philo

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Posts by philo

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  81

  Nourishment for the Spirit

  by Maximus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my observation is that persons who 1) heal/adjust the most rapidly from their jw experience and 2) seem to have the most joy in life are those who read, read, read, in pursuit of what i call nourishment for the spirit.

  i've really enjoy the pithy aphorisms you use here, which suggests you've distilled some wisdom from somewhere.

  i'm going to ask your help in this thread.

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  philo

  I read August 1914 by Solzhenitsyn on my spiritual way out of the Organisation. It’s a beautiful documentary of the war from the many Russian perspectives: admirable but incompetent leaders, valiant and clueless commanders, cowards, heroes, monumental sacrifice, and just plain wastage. It's probably more of a bloke-read but I won't burn for it. I don't remember if it was before, during, or after this book, that I realised I had grown tired of Theocratic Warfare. 1914-1918 was too long, but Russell's 1874 to the Org's 1990 (and now 2001 and still counting) is worse than a war, it is a victory over spiritual peace. The Russian general Samsonov is described with such sensitivity and even love, I am reminded of Franz's way of describing certain members of the governing body. Here Solzhenitsyn quotes from (or invents) a news report…

  Thus General Samsonov's vigorous action was, as it were, a blood-sacrifice upon the altar of brotherhood in arms…

  In memoriam A.V. Samsonov

  Your watch you kept with eagle's eye,
  O'er storming men, o'er victory's gain;
  Far, far above you in the sky
  All but unseen, an aeroplane

  …Among the dead is General Samsonov. Naturally, no one will be down hearted at this news and no one will despair at the death of these brave men. Their blood will temper our courage even further…

  philo
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  2

  Looking for German to English Translators

  by AlanF in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  anyone who can decently translate german to english, please contact me at [email protected] .

  there's an interesting project i'm trying to get some support for.. alanf

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  philo

  I've got an old linguaphone set! It's from the 1970s and has things like "now, now, my good man" in it.

  Sorry I can't be more help Alan.

  philo
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  11

  Ad hominem

  by philo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  why do we sometimes attack people rather than ideas?.

  we lack the mental reach to chase an argument further, or we just can't be bothered to, the issue clouds over, we begin to realise the limits of our capacity, and all we can see clearly is the person who brought us to this unpleasant place: so we lash out at them, our 'opponent'.. ideas are difficult and people seem easy.

  the truth is that people are much more difficult, and when we attack them, it is not usually with understanding, rarely does it advance the debate.

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  philo

  A few words about my motive in kicking off this discussion.

  It starts off with community. My posts have, without my being completely aware of it, been going this way for sometime because I think it is worthwhile to discuss discussion, and debate debate; to talk about us, here.

  Maximus' description of how arguments while seeming to develop actually can breakdown certainly resonated for me: words, words, words. However, it is unfortunate that, often, it is only a third party or latecomer who is able to identify when this line has been crossed. Likewise with the line between acceptable social manoeuvering and unacceptable aggressive posturing. This is the strength of a community, that there are many eyes on any debate. I like the 'providing tools' approach, but I think an equal or even prior consideration should be community building. A sense of community seems to me to be the prerequisite for most people's learning experience. I'm not trying to paint 'tools' as meaning a purely individual approach, I'm just identifying what I see as a subtle emphasis.

  So often heated arguments can develop and cross 'the line' into becoming unproductive from a community aspect, (breaking bridges etc) over what amounts to a matter of subtle emphasis. How often do we scan a long thread between two posters and ask ourselves, what is this arguement really about?

  Of course, we all need drama and our personal 'scent' and other stuff, and so we hype up our differences. But if we are unaware of such tendencies, we can weaken our own arguments and damage our community. There are no objective standards here that I can see. The line between marking territory (which gives this place geography) and plain warmongering, is defined by the community at any given time.

