Hi Change, yes I did get into that somewhat when we were on the topic of the Governing Body. I told them flat out that disagreement with or even questioning anything the GB says is forbidden and will result in disfellowshipping. I didn't go in the direction you did, but that would have fit in with my position in the conversation that they are a high control cult very well.
Posts by NCO
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22Time for an Intervention
by NCO income this july, i will have been out of the jw's for 20 years.
and it has been quite a long time since i've really spent any serious time studying up on jw news and doctrines although i do still read here occasionally.
but after today looks like i've got some work to do.. my first sergeant called me this morning asking for my help to fix his dad's truck as i'm an auto technician in my civilian job.
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22
Time for an Intervention
by NCO income this july, i will have been out of the jw's for 20 years.
and it has been quite a long time since i've really spent any serious time studying up on jw news and doctrines although i do still read here occasionally.
but after today looks like i've got some work to do.. my first sergeant called me this morning asking for my help to fix his dad's truck as i'm an auto technician in my civilian job.
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NCO
Come this July, I will have been out of the JW's for 20 years. And it has been quite a long time since I've really spent any serious time studying up on JW news and doctrines although I do still read here occasionally. But after today looks like I've got some work to do.
My First Sergeant called me this morning asking for my help to fix his dad's truck as I'm an auto technician in my civilian job. So being that I had nothing else to do, I took a drive up to where they live. Turns out that the parts store sold him the wrong belt for the application and their catalog was wrong. Luckily I found the right belt and got it running. So scored some points with "Top".
After the job was done, we went inside and sat down for a while to relax. And what do I see but his entire coffee table is COVERED with Watchtower and Awake magazines. I looked at Top and then at his dad, both prior Marines, and asked his dad "are you or your wife Witnesses?" and of course Top started laughing.
His dad (Top Seinor) said no, that he is just studying with them. And then went on to tell me how he is seeing that they're really right about things and how they're not as bad as people say they are.
I said "well I was one. For 20 years."
Top said "boy am I glad I got you to come over! I never knew that you were one!" I told him that I'd found out our recently retired Command Sergeant Major used to be one as well. Small world!
So for about the next hour I politely talked about everything I could remember from what I'd learned here as well as Freeminds. After everything I told him, he became a little more surprised and would say "wow they never said anything about that!" At the end of it, I asked for his email address to send him links to info he should know about. I said most Witnesses don't even know their own history.
His wife was in the other room on the computer but she was listening and when got to the part about the Governing Body, she came out and jumped in on the conversation. They'd attended the Memorial and had it explained to them why no one partook. That really bothered both of them, the wife especially, and especially how the Governing Body places themselves as the only true channel between God and JW's and how only they have the "truth".
I gave Top a ride home and he said how glad things had just happened to work out to where I'd be there today, not for the truck but for the JW stuff. Maybe sometimes things do happen for a reason.
Soooooo.......Going to be surfing Freeminds and gathering up some research to email to Top's parents. Their JW bible study is going to get a real earful come next Wednesday!
I'm going to try and keep it as simple as possible. I know, simple is never an easy option when dealing with this kind of thing but he's a Marine so simple works best. (had to get that jab in! ha ha!) Besides, simple works best for me too. I'm going to keep it to mainly just what we talked about:
1. Their history as a breakaway group from the 7th Day Adventists
2. Predictions of Jesus' return
3. Beth Sarim
4. The long list of "you can't do..."
5. The pedophile coverup (hoping that episode of Dateline is available online)
If anyone has any suggestions, I'd sure appreciate anything you can offer.
Hooah!
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Please can we all have a go at describing and celebrating our different NEW IDENTITIES, versus our OLD WBTS IDENTITY?
by Fernando inat one time most of us here identified as jws who follow the wbts gb/fds who claim to follow the bible etc.
some of us are journeying to a new identity, others may feel they already have a new identity.. although we likely have gone in many different directions, we share a common past which only ex-members can really understand and explain.
please could we each respectfully share and celebrate our unique perspectives of where we have come from, and where we each are now at on this journey?.
