Posts by Vidqun

32

The King of the North as you Never Heard ity Explained Before

by raymond frantz in

https://youtu.be/w32nome-k20?si=a8bhxh5tjrkomgzq.

rather than seeing the king of the north as the final opponent of god’s people, i propose that daniel 11 points to a completely different figure.

while the watchtower society focuses on the struggle between these two kings, they overlook a third entity mentioned in verse 40, but let’s ready this verse first from the new world translation.

Vidqun

Jeffro, for a Biblically based exegesis one takes the language as is: “He will pitch his royal tents between the seas toward the beautiful holy mountain. But he will come to his end, with no one to help him.” (Dan. 11:45 NET).

Take note, יַמִּ֖ים jammim “seas” (plural). What does it mean? Isaiah explains the symbolic use of “sea:” “But the wicked are like a surging sea that is unable to be quiet; its waves toss up mud and sand.” (Isa. 57:20; cf. 17:12). So, seas = people. Which mountain is he referring to? How about this one: “many peoples will come and say, "Come, let us go up to the LORD's mountain, to the temple of the God of Jacob, so he can teach us his requirements, and we can follow his standards." (Isa. 2:3; cf. Mic. 4:2). So the last King of the North will work hard to prevent people from reaching God’s symbolic mountain. Later we see, he will certainly fail.

But for your secular exegesis one needs “hyperbolic, open ended and superstitious phrasing” in order to force the meaning and vocabulary of the passage to fit your historical construction.The Maccabees also attempted to apply the book to their time (cf. Dan. 9:24-27). Jesus pointed out their mistake by applying the prophecy to the time of the Romans, to accurately reflect their actions.

So when we read the following, we don't have to revert to “hyperbolic, open ended and superstitious phrasing.” We take it quite literally:

The angel Gabriel informs Daniel: “Understand, O son of man, that the vision is for the time of [the] end” [“the end time,” NAB] (Dan. 8:17b). He continues: “Here I am causing you to know what will occur in the final part [’acharith] of the denunciation, because it is for the appointed time of the end.” The “final part of the denunciation” refers to God’s anger during “the time of the end” (Dan. 8:19, 25; 11:36; cf. Rev. 14:19; 15:1). The small horn/fierce king will rise “in the final part [’acharith] of their kingdom, as the transgressors act to completion” (cf. Dan. 8:23). The small horn/fierce king will come to his end “but not by human agency” (Dan. 8:25 NET; cf. Rev. 19:11-21). Gabriel concludes: “And the vision of the evening and the morning that has been told is true. And as for you, seal up the vision, because it is for many days” [“it concerns the distant future,” NIV].

32

The King of the North as you Never Heard ity Explained Before

by raymond frantz in

https://youtu.be/w32nome-k20?si=a8bhxh5tjrkomgzq.

rather than seeing the king of the north as the final opponent of god’s people, i propose that daniel 11 points to a completely different figure.

while the watchtower society focuses on the struggle between these two kings, they overlook a third entity mentioned in verse 40, but let’s ready this verse first from the new world translation.

Vidqun

Towards the close of 164 BCE, he died at Tabea, Persia. During the last year of his life he pursued obscure campaigns against Armenia and the Parthians, and was killed ingloriously when attempting to loot a temple of ‘Anaitis’ in the Elymais.

Thus, the following passage cannot apply to Antiochus, for he died of illness: "And he shall pitch his palatial tents between the sea and the glorious holy mountain. Yet he shall come to his end, with none to help him." (Dan. 11:45 ESV)

Furthermore, according to Keil and Delitzsh: "But since the king here spoken of is not Antiochus, this historizing interpretation falls of itself to the ground. There is further with justice objected against it, that at the time of Antiochus the nation of Moab no longer existed. After the Exile the Moabites no longer appear as a nation."

"He shall become ruler of the treasures of gold and of silver, and all the precious things of Egypt, and the Libyans and the Cushites shall follow in his train." (Dan. 11:43 ESV) If he did get his hands on all the treasures of Egypt, it would not have been necessary for him to raid temples to the north. The Cushites (black tribes) and Libyans (Arab tribes) did not follow in his train either.

32

The King of the North as you Never Heard ity Explained Before

by raymond frantz in

https://youtu.be/w32nome-k20?si=a8bhxh5tjrkomgzq.

rather than seeing the king of the north as the final opponent of god’s people, i propose that daniel 11 points to a completely different figure.

while the watchtower society focuses on the struggle between these two kings, they overlook a third entity mentioned in verse 40, but let’s ready this verse first from the new world translation.

