Posts by Phizzy

17

"Everyone Wants To Leave"

by NotFormer in

a thread about steve hassan re-emerged and got me looking him up.

his wikipedia entry had a point under "criticism" that there is an underlying assumption in his approach that all members of high control groups ultimately want to leave*.. while it is generally believed that there are a lot of pimos still attending, doing field service and giving lip service to the wt, i doubt that everyone within the congregations want to get out.

it's not always internally and logically consistent, but it's been around long enough for enough workarounds to make it tolerable to emerge.. what do you think?

Phizzy

" I was a PIMO, but I could not stay that way and support the lies and get others to join the BORG."

Me too, for some years before I finally woke up and left, I made no real efforts to make Converts, some excellent "Marks" I did not continue to call back on, eventually I stopped F.S altogether, as I could not in all conscience teach the 1914 crap, or defend it of course.

An Elder who had called on me to find out why I, the best real doer of F.S in the Congregation probably, had stopped cold turkey. He promised to call back on me and prove 1914 to me, he never did, says it all.

20

For all JW's: Stop calling others "apostates."

by BoogerMan in

if you don't want to be thrown into gehenna, read what your own faithful evil slave & christ say:.

cj chap.

3 p. 110 chapter 3 - "jesus christ said: “whoever says, ‘you despicable fool!’ (apostate) will be liable to the fiery gehenna.” (matt.

Phizzy

" that fact alone technically makes you an apostate."

Spot on, using the real definition of Apostate, but we all know it is used as a demonising trigger word for J.W's, part of the Org's extreme Mind Control.

It is done so that J.W's just will not listen to our words, even thought they are words of truth.

As a wise man said " Even if the Devil himself speaks truth, it is still Truth".

But J.W's mainly cannot handle the truth !

Image result for Pic "You can't Handle the TRUTH". Size: 237 x 204. Source: www.pinterest.com

18

Do JWs Really Say This?

by NotFormer in

i stumbled, via a google search, upon a part of jw space that is usually heavily defended against outsiders like my good self.

in a discussion, someone started their post with "i (started doing x)... when the slave began to suggest doing so"*.

do pimis really talk that way?

Phizzy

It is a shame those people using that name/label "Slave" do not have the sense to realise anyone fulfilling the Role of Slave/Servant should be working ONLY for the benefit of those they serve, in this case, the JW believers worldwide.

The G.B & Cronies only look after their own interests, which mainly consist of $$$.

1

NWT Study Edition - Serious omission!!!!!

by BoogerMan in

“melchizedek, king of salem, priest of the most high god”.

unique features of melchizedek’s priesthood .

5. jesus, “a priest forever in the manner of melchizedek” .

Phizzy

Sorry, I may be incredibly thick, but what "omission" do you refer to in the NWT ? or are you saying that in the Mags. etc the Org. should claim the 144,000 are all Mini Mels ?

The problem with doing that is they will be laughed at by all non J.W's who have an interest in Scripture, but as that has never stopped them, in all their history, from spouting total nonsense and adding to Scripture in a blatant manner with zero shame, you are probably right, they ARE missing a trick.

But perhaps they may not wish even more to be "partakers" claiming to be of the 144,000, a figure already proven to be ridiculous.

17

"Everyone Wants To Leave"

by NotFormer in

a thread about steve hassan re-emerged and got me looking him up.

his wikipedia entry had a point under "criticism" that there is an underlying assumption in his approach that all members of high control groups ultimately want to leave*.. while it is generally believed that there are a lot of pimos still attending, doing field service and giving lip service to the wt, i doubt that everyone within the congregations want to get out.

it's not always internally and logically consistent, but it's been around long enough for enough workarounds to make it tolerable to emerge.. what do you think?

Phizzy

I agree GLT, and I listened to, and watched, a Video from a Psychologist who had worked extensively helping people who did want to leave High Control groups, and she said exactly the same as you.

A wise man said "When the Student is ready, the Teacher shall arrive".

We need to make sure we are equipped thoroughly to be that Teacher, as opportunity arises. It needs to be done with great skill and empathy, along with compassion, or we may do more harm than good.

Also good judgement needs to be exercised, some people are simply not equipped to leave, either emotionally, or in some cases financially, they also may well lack the Social Skills to join the real World of Normal People, and hence will struggle to make new friends, and hence will have no support, having lost all of their "friends" and associates, their Support Network.

But I do feel that as time goes on, we will be able to help many to leave, as you so rightly say, when they are ready.

