Posts by pale.emperor

50

If "the Truth" is the truth, why are witnesses so scared of research?

by stuckinarut2 in

it is an often asked question i know, but it perplexes me.. if witnesses are so convinced that they have "the truth", why is the act of researching information from external sources so taboo?

didn't the bible itself tell people to "use their powers of reason" and also praised ones like the boreans for researching things they were told??.

seriously, if there is no doubt about the organization being "god's channel" on earth, and it alone having the "truth", surely researching would only enhance such 'facts'?.

pale.emperor

I was thinking about this today. Remember the illustration in the Bible Teach book that shown a teacher at a blackboard with a student claiming to know better than the teacher? WT reasoned that when Satan challenged Jehovah by claiming to be able rule man better, Jehovah let Satan have a go to prove that he would fail.

The same argument could be used here, WT claims to have the truth. Some apostates come along and claim to have information that proves them false. What does WT do? Allow them to present their reasoning and evidence? Nope! Tell their member to instead Ignore, silence and stick their fingers in their ears and la-la-la it.

22

Being a Rude Jerk, It's Awesome!

by Simon in

maybe it's a british thing, but we tend to be polite.

too polite.. even if someone is inconsiderate, we apologize as though we did something wrong.. prime offenders?

people in supermarkets, specifically costco.. they have nice wide isles and yet somehow, for some reason, some idiot will find a way to put their trolley sideways and keep a hand on it while reaching for something, thus blocking the entire isle.. or another favorite ... you're going through the entrance and someone just stops, maybe to answer their phone.. how about you wait in a queue at a checkout for ages and when it's their turn, then they start looking for their purse.. how many times have you thought "idiot" or muttered under your breath?.

pale.emperor

I scream "MOVE!!" but inside my head.

A Spanish friend of mine said in Spain there's a way of testing if someone is British. She said you push your shopping trolley right into them and into the back of their legs. If THEY apologise, they're British.

20

How can the WTS call themselves Christians when they have no Christian church?

by TTWSYF in

so was jesus a fool or a liar?

he said that his church would last all ages, didn't he?.

math 16:8and i say to thee: that thou art peter; and upon this rock i will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

pale.emperor

Jesus was, in effect, an apostate Jew. Wether he was a great man, a con man or a cult leader, at the very least what he was teaching according to Judaism was apostasy.

48

Are baptized Witnesses that are no longer in the "truth", but were NEVER DF'D, now to be shunned and treated like disfellowshipped ones?

by Dunedain in

a relative of mine was telling me, that in his, and a few neighboring congregations, there is a little confusion amongst some of the jw's about this "issue".

some families are having a hard time about whether certain relatives will be attending certain family functions, because some family members that are no longer in the "truth", might be invited to these functions.

mind you, these persons were never disfellowshipped.

pale.emperor

I wish there was something in print about this. I watched the Worst Convention Ever series and heard the speaker in America say it. But my family here in the UK are denying it. And even if they do hear it get announced there'd be A LOT of family members being shunned. It'd cause a big shake up i think.

3

Faithful slave, new teaching

by inbetween in

most of us agree, that jw doctrine, even if you accept the bible as gods word, doenst add up.. just one detail:.

the new teaching about the fds is, that it was established, not in 1st century, but in 1914 (1919?

), and that jesus looked down on earth after his installment as king 1914 and choose the bible students as his organisation.. however, the new kingdom book mentioned in this weeks study, when russel and co startd to publish in newspapers from 1903 on, that jesus manouvered matters, in order to make it successful.. hm, he didnt even choose them yet as his people, but he already supported them ?.

pale.emperor

This is the funny thing with "new thought". Are we supposed to accept it? It's only a thought after all...

Supposedly, Jesus chose the Watchtower in 1919 as his sole channel and declared it clean, which i believed for 31 years as a witness. This supposedly clean organization used to celebrate Christmas and Birthdays, used the cross in worship, worshiped Jesus as well as Jehovah and could join the military as long as they didn't kill anyone etc. (there were stories of men in the army shooting their gun into the air in the middle of battle instead of at people).

If Jesus says Christmas and Birthdays are "clean" what mere man has the right to change that? And if Jesus didn't declare the clean, why did they say he did? If they didn't get it from Jesus but thought they did then why should we believe anything they say?

49

Sisters as Ministerial Servants?

by Spoletta in

my wife has been trying to convince me that the organization is hinting at the possibility of making some older sisters ministerial servants.

she is awake to a lot of the false doctrines, but is still clinging to the hope that the org may become more progressive in the future.

anyone else pick up on this?

pale.emperor

There have been some really well read, clever and personable sisters in kingdom halls when i was growing up. 2 immediately spring to mind as i write this who would have been a credit to "the society" (eurgh, cant believe im saying that) if they were given some sort of role.

Maybe they'll give them another "privilege" but not in an authoritative sense. Like if a sister is called to a JC or elders grilling they may have designated women there for "support" so as to pacify the courts when they read of the crazy JC rule of asking rape victims to sit in a room with 3 men sat facing her asking personal intimate questions about her body.

8

Jesus is Lord...as in Jehovah god...in Reference NWT

by NikL in

i wish i could say i found this but i saw it in a vid from watchtower examination.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vk7ertncbsk.

in it he points out that in the reference bible used by jws they admit that jesus and jehovah are the same thing.. so i looked it up online on jw.org.

yep it's there.. 1 peter 3:15. but sanctify the christ as lord* in your hearts,+ always ready to make a defense+ before everyone that demands of you a reason for the hope in you, but doing so together with a mild temper+ and deep respect.*.

pale.emperor

I was always good at refuting the trinity as a JW, but I've never seen this before in the reference bible. And after researching... I have no explanation.