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NCO
Old: Fearful of eternal death for not conforming in every little detail to cultish group-think. Fearful of individuality and creativity. Never willing to stand up for the outsiders and black sheep. Cared more for the organization than for those who actually comprised the rank and file.
New: Gladly listen to all sides of every issue and make up my own mind. Not afraid to be the first to suggest something new and unorthodox. Willing to give my life to protect everyone, even those who aren't JW's, when their rights and lives are threatened. Know that every organization has some truly idiotic jacked up soup sandwiches in leadership positions and after the JW's I am no longer afraid to stand up for those affected by their jacked-upedness even when it could cost me a stripe or promotion.
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50
What's The Worst Thing An Elder or Elders Did To You?
by minimus inwas there anything truly terrible??
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NCO
When I was a teenager (14-15 or so) some Barney Fife type elder moved to our congregation which was already a hate-filled place to begin with. As the oldest teen in the congo and the son of a prominent elder, I was a 50 meter target for him and he made it his life's mission to go after me in order to play politics in the body of elders against my dad.
He spent years spreading rumors about me in both our congregation as well as the neighboring congregations even though at the time I was trying my hardest to be a good JW. I lost my best friend and many other friends.
For a long time, I was called into elders meetings literally every Thursday night to get bitched at for stuff I didn't do and for reasons that were never backed up by any hard evidence. I learned too late not to ask for specifics. Saying "Brother so-and-so, just tell me what it was specifically that I did so that I can not do it again" was met with anger and lecturing.
It came to a head one summer Sunday when I was 19 and auxiliary pioneering. My dad got called to a special elders meeting and was nearly waterboarded. He came home and didn't say a word about it. Finally the next day he couldn't hold it in any more and just let it all out while we were at work. I would stop at the Post Office to pick up mail while in service. Apparently that was a mortal sin. I listened to "worldly music" and the grand tin-foil-hat conspiracy theory was that I had 2 collections of music; one that my parents knew of and another that was secret. I had "worldly friends". And the greatest of all, I was up to something but the persecuting elder just didn't know exactly what.
Yes I did stop at the Post Office to pick up mail. I didn't count the time. I was raised to be very meticulous about counting time. It took all of 5 minutes if that but I didn't count it.
Yes I listened to worldly music. 80's hair bands were and are my favorites. My parents knew every tape in my collection. My dad thought Def Leppard's one-armed drummer was very cool. There was no secret collection. Because I removed every "worldly" music tape from my car before going in service with the persecuting elder, that constituted reasonable and articulable suspicion on his part for making the accusation.
The "worldly friends" accusation came from the fact that I got along with nearly everyone in high school. While the JW kids shunned me (thanks to the persecuting elder) I got more invites to parties and everything else from the evil wicked mean and nasty kids in high school than from my fellow JW's. Therefore, I was the one in the wrong.
And the whole "up to something" was pure bovine excrement. This particular jacked up d-bag elder actually went so far as to try and follow me around town. Stupid move on his part as he drove an old van loaded down with carpet cleaning equipment and I drove a rather powerful sedan made when Mopar actually meant something.
That one meeting was the beginning of my exit. The elder who met with my family to "apologize" (if you can call it that) basically said that I had to just suck it up and drive on and that no damage control would be done.
I look back now at all that crap as an NCO and try to learn how not to treat people. I guess I have the JW's to thank for making me a better platoon sergeant.
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15
"Hospitality"?
by NCO inhad to meet my parents not too long ago for some family business and while working out the time for that sunday, they said they had the meeting and then following the meeting they had "hospitality" for an hour or so.. now i've been out for going on 20 years and somewhat out of the loop.
needless to say i've never heard of that.
i've been to other churches where they have the sanctuary and then the fellowship hall where the members go and eat after the service.
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NCO
Gotcha. I didn't realize they had an official name for it now.
