peacefulpete

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Posts by peacefulpete

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  22

  A gospel of LOVE or a gospel of HATE?

  by JanH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  " (the watchtower, 10/1 1961, p. 596; bold added).

  " (the watchtower, 11/15 1952, p. 703; bold added).

  " (the watchtower, 10/1 1952, p. 599; bold added).

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  peacefulpete

  There is nothing especially peaceful or loving in the words of 2 Peter.

  2 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies,....bringing swift destruction on themselves. ..... Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleeping.

  4 For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell.... putting them in chains of darkness to be held for judgment; ..... if he did not spare the ancient world when he brought the flood on its ungodly people, ... if he condemned the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah by burning them to ashes, and made them an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly; .....to hold the unrighteous for punishment on the day of judgment..... This is especially true of those who ....despise authority (church leaders).

  But these people blaspheme in matters they do not understand. They are like unreasoning animals, creatures of instinct, born only to be caught and destroyed, and like animals they too will perish..... These people are springs without water and mists driven by a storm. Blackest darkness is reserved for them.

  Or if you prefer you can read the same material in the book of Jude, which was the source for 2 Peter.
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  22

  A gospel of LOVE or a gospel of HATE?

  by JanH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  " (the watchtower, 10/1 1961, p. 596; bold added).

  " (the watchtower, 11/15 1952, p. 703; bold added).

  " (the watchtower, 10/1 1952, p. 599; bold added).

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  peacefulpete

  It says God wants everyone to repent and live, ....

  And what did the protoOrthodox writer mean by "repent" other than become a Christian of the same sect as himself?
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  22

  A gospel of LOVE or a gospel of HATE?

  by JanH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  " (the watchtower, 10/1 1961, p. 596; bold added).

  " (the watchtower, 11/15 1952, p. 703; bold added).

  " (the watchtower, 10/1 1952, p. 599; bold added).

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  peacefulpete

  We should get back to that mentality,......

  Who are 'we'? Are you yet feigning being a JW?

  the Bible clearly states that God wishes all to attain to repentance and be saved.

  That phrase is lifted from a pseudonymously written epistle offering an excuse for the destruction of the world to not yet have happened as promised. It amounts to the very same thing as the WT overlapping generation drivel. The writer of 2 Peter wasn't renouncing the destruction of the world but by indefinitely delaying the promised destruction for the sake of a vaguely defined greater good rendered the original promise effectively meaningless.
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  22

  A gospel of LOVE or a gospel of HATE?

  by JanH in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  " (the watchtower, 10/1 1961, p. 596; bold added).

  " (the watchtower, 11/15 1952, p. 703; bold added).

  " (the watchtower, 10/1 1952, p. 599; bold added).

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  peacefulpete

  Christianity at its core is a Jekyll and Hyde affair. It was borne out of hostility and oppression. Hundreds of years of militant Jewish idealism followed by unspeakable horrors left an indelible mark of the new faith. Christians, like their Jewish predecessors, wished for peace and love but more often than not practiced intolerance and inflexibility. Peaceful Christians, if not an oxymoron, are an anomaly. Most all Christian faiths speak a good game about peace but harbor fantasies of hellfire or world destruction.
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  15

  Did the WT Policy on Lying Bother You When You Were a JW?

  by Sea Breeze in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  here's the wt standard for lying: "while malicious lying is definitely condemned in the bible, this does not mean that a person is under obligation to divulge truthful information to people who are not entitled to it" - insight pp.

  244-245. vs. websters dictionary:.

  lie, noun.

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  peacefulpete

  Thinking back, the issue never felt terribly shocking. I assumed it was intended to save lives, and after all doesn't everyone accept that lies can save lives. Saving reputations however is a different thing. When deception is done to save face or conceal embarrassing facts, then it is no longer noble. It is just plain old lying.
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  44

  What is the Craziest Thing You Are Aware Of Someone Being Disfellowshipped For?

  by Sea Breeze in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i knew a lady who was disfellowshipped for 20 years for smoking.

  she finally went back to the kh and since they couldn't find her paperwork, (all the former elders were dead) she was allowed back in without reinstatement.

  no one even remembered her.

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  peacefulpete

  To my shame, I was party to disfellowshipping a poor woman, whose nonJW wife divorced her to facilitate getting immigration papers to the US. At the time it was easier for single able-bodied men to apply for VISAs than families. They were in reality still married and a loving family of 4. This was a third world country, and she had no means of support other than her husband's subsistence wages. She remained living at home and engaging in normal activities, I was sick about it even then. She was balling when the body demanded she not return home to her husband. I often think about my role and can only hope she found a new life elsewhere.
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  19

  The JW's are suing Mark O'Donnell in civil court for millions.So protect the pedos, and suit the whistelblowers? Shame on this cult!

  by WingCommander in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  link to his announcement on www.jwchildabuse.org:.

  https://www.jwchildabuse.org/news/jehovahs-witnesses-sue-editor-of-jw-child-abuse-website-for-millions/.

  if anyone needed any further proof of how low and despicable this cult has become, here's more evidence.