Good find.

Anyone care to assist?

31

Young People Ask: I’m Attracted to the Same Sex—Does That Mean I’m Gay?

by pale.emperor in

eurgh!

more patronizing and uninformed reasoning from the "experts" at bethel.

this time tackling the sensitive subject of those attracted the the same sex.

pale.emperor

Eurgh! More patronizing and uninformed reasoning from the "experts" at Bethel. This time tackling the sensitive subject of those attracted the the same sex. But fear not! Apparently all you have to do is snap out of it - it's just a phase!
My comments will be in yellow.

Not at all!

Fact: In many cases, same-sex attraction is nothing more than a passing phase.

Fact? Wow, thats a big statement. A fact? Ok then, care to cite your sources please?

That’s what Lisette, 16, who was at one time attracted to a girl, found. She says: “Through my biology classes in school, I learned that during the adolescent years, hormone levels can fluctuate greatly. I truly think that if more youths knew more about their bodies, they would understand that same-sex attraction can be temporary and they wouldn’t feel the pressure to be gay.”

Well Lisette, that's true. But being a homosexual is a lot more complicated than just fluctuating adolescent hormones. And i doubt very much that any gay person felt pressured to be gay. Just as i dont feel pressured to be heterosexual.

A youth at a crossroads deciding which road to follow

All youths face a choice—either to adopt the world’s degraded view of sexuality or to follow the high moral path set forth in God’s Word.

All youths face a choice—either to adopt the world’s degraded view of sexuality or to follow the high moral path set forth in God’s Word. Sneaking in their own adjective again. This seems to be a running trend for this book. Those people who set those "high moral" standard were desert dwelling people with no knowledge of psychology or medicine and thought it absolutely fine to stone someone to death for, i dont know, picking up sticks on a Saturday.

But what if your attraction to the same sex seems to be more than a passing phase? Is it cruel of God to tell someone who is attracted to the same sex to avoid homosexuality?

Yes!

If you answered yes to that last question, you should know that such reasoning is based on the flawed notion that humans must act on their sexual impulses. The Bible dignifies humans by assuring them that they can choose not to act on their improper sexual urges.—Colossians 3:5.

We didn't need the bible to tell us that Mr Watchtower. The point is, we have the right to love whoever we want without permission from J.Hoover.

The Bible’s stand is not unreasonable. It simply directs those with homosexual urges to do the same thing that is required of those with an opposite-sex attraction—to “flee from fornication.” (1 Corinthians 6:18) The fact is, millions of heterosexuals who wish to conform to the Bible’s standards employ self-control despite any temptations they might face. Those with homosexual inclinations can do the same if they truly want to please God.—Deuteronomy 30:19.

Ohhhh, i see, so you're retracting what you said in the Your Youth book when you said that homosexuals are not born that way but that their behavior is learned through masturbation? Hmm. So when you had that thought it wasn't Gods thought at all then? It was from someone's own head?
I think articles like this are a sign that more and more young ones are becoming aware of how normal being gay is and how the real world is a lot more accepting of them than their supposed all loving god.

49

Sisters as Ministerial Servants?

by Spoletta in

my wife has been trying to convince me that the organization is hinting at the possibility of making some older sisters ministerial servants.

she is awake to a lot of the false doctrines, but is still clinging to the hope that the org may become more progressive in the future.

anyone else pick up on this?

pale.emperor

Pale.emporer Why the tea towel??She wasn't teaching. Sometimes I think witness women get a kick out of this submission shit. A bit like young, modern completely liberated girls in the west wearing the Burkha or scarves when no one in their family does. Is it a sexual kick. Who knows.

It came from some elders not knowing their arse from their elbow and not being sure whether it constitutes a mere woman being above a man in some capacity. The very old elders thought she should cover her head, the younger ones thought no head covering. So just to be safe and not to upset the toddler in the sky that gets very upset for no big reason she had to cover her head. Except we live in the 21st century and western women dont tend to carry head coverings nowadays. So it was either a tea towel from the KH kitchen or a cushion. She opted for the tea towel.

It was only for about 30mins though, as soon as my talk was over i was lead to the sound desk prompty by a spotty MS who is fresh out of high school yet cant fathom how to work a simple sound desk (its only a laptop with mp3s on connected to volume knobs for crying out loud - have a go!)

34

Young People Ask... When Can I Start Dating?

by pale.emperor in

quite possibly the most annoying and patronizing thing i've read in years.

comments of mine are in yellow.. .

she doesn't trust herself to make her own decisions and she's going to wait years even after she thinks she's ready.

pale.emperor

I don't mean to play devil's advocate here, and I also do not agree that the only appropriate setting for a sexual relationship is marriage. But I do feel like there are good general standards that can be followed.
One must keep in mind that even practing safe sex leaves the possibility of the girl getting pregnant, which if both parties are not at least nominally prepared for it will cause a lot of problems. Either the burden of a child before one is ready or the emotional baggage of having aborted one's child, a decision which can haunt one decades later. So I would say the first standard to keep in mind is maturity.
Secondly I recommend that love be found amongst the couple, for one never knows which partner one may have to raise a child with.
These are personal standards however not ones I would push on anyone else. It is entirely possible that by advocating its strict stance on such matters the WTBTS is merely trying to avoid any lapses at all, however no matter what their intention no number of rules and guidelines can fully counter human nature, and in the end it seems more likely to cause one to have an unhealthy focus on sex and then have feelings of guilt over it.

I know what you're saying, and that's fine because it's your decision. It's when it becomes dictated to young ones by 6 old men who have no idea, with written rules with sanctions and gossip if you deviate from this article that's the problem. Some non JW's will have their own morals that are stricter than the WT's but as long as it's their decision thats fine.