17

"Everyone Wants To Leave"

by NotFormer in

a thread about steve hassan re-emerged and got me looking him up.

his wikipedia entry had a point under "criticism" that there is an underlying assumption in his approach that all members of high control groups ultimately want to leave*.. while it is generally believed that there are a lot of pimos still attending, doing field service and giving lip service to the wt, i doubt that everyone within the congregations want to get out.

it's not always internally and logically consistent, but it's been around long enough for enough workarounds to make it tolerable to emerge.. what do you think?

Phizzy

I think if people in such High Control Groups realise it or not, deep. deep down they DO wish they were free.

This is how Cognitive Dissonance works, if thoughts about this begin to get nearer the surface, they are immediately pushed way back down again.

So everyone does want to leave, even if the closest they get to expressing it to themselves is something like "I wish Armageddon and the New System were here", that means they wish the regime they live under was over.

To criticise Hassan because his Books etc. assumes everyone wants to leave is silly, that is why they would be reading his books etc. !

And deep down everybody wants to leave, even if they think they don't, and think they are perfectly happy.

86

Prediction: no more changes for a long while

by slimboyfat in

i’ve noticed a pattern where things don’t go the way i expect them to go and/or whenever i realise there is a trend and, i mentally adjust for the idea that the trend will continue, the trend stops in its tracks.

so on that basis, and given many people, including myself, and active jws, have been asking ‘what changes will the governing body make next?’ perhaps the (disappointing) answer is: ‘nothing much for a while to come’.

maybe they’ve made the changes they want for now, and will wait a while and see how it’s received.

Phizzy

" will call to check on your "spirituality".

When I was just beginning to wake up, I cancelled our Direct Debit, I didn't hear a word from the Elders or anyone else.

That was circa 2006, I had been donating £40.00 a Month at the time.

I guess it is very different now !

12

First Half of the Book of Hebrews (Study Edition) Now Available Online

by Wonderment in

april 11, 2024 (source: jw.org) .

first half of the book of hebrews (study edition) now available online.

the first half of the bible book of hebrews (chapters 1-7) is now available in the study edition of the new world translation of the holy scriptures on jw.org and in jw library.

Phizzy

I see they are still claiming this was written by Paul. A consensus of Scholars date this Work to many decades after the death of Paul.

86

Prediction: no more changes for a long while

by slimboyfat in

i’ve noticed a pattern where things don’t go the way i expect them to go and/or whenever i realise there is a trend and, i mentally adjust for the idea that the trend will continue, the trend stops in its tracks.

so on that basis, and given many people, including myself, and active jws, have been asking ‘what changes will the governing body make next?’ perhaps the (disappointing) answer is: ‘nothing much for a while to come’.

maybe they’ve made the changes they want for now, and will wait a while and see how it’s received.

Phizzy

I have been out for so long that I don't know such details as contribution levels, but I would guess the young don't contribute that much as a group. But they are thought of by the org. as the future contributors, as the old ones die off, and no doubt the org. will be guilting the young earners to contribute more.

When I was young, and also a Reg. Pio. for a while, my thinking was the same as yours, plus I only had enough to live off by Part Time working, to run a car, run a girlfriend, she was always skint, and to have a bit of Beer Money.

I shall be fascinated to see how all of this goes for the Org. To a degree they are being unusually reactive, looking to the near future at least, but I wonder if any of the measures they take will stem the loss of members due to the less obvious stuff, like the spreading availability of easy Internet access around the world, improved Education, and how Society in many Nations is increasingly seeing no need for organised religion in their lives, also the relaxing of things so much will make it much easier to "fade", either deliberately or unconsciously.

86

Prediction: no more changes for a long while

by slimboyfat in

i’ve noticed a pattern where things don’t go the way i expect them to go and/or whenever i realise there is a trend and, i mentally adjust for the idea that the trend will continue, the trend stops in its tracks.

so on that basis, and given many people, including myself, and active jws, have been asking ‘what changes will the governing body make next?’ perhaps the (disappointing) answer is: ‘nothing much for a while to come’.

maybe they’ve made the changes they want for now, and will wait a while and see how it’s received.

Phizzy

" If they were in serious trouble...... " I agree LV101, but we have been told, perhaps not based on actual facts, that they have a Ten Year Plan.

So, being aware of the demographics of their adherents, they know that a Cash Flow problem, though not critical for a number of years probably, is a fact, and can only get worse if they don't retain the younger ones. Hence "baby steps" makes sense in introducing the changes, appease the young first with the minor stuff, allow some "fun" back in to the Org. and strengthen its function as a Social Club.

The more delicate matters of major changes both in Doctrine and Practice can be fed in slowly over a number of years, but they will do this over the next 7 or 8 years maybe, and then assess the success of the Ten Year Plan at the end. Success being enough $$$ flowing in again.