soooo, i've been sudying the bible with a 10 year old girl for two years now...her mother recently got baptised.
since i've been having doubts about the org i've centered our discussions on god and the bible and less on pleasing the org...i was doing fine.... until i invited an older pioneer sister to accompany me on the study....heeeeeeesh...she changed the topic from having manners to becoming an unbaptised publisher....she went onnnnn and onnnnn about "don't you want to please jehovah and jesus, wouldn't you like to put in a form every month and you do love jehovah and want to tell others about him,right?
" i was so upset.. i treat and love this girl as if she was my little sister and i do not want her to nose dive into this religion...she's a child for god's sake!.
[sorry. I read the whole thing as her being pressured to get baptised, not become an unbaptised publisher. Doh. But I still hold by my comment that you did right to make a stand on this girl's behalf ]
There is no Bible example of ones being groomed, grilled and approved as apprentice ministers. Individuals CHOSE to speak according to their own inclination. Besides, sounds like this young girl is already a minister!
my mother's text: "she tried to love u and be ur sis and leave jw out but when she invited u to memorial like last year she was thinking all religions believe in dead of christ so she wanted u to know when it was and have an invite but u had to send her scriptures back and stuff instead of saying i dont feel comfortable goin... and u dont see it that way u blame it all on jw instead of taking some responsibility for trying or not trying but just hurting her with bring up stuff.
that hurts her.
she tried last summer remember she even went swimming with u and did things with u. it wasnt until she saw u post things and blame jw that she had to cut ties.".
Communicating electronically is notoriously bad when we need to leave no room for doubt. So quit with texting and email, or FaceBook etc until peace is restored.
Also, quite frankly, you need to bypass your mum. Her stakes are too high to be objective and deliver coms without bias or interference. Go straight to your sister, if she'll let you.
Aboveall, be your own woman! Your sister, being part of such a strict organisation might by default be seen as the higher moral one in this. Don't let that cloud your thinking and get you defensive. Keep your words direct and few but warm. And keep your expectations modest. Restoring full peace can take time.
Sorry to hear you have this trouble.
soooo, i've been sudying the bible with a 10 year old girl for two years now...her mother recently got baptised.
since i've been having doubts about the org i've centered our discussions on god and the bible and less on pleasing the org...i was doing fine.... until i invited an older pioneer sister to accompany me on the study....heeeeeeesh...she changed the topic from having manners to becoming an unbaptised publisher....she went onnnnn and onnnnn about "don't you want to please jehovah and jesus, wouldn't you like to put in a form every month and you do love jehovah and want to tell others about him,right?
" i was so upset.. i treat and love this girl as if she was my little sister and i do not want her to nose dive into this religion...she's a child for god's sake!.
If someone is too young to marry, to young to swear loyalty to a person for a lifetime, still unfixed in their likes, limited in life experience, etc, then they MUST be too young to swear loyalty to GOD for a lifetime surely.
With a 10 year old I'd worry they couldn't really know what they were committing themselves to. The second baptism questions makes my blood run cold - swearing loyalty to the WT Org'. Ooo, no!
Too young to marry = too young to get baptised (into the WT org. I don't necessarily think this of other less controlling religions).
You did right to make a stand on this girl's behalf
i think bill maher hits it on the head with this monologue.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ao_pdmerd_u.
That was just great (aside from the swearing ). He's bang on! There is a big difference between being a Christian in deed and a Christian in name. Or as he puts it a follwer and not just a fan.
Thanks for sharing
this is an honest question on my part.
someone on this board asked me 'how do you know' a while ago and i really struggled with it.
in fact, it was a turning point for me.
For me this is so simple. I look at the universe, the size of the dang thing, that it's infinite and expanding and that evolutionists/scientists argue this is all by chance etc etc. And for me that takes so massive a leap in 'faith', trusting in the enigma of how stuff can come from nothing and grow out into a space that wasn't there before that trusting to an intelligent being who is eternal seems a piece of [even a piece of birthday cake nowadays :D]
Creatures decided for themselves to grow eyes? How did they decide that? Decide it with what? But if they had brains enough for that task, are you sure they'd have enough grey cells to design the thing AND wire it all up right? What did they study to help draw up their plan? How could they know there was anything to see anyway? And, why are monkeys still here, not evolving into men like my clever uncle Marv? Why don't they get off their arses and get a job! Answers: there is a God and the buck stops with him.
[imo]
we've finished reading ray franz' books (crisis of conscience and in search of christian freedom) where ray mentions a book of guidelines for those answering letters, calls, email, to bethel hq.
i wondered if this has found its way onto the internet yet?
i'd be very interested in a look if so.. .
We've finished reading Ray Franz' books (Crisis of Conscience and In Search of Christian Freedom) where Ray mentions a book of guidelines for those answering letters, calls, email, to Bethel HQ. I wondered if this has found its way onto the internet yet? I'd be very interested in a look if so.
he has been by buddy since child hood we stayed in the same area and same attended the congregation.
he agrees most of the things taught by the wt is rubbish...but says whats the alternative where dose he go from here.
any idea/tips..
Remind him Peter didn't say to Jesus "where shall we go away to?". He said "WHOM shall we go away to?" He can leave the WT organisation without leaving Christ.
Leaving the WT is like breaking an addiction. Sometimes the pain of trying to free yourself is greater than the pain of living with it. It can take a long time or a unique set of 'things' to coincide before willpower can really kick in reliably.
You could ask him how his conscience is in abiding by 'rubbish' (as he says) and potentially teaching that 'rubbish' to others?
Be patient. Carry on being the excellent friend you are. One day he'll need you even more than now.
i have been on this site daily, almost from its beginning, since i left the jws in 2001, but i have been more of a reader than a poster, as you can see from my post count.
i know few here know me, although i know many of you through reading your posts.
maybe it is not right to ask for support, when i generally stay quietly in the background of this forum, but i want only to speak a human misery of the deepest kind.
Your news made my breath catch in my throat. I can only guess at your pain and distress. I wish I could take some of that burden from you.
I don't know what faith or hope you may have but hold on to it now with all you might.
My heart goes out to you truly. x
I said no once before but went back. So, I guess I should say probably not, rather than my immediate thought of, "No way! And you even think about making me, . . .!"
BUT, this time I'm out, not because I think it's the 'truth' but I'm just not up to it, am sure to get fried so why stay. This time I'm out because I've seen the Governing Body for what it is* - a bunch of guys trying to control my conscience - well meaning as they might be at times, that is just NOT ON!
Our disassociation should be announced this Thursday
* thanks to JWFacts.com et al
i couldn't find a window on which to post in xtreemlyconfused17's acts 15 thread, so i'm responding here.
some elder claimed that acts 15 shows the existence of a first century governing body.. quite the opposite!.
let's back up to acts 13. there, the holy spirit called saul (paul) and barnabas to missionary work.
Will be passing your post on to my hubby. This is fascinating, powerful stuff. Thanks!
