Posts by Perry

31

22,000 years of arctic ice cores melt, and wash the YHWH/JESUS concept down the sewer

by fulltimestudent in

the full story, as told in the uk guardian can be found at: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/apr/16/arctic-ice-cores-melt-university-alberta-canada.

and briefly it tells of an equipment failure at a storage facility for ice cores that had been extracted from the polar ice cap in various locations.. but note, that the layers of ice evident in the cores covered a period of 22,000 years.

and from the christian/jw perspective, that's impossible, for the bible story of the flood (verified by jesus and sundry other biblical writers) maintains that 4000+ years ago, the ice caps would have melted during the period when the earth was covered by the divinely caused deluge.

Perry

The Greenland Society of Atlanta has recently attempted to excavate a 10-foot diameter shaft in the Greenland ice pack to remove two B-17 Flying Fortresses and six P-38 Lightning fighters trapped under an estimated 250 feet of ice for almost 50 years (Bloomberg, 1989). Aside from the fascination with salvaging several vintage aircraft for parts and movie rights, the fact that these aircraft were buried so deeply in such a short time focuses attention on the time scales used to estimate the chronologies of ice.

the average annual thickness of ice at Camp Century located near the northern tip of Greenland is believed to vary from about fourteen inches near the surface to less than two inches near the bottom (Hammer, et al., 1978). If, for simplicity, we assume the average annual thickness to be the mean between the annual thickness at the top and at the bottom (about eight inches), this still gives an age of less than 6000 years for the 4000-foot-thick ice sheet to form under uniformitarian conditions.

Article

Would like to see that Snowbird

31

22,000 years of arctic ice cores melt, and wash the YHWH/JESUS concept down the sewer

by fulltimestudent in

the full story, as told in the uk guardian can be found at: https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/apr/16/arctic-ice-cores-melt-university-alberta-canada.

and briefly it tells of an equipment failure at a storage facility for ice cores that had been extracted from the polar ice cap in various locations.. but note, that the layers of ice evident in the cores covered a period of 22,000 years.

and from the christian/jw perspective, that's impossible, for the bible story of the flood (verified by jesus and sundry other biblical writers) maintains that 4000+ years ago, the ice caps would have melted during the period when the earth was covered by the divinely caused deluge.

Perry

What information is that Snowbird?

26

Were the apostles of the 'Anointed class' when they partook?

by why144000 in

according to john 20:22 the apostles did not receive the holy spirit until after jesus was resurrected.

wouldn't this make them part of 'the other sheep' when they partook of the bread and wine?.

Perry

The "other sheep" were simply gentile believers. During the Church Age, there is only one group being gathered - the Bride of Christ.

16

Why does Jehovah choose certain people to rule with him in heaven?

by iWant2Learn in

in other words, what good works have the 144000 done to be secured a place in heaven?

i am told they have already been chosen.

does that mean that jehovah also knows our future?

Perry

The general Christian view is:

God chooses people to rule with him in Heaven who believe him.... between Calvary and the Great Tribulation time period.

Christ gathers all the gentiles (and some converted Jews) who believe during the church age (times of the gentiles). Those still alive at Christs return "in the clouds" are evacuated to heaven (the 1st resurrection) just prior to the Great Tribulation.

Then Jehovah reserves for himself 144K Israelites as a co-ruling class.... probably on earth (not as clear on this point).

One is the Bride of Christ. The other is like a wife to Jehovah. (Remember that the New Covenant did not void the Old Covenant. The New Covenant is described as a better covenant.)

Both groups rule with God during the Millennium over these groups:

1. Other believing Jews found at the end of the GT

2. Believing Gentiles found at the end of the GT who did not join the Antichrist to kill the Jews (Christs Brothers)

These people enter the kingdom millennium on earth but are not immortal, can die, and can still pass on the sin nature to their children.

At the end of the Millennium the age old question of nature vs. nature will have been answered, since many will still choose the sin nature over God, in spite of perfect government and peace.

I am a Christian believer. And, I don't feel qualified to rule with Christ. But my feelings are not what guides my decision making. God's word does.

People who get themselves in agreement with God now regarding abandoning the sin nature, apparently are given high priority and greater responsibility with God, whether they feel like they deserve it or not.

