Posts by OBVES

21

Are Jehovah's Witnesses Chrsitians?

by TimothyT in

despite being a jw for 20 years, this has just flashed up into my mind?.

of course jesus is important in the lives of jw's, but they worship jehovah!.

hence, are they christians or jehovians?.

OBVES

When the first christians were there was no such a book like the Bible we have today.There were holy lwritings cirulcated among them like in a loose form.

We may wonder why the original writings were even lost and we don't have them today ? May be they were only for the people living at that time .

So again we must use the logic to try to figure out if there are reasons we may have to use the Bible in our times and how.

Once,we establish that we are in the endtime era we must link our times to the times when Jesus and his first disciples lived and taught a new religion.

So , we must superimpose the dates from that time into our times :

7 BC = 1879 AD,2 BC = 1884 AD.

29 AD - 33 AD - 36 AD = 1914 AD - 1918 AD - 1921 AD.

99 AD - 103 AD - 106 AD = 1984 AD - 1988 AD - 1991 AD .

Now we can know that the holy writings from that time can be applied to our times we live .

If we had false christians religions between 150 AD and 1874 AD we can say the Bible was not for these religions as it was written for the true christians !

21

Are Jehovah's Witnesses Chrsitians?

by TimothyT in

despite being a jw for 20 years, this has just flashed up into my mind?.

of course jesus is important in the lives of jw's, but they worship jehovah!.

hence, are they christians or jehovians?.

Jesus was speaking the words you are quoting to his first disciples !They were going to preach to the utter parts of the world and Jesus promised to them he would be with them always . To the end of the world means to the upper parts of the world which was the Roman Empire at that time considered to be the whole world - Luke 2.1. It is not about the time ( end of the world you mean ) but the end of the world meaning the places they would go to !To the end of the world = to the upper parts of the world ( region ) which can be understood as the end of the Roman Empire where it ends in space .

There was not a single true christian church after 150 AD. However it is possible there some individuals from time to time God considered to be His people and that would imply that Jesus was present in the world whenever a true worshippers was found for all centuries that can be called dark ages .

The heresies spread all over the Roman Empire .

We stick to the Bible and once it was completed we don't have to go into details of any church after that untill we come to the times when the endtime era kicks in .

If we don't have an endtime era now .. no church on earth can be proven true ! But once we prove we live in the endtime era we must track down by dates which religion is related to that era as a God's true organization .

And then we have an easy way to identify that true christian organization.It is Jehovah's Witnesses today .No other christian church on this earth comes close to link them to the endtime era this unique way .

This religious organization must be some 120 years old as it leads the nations to salvation as it builds the ark of salvation in the likeness of Noah's time - Genesis 6.3;Matthew 24.37-39.

We ignore all religions that existed from 150 AD to 1874 AD .We begin anew as the understandining of the Bible is given to God's people .

We must prove that the Bible was written for us also ,not only for those who lived prior to the year 150 AD.

Unless we use proper calculations based on the Bible we may not be able to prove that unless we get some breakthrough understandings of the Bible .

Popular belief in literal hell for centuries proves we had false religions and Jesus Christ was not there .

If you don't have calculations and resulting dates to prove we are in the endtime era you will not prove the Bible is for our times .

For instance , Paul wrote a letter to Thessalonians .You will not prove it was a letter written to you or any other person in our time.It was written to Thessalonians .

492

607 wrong using ONLY the bible (and some common sense)

by Witness My Fury in

if this has been covered before i apologise in advance.

using only the bible and a bit of common sense.. ok, here goes:.

do the "seventy years" count from jerusalems destruction or not?

OBVES

You cannot build the chronology unless you are a true servant of God Yahweh .It is they to whom God reveals His secrets.

The dates 607 BC and 537 BC like other dates : 4027 BC,4010 BC ,2492 BC,2372 BC,1517 BC,1513 BC,1512 BC,1467 BC,1037 BC,1034 BC,1027 BC,587 BC,517 BC are irrefutable.

Exactly 3500 years from 1517 BC,1513 BC lands us on 1984 AD - 1988 AD .

From 587 BC 70 weeks as 7 times 2520 years + 2520 days + 70 years = 2011 AD.