Vidqun

Jeffro, it is impossible to fit Dan. 11:40-45 into the reign of Antiochus. It is rather predictive prophecy, deferred to the end time, some future time. Here’s a short summary of Antiochus' reign:

History of the Hellenizing Antiochus IV Epiphanes: When he returned from Egypt in 167 BCE, he took Jerusalem. The city had to forfeit its privileges and would be permanently garrisoned by Syrian soldiers. The worship of Yahweh as well as all Jewish rites would be banned on the pain of death. In the temple an altar to Zeus Olympios would be erected.

The desecration of Jerusalem’s temple would lead to a Jewish uprising under the Maccabees. Judas Maccabeus, leader of the Hasideans, led the people in open revolt. He and his followers would conquer Judaea. They tore down the altar of Zeus, and reconsecrated the temple in December 164 BCE. He and his followers would conquer Judaea. They would tear down the altar of Zeus, and reconsecrate the temple on the anniversary of the desecration in December 164 BCE. The festival of dedication—Hanukkah—was instituted.—John 10:22.

Accordingly the reign of Antiochus falls into two parts, divided by the Roman victory over Perseus of Macedon at Pydna, 169 B.C., when Rome came in position to lay down the law to Antiochus and force him out of Egypt. The history of the first period is taken up with the Syrian wars against Egypt, the second half, after 169, finds Antiochus confined to the role of an Asiatic monarch, the history of which years we know chiefly from the documents of the Jewish people, with whom he became engaged in petty warfare. Antiochus IV battled them for three years. During this time, Antiochus founded the city of Antioch on the Persian Gulf, set out on an expedition to the Arabian coast. Towards the close of 164 BCE, he died at Tabea, Persia. During the last year of his life he pursued obscure campaigns against Armenia and the Parthians, and was killed ingloriously when attempting to loot a temple of ‘Anaitis’ in the Elymais.

Time of [the] end (= [the] end time). This phrase occurs six times in the Bible and is exclusive to the book of Daniel. “The expression qēş in the book of Daniel (8:17, 19; 11:35, 40; 12:4, 9; cf. Hab. 2:3) clearly aims to convey a juxtaposition of the present and the eschatological future; for, although “the time of the final phase” refers primarily to the period of persecution by Antiochus IV Epiphanes, this period is also the time of tribulation that marks the opening phase of the eschaton” (TDOT, vol. XI, p. 450).

In the majority of cases the phrase “(in) the latter part of the days” could be defined as “the end of human history as we know it” (cf. Jer. 30:24; Is. 2:2; Mic. 4:1; Ezek. 38:8, 16). More specifically, in the book of Daniel: “(God in heaven) has made known to King Nebuchadnezzar what will be in the ’acharith of the days (2:28). The point of the vision does not lie in the course of future events, but in the destruction of the colossus and in the coming of an indestructible kingdom (v. 44). As seen, modern scholars and critics would apply Dan. 9:24-27 to Antiochus IV Epiphanes according to Maccabean history. Antiochus would defile the sanctuary, but he and his troops never destroyed the city or sanctuary. This flood can only be applied to the Roman siege of 70 CE. Under the leadership of General Titus, it would be instrumental in devastating Jerusalem (and the sanctuary). This is also the application made by Jesus in the Sermon on the Mount of Olives (cf. Matt. 24:15; Mark 13:14; Luke 21:20-24).

Thus the outcome of the future is what is intended, and not the future in general. Similarly, 10:14 says: “I (the angel that had appeared) came to make you understand what is to befall your people in (at) the ’acharith of the days. For the vision is for days yet to come.” Since the following material deals with the stages of history from Cyrus to Antiochus IV, the meaning “future” cannot be excluded here; but the real purpose of the vision is to show how history will culminate, thus its outcome. Therefore, this passage has in mind the end, and not merely the future.” (TDOT, vol. I, pp. 211, 212)

32

The King of the North as you Never Heard ity Explained Before

by raymond frantz in

https://youtu.be/w32nome-k20?si=a8bhxh5tjrkomgzq.

rather than seeing the king of the north as the final opponent of god’s people, i propose that daniel 11 points to a completely different figure.

while the watchtower society focuses on the struggle between these two kings, they overlook a third entity mentioned in verse 40, but let’s ready this verse first from the new world translation.

Vidqun

Jeffro, if that is indeed the case, where does Dan. 11:40-45 fit in?

