M.R in Re T (Adult: Refusal of Medical Treatment) 1992 All ER 649,662. His Lordship further stated that when considering the effect of outside influences, two aspects can be of "crucial importance". The are "the strenght of will of the patient" and the "relationship of the 'persuader' to the patient". With regard to the latter his Lordship said that the "influence of parents on their children can be, but is by no means necessarily, much stronger than would be the case in other relationships".
(9) There have been a number of occsions when the court has used this jurisdiction to override the wishes of parents who are Jehovah's Witnesses who have refused consent to life-saving blood transfusion for their children; see for example, ReE (A Minor)(Wardship: Medical Treatment) (1993) 1FLR 386. Per Ward J at 394 : The court, exercising its prerogative of protection should be very slow to allow an infant to martyr itself".
I thought it fascinating that Jehovah's Witnesses are specifically mentioned in this Section. It highlighted to me how aware the authorities are of the real dangers posed to children by this cult.
Nowfree
if my plans work out i will be there.
hope to see you all!
iw
I won't be able to attend, but I , along with LOTS of others are mailing our support!
Nowfree
UK
there has been a good response from people willing to volunteer to show support for silentlambs.
volunteers are coming forward from the uk, usa, canada and norway.
more volunteers are needed!
There has been a good response from people willing to volunteer to show support for Silentlambs.
Volunteers are coming forward from the UK, USA, Canada and Norway.
More volunteers are needed! Whatever anyone can do will be greatly appreciated.
Can you help? Please email me ([email protected]) or Anglise for further details.
Nowfree
my hands are still shaking.
i read the nyt article and wanted everyone in the world to read it!
i started brainstorming how can those around me know about all these terrible events.........so, i got online and sent and email to our local paper.
Well done to both of you!!
We are currently doing a distribution in support of silentlambs. Bill Bowen is in support of this. Full details are not on the board, but if you would like to join in, please email me!
Bill Bowen has started a movement where exJWs and others are rising up against the Watchtower Society for the first time ever. Let's keep this going so the Governing Body and their henchmen continue to feel the pressure.
Lets give em hell! Make them realise the suffering they have caused, in lots of different ways, to thousands and thousands of people around the world who trusted them.
Nowfree
we are going to have an extensive article in the new york times this sunday.
there is an early addition that comes out in most cities around on saturday.
i encourage one and all to get your copy and do not miss the important piece of history.
Well done Bill and everyone who helped with the New york times article!!!
btw - just to check - what date are you holding the rally in new york?
(sorry the capital letters are all wrong, my shift key is giving up!)
nowfree
as most of you already know, the jehovah's witnesses are covering an article in their august kingdom ministry to be discussed the weeks of 8/19 and 8/26 which details how they are to shun and avoid those who are no longer members of their organization, even immediate family members.. .
undoubtedly this article has been written to reinforce to the rank&file jehovah's witnesses the shunning policy, so as to tighten the ranks and prevent members from having the opportunity to learn the abundant contradictions and hypocrisies found within watchtower doctrine and practice from any who may have left.. this policy also serves to divide families and attempt to shame or abuse those whom have chosen to no longer be jehovah's witnesses, for whatever reason.. that much is obvious.
in recent days this topic has been discussed in detail in various threads.
I left the WTBTS in October 2000, and separated from my JW husband in July 01. haven't been DA'd or DF'd (can't think why, i haven't exactly been keeping a low profile!).
I have been shunned by JWs in the street, JW neighbours won't even look at me (these neighbours of mine are just like the Flanders family from the Simpsons!!)
My JW (soon to be ex)mother-in-law saw me and my four year old in a supermarket the other week. (Soon to be ex)Mother in law saw us, turned the shopping trolley around, and walked quickly in the other direction, dragging my (soon to be ex) father in law in tow. I had to laugh, they are elderly , my father in law uses a stick, it got all caught up in the trolley and caused confusion because he hadn't got a clue what she was up to and why they were suddenly turning round!!!
But it made my daughter cry and say "There is my nanny". She couldn't understand why her nanny wouldn't want to talk to her. Don't worry folks - I explained it to her as best I could.
To make a child cry just to comply with the JW shunning rules is TOTALLY UNFORGIVEABLE.
But then my (soon to be ex) mother in law isn't a nice individual anyway - fully of duty towards family, but no real feeling of love for them. The JW organisation suits her down to the ground.
Nowfree
just curious as to who is single and who is not on this board.i have been with my boyfriend going on 3 years now.
we just moved in together in feb.for the most part we get along great but he has some weird habits.he also thinks i spend too much time on this site(which i do...but heck i finally belong!!
)so its hard to relate to him on the subject.he thinks i should just forget about it.sometimes i think i might be better off with someone who has more or less been where i have.
Elsewhere: Trouble is that now i know what I want and what I definitely DO NOT WANT!!
I am not going to play metaphorical nurse maid to another unaffectionate, nasty idiot!
But I am enjoying life at the moment - my time is my own (well sort of!), and my life no longer revolves around meeting attendance and field ministry!
EXCELLENT!!
Nowfree