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NCO
When I was between 16 and maybe 19 or so, reporting me to the elders was the main passtime of our congregation. When the "cottage industry" was at its peak, I was in an elders meeting literally every Thursday night. And the stupid thing is, it was all over vague complaints and innuendo that had no basis in fact because back then I really wasn't doing anything.
Getting reported is just another method the JW's have of maintaining control through fear. No different from the way the Nazis and East Germans and every other dictatorship throughout history has turned citizens against each other to maintain control.
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"Hospitality"?
by NCO inhad to meet my parents not too long ago for some family business and while working out the time for that sunday, they said they had the meeting and then following the meeting they had "hospitality" for an hour or so.. now i've been out for going on 20 years and somewhat out of the loop.
needless to say i've never heard of that.
i've been to other churches where they have the sanctuary and then the fellowship hall where the members go and eat after the service.
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NCO
Had to meet my parents not too long ago for some family business and while working out the time for that Sunday, they said they had the meeting and then following the meeting they had "hospitality" for an hour or so.
Now I've been out for going on 20 years and somewhat out of the loop. Needless to say I've never heard of that. So what exactly is it? I've been to other churches where they have the sanctuary and then the fellowship hall where the members go and eat after the service. I know KH's don't have "fellowship halls" so hopefully someone can explain this to me.
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NCO
Hey and thanks for the welcomes. I'll try to behave.
Interesting story about what a small world it is. Last month I was TDY at Fort Stewart, training some new recruits. I was in the barracks talking with the Command Sergeant Major who is Commandant of 5th BDE Schools. We were talking about the dress uniform neckties and I mentioned how I hadn't worn a tie since I was a JW knocking on doors 20 years ago. He said "you were a Witness?! I was a Witness!"
We got to talking about who we both knew and in all probablility, the two of us probably met at a meeting or assembly back in the day.
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NCO
Hi all. I joined JWN back when it was JWD a long time ago. Been gone a long time since then and my old account is probably still active but I can't for the life of me remember the password. And I just don't care to use that account any more, time for a fresh start. (Simon and mods, go ahead and deactivate the legendary you-know-who account, erect a memorial, burn it in effigy, bury it with honors, hold a kegger at the gravesite, whatever.)
Ok here goes.
Born a JW, raised a JW, got fired at age 20 and put it in my rearview mirror literally because I was kicked out of my parents home. I got into the "ex-JW" world maybe 10 or 11 years ago and hung around here and other boards. Made some very dear friends who I stay in touch with today. Made a few enemies along the way as well. We all eventually grew past that, and I thank a member here for helping me patch things up with some folks.
I tried to believe all the doctrines of the JW's while growing up no matter how wacky because I had to explain them and defend them when I went knocking on doors. As I got into my teens, less of it made sense. By the time I was 18-19, I was a JW in name only and when I was finally df'd, it wasn't a surprise to me. Might have been one to everyone else because I still tried to act the part, but my heart just wasn't in it.
I was a Witness during the 70's and 80's in a small town in Georgia. Made a lot of dear friends who to this day I miss because JW or not, they were good people. I also got to see the worst of people, the monsters that some are capable of turning into when given power. It hurts to know that I am sworn to defend with my life their ability to hide behind the freedom of religion clause of the First Amendment.
Even though I haven't posted much at all in the last several years, I've still read here regularly to keep up to date on JW news. I have family who is still in the JW's.
As my username is NCO probably tells you, I'm a non-commissioned officer. I'm a Sergeant in my state guard. Currently serving as Platoon Sergeant, which is 2 grades higher than a humble E-5 but I do my best. My JW family isn't crazy about me serving but I give 'em credit, they try to cope with it. Mom's not exactly thrilled when she sees a picture of me with a machine gun at Fort Stewart but I usually can talk her through it.
So if Simon and the crew will have me back with this new account, I'd love to rejoin the community and hang out with everyone in the barracks and drink beer and make some new friends.
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