517 BC + 7 weeks as 2520 years ( + 2520 days ) + 7 years = 2011 AD - 2018 AD.

492

607 wrong using ONLY the bible (and some common sense)

by Witness My Fury in

if this has been covered before i apologise in advance.

using only the bible and a bit of common sense.. ok, here goes:.

do the "seventy years" count from jerusalems destruction or not?

OBVES

OBVES I find this calculation works MUCH better:

666SLd-16jzkjabdfkj~*PQ=F(APAD'A-38UPO8FHSDFHLej9er58jS)/(;Mc+2) [ASshfpq8&££q!] +

--/ It looks you are very veri furious, truly furious !

You have no slightest idea what I am presenting here .

The date 607 BC is a code giveby God Yahweh to the true christains who studied the Bible earnestly and try to establish chronology .

They came up withn the date 607 BC and it is established as such .And we must stick to that date .

You don't understand that the date 607 BC can be found by the use of the most important date in our times before Jesus comes back and it was the year 1984 AD .By using that year as the beginning point the biblical chronology can be trace.

I don't need anyone' historical proofs I can use the year 1984 AD when the most important understanding of 70 and 7 weeks of Danile as projected into far future occured.

70 weeks as 7 times + 70 years and 7 weeks as 7 times 7 years .

1984 AD - 7 times as 2520 years - 70 years = 607 BC.

1984 AD - 7 times as 2520 years = 537 BC and 1984 AD + 7 years = 1991 AD.

21

Are Jehovah's Witnesses Chrsitians?

by TimothyT in

despite being a jw for 20 years, this has just flashed up into my mind?.

of course jesus is important in the lives of jw's, but they worship jehovah!.

hence, are they christians or jehovians?.

OBVES

If you believe Jehovah's Witnesses are not christians after reading my proofs they are the true christians you are hypnotized by Satan.

It is obvious we must have a period of 120 years counted before Jesus comes back and there is no religion that can be linked by proper dating to that period and will not be in my view in the near future while we are closing in on important period of 2000 years after Jesus that is a requirement for Jesus' return as well .

If we go to 33 AD as the last year Jesus was alive and add 2000 years we get 2033 AD which would be the latest date for his second return.

And we must count 120 years to be in line with Matthew 24.37-39 ;Genesis 6.3 .

2033 AD - 120 years = 1913 AD .

So ,there had to be the true christian religion in existence at that time that would begin building of the spiritual ark of 120 years .

No other religion than the International Bible Students fit in ! And they ceased to exist but we must have a continuation of building that spiritual ark and Jehovah's Witnesses by holding to the name watchtower got their legitimacy to continue that process.

Good indicators that these two represent God Yahweh in building that ark is : two basic teachings from the very beginning of their respective existence :

God Jehovah is the only true God and he is the Father of Jesus Christ .

There is no literal hot hell .On this one alone , most religions ( all the mainstream religions included ) are dead wrong and false and will be the thing of the past this year if Jesuc comes back as predicted.

Jehovah's Witnesses are the true christian organization from bottom to the top .

119

Validity of 607 BCE date

by stevieb1 in

jw
friends

has anyone on here ever come across the tiniest shred of evidence supporting this date for the fall of jerusalem.

i understand rolf furuli is about to but something out on this subject (see elihubooks.com), however even a table of contents has been a long time in coming from this site.

if no evidence exists what can he possibly be writing about?

OBVES

Because we see the date 2011 AD as more stressed in calculations above we can do this:

1878 AD + 66 years + 1 years + 66 years where this period 1944 AD - 1945 AD is a special year ( counted doubly ).

1878 AD + 66 years = 1944 AD .1944 AD - 1945 AD representing Jesus in the Center . 1945 AD + 66 years = 2011 AD .

Then we have from 607 BC ... 607 ... 6 and 7 this way :

1878 AD + 6 years = 1884 AD ... 2004 AD + 7 years = 2011 AD .

1884 AD - 2004 AD = 120 years and we have extra 7 years for 7 days from Noah's times - Genesis 6.3 ; 7.1-4.

Ezekiel 4.6 : 1 day = 1 year.

We can use as extra information the application of 607 BC as 607 in this fashion of 6x7=42 years .