38

If we are further away from perfection, why are we more moral?

by stuckinarut2 in

as we know, witnesses teach that adam and eve were perfect and then committed the first act of sin and rebellion.. they in turn were cursed,and we all declined as their offspring.

humans supposedly lived shorter and shorter lives, and became more imperfect and sinful.. the further away in time humans go then, they should be getting worse.

so why is it then that as a society, humans have actually improved in so many ways?.

Perry

Judeo / Christian ethics has had an enormous impact on the world.

23

So, any comments from the Memorial?

by NewYork44M in

jw
friends

perhaps i missed the comments, but i did not see a lot of comments from, or about, the memorial.

it happened last night, right?.

in years past the jwn board was hot with comments.

Perry

Does the wt Bible leave out "all of you"? - Carla

No it is the same in the New World Translation

23

So, any comments from the Memorial?

by NewYork44M in

jw
friends

perhaps i missed the comments, but i did not see a lot of comments from, or about, the memorial.

it happened last night, right?.

in years past the jwn board was hot with comments.

Perry

The Lord's Supper as played out according to the Watchtower is a great act of rebellion against God, in at least 2 ways:

And when He had taken a cup and given thanks, He gave it to them, saying, “Drink from it, all of you; for this is My blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for forgiveness of sins. Mt. 26: 27, 28

1. All are commanded to drink of the symbolic blood because it represents an irrevocable contract between the participant and God. Why "all" and not just 144K ?

2. Because the purpose of the contract is NOT for government positions in the kingdom per se, as the WT teaches, rather the purpose is clearly defined as "for forgiveness of sins". Since all have sinned, all must participate in the contract so that a death has occurred on their behalf for their personal sin debt.

When I was a regular pioneer, I used to mock Christians for their seemingly constant harping on the need for a "personal savior".

It finally made sense years later when I read a scripture that I NEVER heard quoted even one time at a Kingdom Hall.

Hebrews 9: 27 It is appointed unto man once to die, and then to face judgment.

The WT teaches a sort of collective judgment based on who is in the Organization and who isn't. The bible teaches that there will be a personal judgment, hence the need for a personal savior.

John 5: 28, 29 - Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

20

Does God really care about mankind?

by Sour Grapes in

i am dying of cancer.

yesterday i asked my full blown jw wife if she could snap her fingers and make me well would she do so?.

she replied, "yes.

Perry

Very sorry to hear about your illness.

if you ask them, "so you are telling me that your god is going to destroy 99.9% of mankind"; they will say that it is up to god who survives because only he can read hearts.

Where they get the idea that a persons' heart condition has anything whatsoever to do with Salvation is beyond me.

The JW's do indeed worship a god of their own concoction that will kill 99.9 % of the worlds population. Fortunately, the god they worship is just another impotent idol and not the real thing.

In Christianity, prior to the Great Tribulation the Creator promises to evacuate (rapture) .... not those that have a "good heart", (because the bible is clear that there aren't any of those after childhood), but those who put their trust in Christ.

In Christianity, the anti-christ kills billions of people (after most people fall over themselves putting him in power) during the GT, not God.

Christ comes as a rescuer at the end, before he totally wipes out mankind.

Eternal life is available to anyone through Christ, even after the rapture and during the GT. He said he's come back from the dead, and he did it. That event changed the world.

Death has no final authority over those that trust Jesus.

496

This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe

by cofty in

sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.

Perry

Cofty,

The credulity that is required to believe in miracles

And a self appearing universe from nothing is distinguishable from a miracle how?

This is another example of the inconsistency of atheism.

The moral failings of scripture

How could you possibly know what is moral if your morals are based on your own subjectivity? Even if you got a moral "right" you would not be able to know it because everything is constantly evolving, including morals, right?

496

This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe

by cofty in

sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.

Perry

Perry - Another pathetic attempt to distract from the challenges of the OP.

Cofty,

Your views have been demonstrated over and over to not be consistent, and thus illogical. You lost the debate. Get over it.

What do you think of the brain suppression study leading to greater incidence of atheism that I posted?

That area of the brain also moderates social behavior which may account for your repeated historical use of the term "WILLFULLY IGNORANT" to describe those not like you; and more recently on this thread the repeated and non sequitur use of the word "pathetic".