my 87 year old dad called me for the first time in 16 years the other day .... just to chat.
i was floored to say the least since he didn't even bother to call me when my mom died several years ago.
he called again today to inquire how i felt about jehovah's witnesses.
JW's and active preaching are synonymous, it is deeply embedded in their Culture, in their DNA probably. But most do not like actual Cold Calling on Homes, which is why the Cart Work was a perceptive move.
I can see that doing the actual " Knock Knocks" as we used to call them will die out, not just because of the preference of most JW's, but because the GB will see they are happy with alternatives, and the Org will save money by producing not one shred of printed matter.
this sort of thing ?
"jehovah's witnesses state that black lives matter, as all lives matter".
" jehovah's witnesses join black lives matter rally".
Yes alanv, and as a born in, I was brought up with the attitude we were all humans and equal before god. Because my parents were unusual in their attitude to people from other ethnic groups and cultures, even before they became J.W's, our Home was " Open House" to all sorts of people, from different backgrounds, and different politics even.
Because of benefiting from these aspects of my upbringing, I could never have become a Racist ! As you rightly say this is one thing we can praise JW's for.
It became clear to me thinking on this matter, that until I was about 10 I was not even aware of Racism, growing up in a White Rural Community. Then one day I was standing in a Field with a friend, and two farm workers were passing, standing up in the back of a pick-up truck, and they remarked " Yea, West African", they were wrong about her ethnicity, but I became aware they thought of her as a mere specimen, like an animal in a Zoo, to gawp at, and show no respect. I was hurt and shocked.
So Racism was there in my little Community, but I had not experienced it in action in my life before. I have always hated Racism in any form ever since.
this sort of thing ?
"jehovah's witnesses state that black lives matter, as all lives matter".
" jehovah's witnesses join black lives matter rally".
This sort of thing ? :
"JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES STATE THAT BLACK LIVES MATTER, AS ALL LIVES MATTER"
" JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES JOIN BLACK LIVES MATTER RALLY"
" JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES JOIN WITH OTHERS IN "TAKING THE KNEE" FOR BLACK LIVES MATTER"
No, neither do I. Because ?? " Oh no, we cannot get involved in Politics", etc. (This is not a political issue, true Politicians must make the changes that matter, but it is an issue with Society as a whole, Racist people need to "put on the new personality". )
It has truly been stated that it is simply not enough to claim not to be racist, we have to fight against Racism with all our might, and in any way we can.
Therefore if there is nothing from J W Org, not even a statement on this, they are a racist Organisation.
this is on the jw news site.
news alert | crimean supreme court sentenced brother artem gerasimov to six years in prison.
on june 4, 2020, the crimean supreme court sentenced brother artem gerasimov to six years in prison for his peaceful christian worship.
" According to the investigation, together with others he conducted divine services, which is interpreted as "organization of the activities of an extremist organization" (with reference to the decision of the Supreme Court of the Russian Federation to liquidate all 396 registered Jehovah's Witnesses organizations). "
So, he went against "Caesars Law", whatever we may think about the Law, and got a heavy sentence for ignoring the law, and ignoring the Scripture.
The Russian Law that defines the J.W. Org as extremist, I cannot really disagree with, as to it's definition of Extremist, and JW Org as fitting the definition. Yes, the Russian Orthodox Church may well be behind all this, the sentence was unnecessarily heavy, but he took a silly, foolhardy chance.
the latest issue of the watchtower shows a man with a beard praying.. .
i fully expected to see him 'progress' to clean-shaven in the following pictures, but instead he is still bearded when 'applying bible principles'.. .
i then realized that he was already featured on the cover itself.. .
I have a Letter from the early '70's, somewhere in my Files, from Bethel on the matter, it is the usual mealy mouthed stuff, but even back then they said that in certain parts of the World and Cultures it was acceptable.
But they said it would be up to the Elders to decide if they appointed someone with a Beard, to a "position of responsibility". Of course you were as usual subject to the prejudices of local Elders.
I grew a beard shortly after receiving that letter, I was an M.S. at the time, nothing was said by the Elders, which was strange because a few month earlier I had been "counselled" about the length of my sideburns ! yet, let that develop in to a full beard and they say nothing ??
I served for nearly 20 years with a beard, and used to give "Away" Public talks at the time, it was made plain to me that I would never be used on the Platform at a Convention, even for something like a F.S "experience", and yet in later years, after my beard was shaved off actually, they used a lovely old boy in an experience at our Circuit Convention, wearing his rather scruffy beard, so were obviously more relaxed then.