1878 AD + 42 years = 1920 AD . 1920 AD + 42 years = 1962 AD . 1962 AD + 42 years = 2004 AD .

Also as :

1878 AD + 42 years = 1920 AD + 42 years = 1962 AD . 1950 AD + 42 years = 1992 AD . 1992 AD + 42 years = 2034 AD.

1878 AD + 42 years ..... 30 years ... 12 years .... 30 years .... 42 years = 2034 AD .

1878 AD ... 1920 AD ... 1950 AD ... 1962 AD ..... 1992 AD ....... 2034 AD .

119

Validity of 607 BCE date

by stevieb1 in

jw
friends

has anyone on here ever come across the tiniest shred of evidence supporting this date for the fall of jerusalem.

i understand rolf furuli is about to but something out on this subject (see elihubooks.com), however even a table of contents has been a long time in coming from this site.

if no evidence exists what can he possibly be writing about?

OBVES

The true christians came up with the dates 607 BC and 587 BC and 537 BC . This is was God's given understanding that cannot be refuted even if simeone who opposes true christians proves from history the dates are different.

607 BC serves as a code to understand the chronology given by God and pinpoint the endtimes .

607 BC can be transformed into : 60 and 7 which is 67 and 6 and 7 which is 13 .

The Bible should have 66 books which is God's Word and Jesus is God's Word and we place: 66 years for the Bible and 1 years for Jesus.

67 can be viewed as 1+66 or 66+1 .

607 BC + 7 times as 2520 years lead to 1914 AD and the shorter version in prophetic terms can be shorter 30 , 35 or 36 years .

1914 AD - 30 years = 1884 AD. 1914 AD - 35 years = 1879 AD ; 1914 AD - 36 years = 1878 AD.

1878 AD + 1 years + 66 years = 1945 AD + 66 years + 1 year = 2012 AD.

1878 AD + 6 years from 607 ( 6 ) = 1884 AD. 2005 AD + 7 years from 607 ( 7 that is at the end of 607 ) we get 2012 AD.

http://www.focusonthebible2011.com .

6x7 from 607 BC = 607 as 6 and 7 = 42 years which is also " 7 times " .

607 BC + " 7 times " as 2520 years as "7 times " can mean 2520 years and 42 years too = 1914 AD .

587 BC .... 5+8+7 = 20.

1914 AD + 20 years = 1934 AD .

587 BC + " 7 times " as 2520 years = 1934 AD.

70 weeks from Daniel 9.24 can be seen here :

587 BC + 70 weeks as " 7 times" //+// 70 days or 70 years ( Ezekiel 4.6 : 1 day as 1 year ) = 2004 AD.

607 BC + 70 weeks as " 7 times" //+// 70 days or 70 years = 1984 AD.

537 BC + 7 weeks of Daniel 9.25 can be seen here as :

537 BC + " 7 times " as 2520 years + 7 years = 1991 AD.

1991 AD + 20 years = 2011 AD .

607 BC - 537 BC = 70 years = 587 BC - 517 BC .

517 BC + 7 weeks as 2520 years + 7 years = 2011 AD .

492

607 wrong using ONLY the bible (and some common sense)

by Witness My Fury in

if this has been covered before i apologise in advance.

using only the bible and a bit of common sense.. ok, here goes:.

do the "seventy years" count from jerusalems destruction or not?

OBVES

You go by what date the Watchtower came to as through them God is working in the endtimes.

It is 607 BC regardless what date you may come up .

607 BC ... 6x7=42 and 6+7=13 .

And now we can use a variety of applications of these numbers in the endtime era :

42 years and 13 years: 1878 AD + 42 years = 1920 AD. 1920 AD + 42 years = 1962 AD ; 1962 AD + 42 years = 2004 AD .

1878 AD + 13 years = 1891 AD ; 1934 AD + 13 years = 1947 AD.

1950 AD + 42 years = 1992 AD . 1992 AD + 42 years = 2034 AD .

1991 AD + 13 years = 2004 AD .

42 represents " 7 times " too . 7 weeks as 7 times 7 days/years = 49 years = " 7 times " as 42 years + 7 years = 49 years.