43

JW Vaccine mandate: The contrast between voices of reason and confusion

by ukpimo in

i was reading an intriguing post on the exjw reddit, a forum i do not with to sign up for, as i'm not interested in the internal politics of reddit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/1hwlja8/the_governing_bodys_letter_that_shook_bethel_and/.

another post counteracted this one, driven by the "conspiracy theory" card.

Vidqun

So Liam, what would be an answer to all your questions? Perhaps there were different vaccine batches and some were bad. E.g., Pfizer: "We had special batches of [m-RNA vaccine] for our Pfizer employess." From the horses' mouth.

43

JW Vaccine mandate: The contrast between voices of reason and confusion

by ukpimo in

i was reading an intriguing post on the exjw reddit, a forum i do not with to sign up for, as i'm not interested in the internal politics of reddit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/1hwlja8/the_governing_bodys_letter_that_shook_bethel_and/.

another post counteracted this one, driven by the "conspiracy theory" card.

Vidqun

Hoser, you tell that to the ones that were damaged. Unfortunately you can't tell that to the ones that died.

43

JW Vaccine mandate: The contrast between voices of reason and confusion

by ukpimo in

i was reading an intriguing post on the exjw reddit, a forum i do not with to sign up for, as i'm not interested in the internal politics of reddit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/1hwlja8/the_governing_bodys_letter_that_shook_bethel_and/.

another post counteracted this one, driven by the "conspiracy theory" card.

Vidqun

For BluesBrother:

In the field of psycology, cognitive dissonance is described as the mental phenomenon of people existing with unwittingly and fundamentally conflicting cognition. Being confronted by situations that challenge this dissonance may ultimately result in some change in their cognitions or actions to cause greater alignment between them so as to reduce this dissonance (Wikipedia).

https://x.com/i/status/1694383504673652988

32

The King of the North as you Never Heard ity Explained Before

by raymond frantz in

https://youtu.be/w32nome-k20?si=a8bhxh5tjrkomgzq.

rather than seeing the king of the north as the final opponent of god’s people, i propose that daniel 11 points to a completely different figure.

while the watchtower society focuses on the struggle between these two kings, they overlook a third entity mentioned in verse 40, but let’s ready this verse first from the new world translation.

Vidqun

Raymond, nope, I don't see it that way. Only two belligerents are mentioned. I go for the United States and allies (unipolar) vs. Sino-Russia and followers (multipolar), giving rise to a bipolar world (Dan. 2:41; 11:40).

BoogerMan, I agree. Seems like most if not all will receive an identifying mark. IMO the “mark” of Rev. 13:16-18 would point to totalitarian control. In order for the masses to be subjugated, the following aspects of civilized life need to be controlled: 1) Food production. 2) Water supplies. 3) Medical system. 4) Energy production and distribution. 5) Monetary system.

The choice in the end is worship, i.e., to whom will you be loyal. Each time Revelation refers to those receiving the mark, it is qualified by an additional action, i.e., worship. Worship belongs to God. Satan and his beasts are interested in usurping God’s authority and worship (cf. Matt. 4:9, 10; Rev. 13:2). The mark as well as beast worship will be disqualifying one from having one’s name written in the book (cf. Rev. 3:5; 13:8; 17:8; 20:15).

What does worship here mean? To give one’s honour and allegiance to a higher power. To “express by attitude and possibly by position one’s allegiance to and regard for a higher authority.” See Louw-Nida. To “express in attitude or gesture one’s complete dependence on or submission” to a high authority figure or organization, in this case the beast, its image as well as the dragon.

25

Why the WATCHTOWER doesn't believe in the GREAT APOSTASY but you should!

by raymond frantz in

https://youtu.be/i4uttjj7eus?si=0b-fzpqm8axb_d3p.

in its latest april 2025 watchtower study article 17 and paragraph 12 the watchtower promotes 2 dangerous lies that will cost your life if you are a believing christian during the time of the end, so i'm considering today the first lie in the first part of the paragraph, but first let's read the paragraph itself: "today, jehovah promises to provide us with spiritual protection.

he will never allow satan to corrupt true worship.

Vidqun

Vanderhoven and KerryKing,

How would you explain the following: "And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will kill with the breath of his mouth and bring to nothing by the appearance of his coming." (2 Thess. 2:8 ESV)

37

News of fires out of control in California

by ballistic in

jw
friends

hope everyone near to the region affected in california is ok. it's shocking to hear of the destruction.

these affected areas are some of the places i visited when i came on a tour of the us.

malibu, santa barbera, la, santa monica, hollywood and so on..

Vidqun

Riley, spoken like a true Democrat. No, it has nothing to do with the fact that Gavin Newsom cut the fire budget by $100 million.