When I was told you could not go on the Platform with one, I asked to see it in writing, and the bro I was talking to whipped out the Instructions for Handling Assembly Parts or whatever it was called, and there it was, by the Org, with very doubtful Scriptures to back it up, and faulty reasoning too, "People may think you are an Anarchist" or similar. In my Culture at the time, in the U.K, the only people wearing beards were generally Professional guys, and Academics, so that being in those Instructions went against the letter that I had on File, but, I didn't care, I didn't want to go on a Convention Part anyway.
growing up in the 70's and 80's in the jw religion who remembers the massive stadium gigs the watchtower used to hold?.
we used to denounce false religion in the starkest of terms.
we were right and by god we were letting anyone who listened know it.
BluesBrother pointed out that JW's got an attendance at one or two Twickenham Rugby Ground Conventions of 50,000 or so, near capacity I would have thought.
And at the time, I think I am right, there were less than 100,000 JW's in the whole of the U.K and Ireland combined !
Think of the effort many had to put in to attend ! but that "Great Crowd" LOL, applauding, was a very emotionally charged thing.
Yet another thing they have lost by smaller and smaller Conventions
After one of those really big ones, a JW I knew, an old Country boy who did not like crowds, said, " Well, I'm never going to one of those again". He never did, not even the smaller Regional ones, though remained a JW until his death.
just an odd thought i guess.
i saw a large snake in the back of my house the other day and it went on its merry way.
i just asked myself, what if the snake turned around and wanted to have a philosophical discussion on life, the universe or the origin of creation and then began to ask me questions?
Vid, you a Harry Plopper fan ! never would have guessed.
The JW's desperate attempts to take the Bible as literally as possible make their view of the Bible really very, very silly. Of course the Adam and Eve story is allegorical, and yet, the motive for writing it, or including it in Genesis was also somewhat a way for the writers to explain the parlous state of humanity.
I cannot stand snakes, so would have been off like a rocket before it could have "spoken". " Spoken" in quotes because I don't think a snake has a Larynx does it ? Hence the J.W explanation that "Satan" used it like a ventriloquist would. Of course, the Genesis account does not say it was Satan, he was a much later concept. More wonderful JW exegesis, or rather eisegesis.
i'm reading babylon the great has fallen, god's kingdom rules, published 1963. this was studied years ago when i was about 10-12 years old.
i wanted to just read some of the beliefs from decades ago.
my wife wants to know why i'm reading this book.
" Or, the expression I've heard is, "It was the Truth for that time."
Their founder, Chas. Russell, said that if a new truth replaces an old one ( I think he actually said " new Light....") then what was replaced was NOT Truth (or Light).
He said New Light made the view brighter, as in illuminating a building with more and more light.
So the comment about "truth at that time" was rightly recognised by Chazzer as being nonsense.
i'm a born and raised witness.
i was an elder for almost 20 years.
almost the same in fulltime service.
You will no doubt receive plenty of advice on here, but I want to just warn you, a successful "Fade" is a difficult process. There are always questions the Elders want answered, as you well know, the one never to answer is the " Loyalty" question, " Do you still believe this is god's Organisation" or "Do you still believe the Governing Body are the Faithful Slave" or similar. You know what will happen if that is answered in the negative.
When the Elders called on me, out of the blue, they tried the question at least three times, put different ways, they wanted to D.F. me as an Apostate I guess. I did not answer in a straight way, the last time they tried, I just let it hang in the air, until Elder Wafflechops could bear the silence no longer , and rattled on himself.
The other bit of advice I have is, do not trust ANY JW, they will tell the Elders about your thoughts, even if something as seemingly innocent as differing on Scriptural matters. That happened to me, which prompted the visit below, the guy who told them was a lifelong friend, and I trusted him not to tell. A hard lesson to learn !
About 18 months after the first attempt, they tried again, I refused to meet with them, wrote and told them I was deeply depressed,to the point of contemplating suicide, and if I ever wanted Spiritual help, I would contact them. I got a nice Letter back, full of love, and wishing me well, and a quick recovery. They never bothered me again.
This may possibly be a tactic for you, it certainly aided me in a quick ending to my relationship with JW's, and a complete end to harassment from the Elders.
Good luck !
i made a big mistake when signing up at this supposed website for jehovah's witnesses.
after reading some things on this site it has become apparent to me that this site is nothing put another pathetic site for apostates: people who betrayed jehovah, left the truth, and are so bitter about their experiene in the truth, and they are angry just like satan because they know they will very soon be dead at jehovah's hand!.
this website should be renamed something more fitting like "satan's playground" or a similar name that would get across the message of your site.. sincerely,.
Just a couple of tips for people searching for educated information, the posters as follows were great, among many others :
Leolaia for background on the Bible writings and their origins and more ! Doug Mason for the same, Alanf for much on the false JW teaching and on some JW history, and from these Threads you can be led to those of other early posters, some no longer on here, who will give you much insight.
I still find it annoying, slightly insulting even, unless I use the epithet as a label for myself, to be called an " Apostate". JW's tend to use it to dismiss what you say without reading. They forget of course that they are all Apostates themselves ! using the word in the sense of "standing apart from" a former belief. The ever changing JW teachings mean that they have become Apostates to the former teaching.