1991 AD - 7 weeks as 7 times as 2520 years + 7 years = 537 BC .

1984 AD - 70 weeks as 7 times + 70 years = 607 BC.

http://www.focusonthebible2011.com.

52

Camping tells all tonight!!

by moshe in

jw
friends

yes, the dates are correct, proofs are correct and judgment day came on may 21- but it was an invisible spiritual judgment- the end of the world is still coming on oct 21. harold egbert camping has just explained the truth to the world 5 minutes ago..

OBVES

Incognita you did not recognita that we are living in the very endtime era and that it looks like there will be race with people making predictions.

I thought Harold Camping will be done but hearing him last night on his first appearance on Open Forum alive after May 21 ,2011 he came out as very strong . He built a huge Family Radio Stations and wrote many publications which he will not allow simply to die out .

BY moving Rapture to October 21 he almost keeps many good points he had made almost untouched .

Today on May 24 he is going to face a reality check to some degree when listeners will be calling .Just tune in and hear Harold Camping answering .

52

Camping tells all tonight!!

by moshe in

jw
friends

yes, the dates are correct, proofs are correct and judgment day came on may 21- but it was an invisible spiritual judgment- the end of the world is still coming on oct 21. harold egbert camping has just explained the truth to the world 5 minutes ago..

OBVES

I heard it ! Harold Camping was back and may be the record number of people watched him last night which was his first appearance on Open Forum after failed proclamation concerning May 21,2011 . Almost nothing changed just the right date is now October 21 ,2011 which could have been expected .

He was mistaken ! Just tune to his Open Forum repeat by using ivi.tv or
something else and you can hear it : it is October 21 -the Last Day; and the
mass media in his studio heard it !
The Rapture was simply moved to October 21 ,2011 and it is so easy to
understand . I myself was convinced that the date October 21 ,2011 was
a better date than May 21,2011 .
The Judgement Day came on May 21 ,2011 as it was proclaimed but it
happened in a spiritual way ! No more billboards ,no more caravans
the world knows it nowthat it came under the judgement on May 21,2011.
I would assume from that there is no more salvation for anyone who was
not saved untill May 21 ,2011 .

On October 21,2011 Camping says the world will be destroyed .
Tune tomorrow for Open Forum .It will a regular program ( alive )
with listeners calling for the first time after
May 21,2011 . The whole world should be listening in my view .
I am going to record Camping tomorrow on audio tape .It will be a
historic Open Forum.

But let me make it clear !
This May 21 ,2011 could have been also a Judgement Day on Camping and
his followers as they hold some horrible unaccepatble doctrines God
Yahweh rejects .And that day may be a good warning to anyone building
predictions about Jesus' coming in oppositon to Jehovah's Witnesses
who hold the sway in this field as they are covered by the period of
120 years that is a requirement given in the Bible : if there is an
endtime era it must be in the likeness of Noah's days of the flood
when Noah was building the ark for 120 years and there were also 7
days which can also mean 7 years if we know one day may be like a year
- Ezekiel 4.6.

No other religion or individuals who oppose Jehovah's Witnesses can
lay a claim on this awesome sign - Matthew 24.37-39. Only of God
Yahweh we can know that we live in a day and hour when endtimes are in
place and true worshippers of God Yahweh should expect the glorious
return of Jesus who will remove the wicked from the face of the earth
and God's Kingdom rule will be established on the face of our earth .

1884 AD + 120 years + 7 years = 2011 AD + 23 years = 2034 AD ( 1914 +
120 years = 2034 )
2034 ... 1000-year Sabbath Day ... 3034 AD .

September 29,2011 should begin this awesome era with a period of 23
days ending on October 21,2011.
Note these 23 days may represent two periods :
1988 - 2011 = 23 years = 2011 - 2034 .
It may be that these period September 29- October 21 ,2011 will be the
most glorious period in mankind's history and Jehovah's Witnesses seem
to stand to be winners .
They see clear differences between God Yahweh who is the only true GOD
and Jesus who can be called God .
GOD and God are two different beings here . You have to study my posts
to get insight into this matter.

http://www.focusomnthebible2011.com .

On the website I recommend you go to a google group alt.bible. Do just that to get the whole picture .

http://www.focusonthebible2011.com .