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  peacefulpete

  The WT success would depend upon proving actual damages. Also using a link by an unauthorized person is not wiretapping but possibly reaches the definition of cyber trespassing, but still actual damages must be proven.

  
  
  
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  94

  Jephthah's Daughter

  by cantleave in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have read somewhere that jephthah's daughter did not really go into temple service but was a victim of ritual sacrifice.

  the bible says that after weeping over her virginity that the maidens would visit her annually.

  how could they visit her if she was killed?.

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  peacefulpete

  Regarding the rites of human sacrifice in the ancient world, most all cultures engaged in it in their deep pasts. Interestingly the Persian empire went through such a transition under the influence of the Zoroastrian religious influences. The Romans also describe such a transition. There is an ancient tale of Numa the legendary 2nd king of Rome engaging in negotiations with Jupiter (the top god often equated with the Jewish Yahweh) over the demand of human sacrifice. It is summarized below:

  Numa and his people had once been terrified by frequent lightning bolts, signs of the wrath of Jupiter. Using a secret spell or ritual, the king called the god down to the Aventine Hill to ask how to expiate the portents. The god responded with what sounded like a demand for human sacrifice. The king, however, talked back. When Jupiter demanded a ‘head’, Numa offered: ‘The head of an onion’. Jupiter rejoined, ‘....Of a human being’; Numa supplied: ‘The hairs.’ Jupiter gave it one more try, clarifying ‘....A life’; Numa responded: ‘Of a fish!’ Agreement was reached, and from then on Romans expiated lightning at the shrine of Jupiter Elicius with an onion, some human hairs, and a fish.

  This story retroactively reformed the cult of the Romans, providing an origin story for the shunning of human sacrifice. One can't help but notice certain similarities with certain dialogues and negotiations in the OT. I have posed something similar for the purpose of the Akedah story. Perhaps a more ancient legend was reused, but the substitution of the ram for Isaac part might have served as an illustration of new religious ideals of the 5th/4th century.
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  12

  Christians and War and the Role of Conscience (a work in progress)

  by Terry in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  christians and war and the role of conscience ______________ christian integrity vs duty to superior authority from the federal government’s povthe u.s. government saw jw’s as one group within a larger group of men refusing military service within existing law - for reasons of deeply held convictions.

  we jw brothers weren’t the only ones affected, as evidenced by this list.. quakers.

  jehovah’s witnesses.

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  peacefulpete

  That raises the question of who is my brother? (family)
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  5

  Ezra...Son of God.

  by peacefulpete in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  briefly said, the various/diverse ancient stories present ezra as directed by a persian king to establish religious/national law and order in judea.

  he is said to have re-introduced the locals and returnees to the law of moses.

  he and five others present this law to the people with mixed and brutal results.

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  peacefulpete

  Phizzy, I haven't read Liverani but gather his thesis parallels that of a number of others. That is, the extensive revisionism of 'history' engaged in during the Persian period. I'm reluctant to accept the stories were invented 'whole cloth' however. These revisionists utilized a body of legend and mytheme that in some cases dated centuries before. It would also appear this reinvention of the past occurred in stages.

  The Persian desire for stability within the empire adds credibility to the legends of the 'King' having directed aspects of the establishment of a centralized bureaucracy, both governor and priesthood. I also see the recounting of local resistance to these 'reforms' to likely reflect an historical reality.

  Ezra/Nehemiah/Zerubbabel may have been historical agents of the King, or may represent embodiments of that process or composite characters of a number of appointees of the Persians to establish order spanning a hundred years or more. Either way, the later retelling and expansion of those stories inspired new approaches to worship and history. The Samaritan and Muslim clerics saw in this particular legend (Ezras rewrite) an explanation/justification for sectarian differences, while the Christian acceptance, in the case of Irenaeus, served as a precedent for accepting the LXX (with its unique wording used by NT writers) as inspired above the other language versions.

  ....they came together in the same place before Ptolemy, and each of them compared his own interpretation with that of every other, God was indeed glorified, and the Scriptures were acknowledged as truly divine. For all of them read out the common translation [which they had prepared] in the very same words and the very same names, from beginning to end, so that even the Gentiles present perceived that the Scriptures had been interpreted by the inspiration of God. And there was nothing astonishing in God having done this — He who, when, during the captivity of the people under Nebuchadnezzar, the Scriptures had been corrupted, and when, after seventy years, the Jews had returned to their own land, then, in the times of Artaxerxes king of the Persians, inspired Esdras the priest, of the tribe of Levi, to recast all the words of the former prophets, and to re-establish with the people the Mosaic legislation.

  These diverse movements (and their opponents) each found the legend of Ezra rewriting the Torah and prophets useful.