  As much as I retch at the slogan "winning hearts not arguments", (somehow it connects with "bums on seats", I dunno why) it makes a lot of sense. I mention this because most of us want to help JWs in some way. I think it is more important to focus on our 'domestic' community issues as on any single issue, such as news, doctrine, even paedophilia, for unless we create/maintain a healthy community we are, as Max's friend said, kicking away people's crutches.

  I'm very pleased to see from responses to my post, that I am not alone in some of my concerns, pleased too that a couple of heavies have similar concerns and have got involved .

  Amazing,
  I often see the word 'helpful' appear in your posts, or else that is something I notice they have in common. I think you lead the way with this spirit, and I'm looking forward to your coming related post.

  philo

  I just realised, I have changed my tac already on the dramatising thing. LOL. Can't even be consistent!
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  32

  When Reinstated...NO APPLAUSE!

  by Disengaged in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the other evening a young person was reinstated and the jerk-water elder making the announcement went out of his way to remind "the friends" that applauding would not be proper.

  what mind control, bunk, dribble, bull................ they are so loving aren't they?

  i shoulda applauded anyway.

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  philo

  Aguest,

  I can't believe it! Do you believe in cyber telepathy? Spooky. LOL

  philo
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  32

  When Reinstated...NO APPLAUSE!

  by Disengaged in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the other evening a young person was reinstated and the jerk-water elder making the announcement went out of his way to remind "the friends" that applauding would not be proper.

  what mind control, bunk, dribble, bull................ they are so loving aren't they?

  i shoulda applauded anyway.

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  philo

  Sam Beli

  Sorry Sam, but I think you are wrong to say Brooklyn have got THIS one right, dead wrong.

  First, there are scriptural reasons (see above) to rejoice over a repentee, even if he/she came back for selfish reasons (see prodigal).

  Second, I could easily quote you real, as well as plausible but fictitious, cases to show how awful the welcoming silence at the hall is. So your example doesn't show that Brooklyn got it right.

  How often is the human desire to delight in the return of a lost friend suppressed, in the congregation? Most times in my experience. And for why? because of a blanket, unnecessary policy which presumes to dictate to human emotions. I have no problem with applause when people are happy, or silence if people are doubtful about a returnee. I have no problem with a mixture of the two. If a welcome party is arranged for a returnee and nobody comes, that's fine. But when a totalitarian gerantocrazy has imposed itself on the hearts of the people who know best: that's the brothers and sisters who knew, know, and probably still care about the person they have been shunning, this is entirely WRONG!

  I would love to know that after reading this you have revised you opinion. Not to flatter my vanity, but for your own sake. What? Am I getting pompous again. I CAN do that.

  philo
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  6

  F1

  by Alternative in

  1. social
  2. physical

  i don't know now where i formed this question before,.

  so i start a new topic.. formula 1. great european sport.. now lets see who are the real experts.. no need waiting until the end of the season.. i think michael schumacher in his ferarri will be the champion.. does any one agree.

  or disagree as most here do that for a living.. now lets see who are the real experts.. no need waiting until the end of the season.. i think michael schumacher in his ferarri will be the champion.. does any one agree.

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  philo

  Alternative, I disagree with you utterly. At least, when you say something, I'll disagree if I can.

  I'm waiting.

  I was late for a sunday meeting once, to watch more of the live coverage of a grand prix, and saw Senna die. I don't know what to say about it, I was speechless then, and I am now.

  philo
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  16

  Just a little comedy to brighten up your I-Day

  by slipnslidemaster in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://members.aol.com/cygnus97/index/sounds/onlygo.wav.

  slipnslidemaster: "do, or do not.

  - yoda

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  philo

  Nice arrangement a much loved Kingodm song. I definitely approve. But would the GB approve?

  philo
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  13

  How I Became a JW

  by philo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  when i began to study with jws, i deluded myself into believing i was pursuing truth, when i was pursuing a closer relationship with my dad.

  i suppose keeping him happy by joining his new club didn't seem cool to me as a teenager, when i was meant to be rebelling from his authority.

  but having had so little to share with him emotionally, or intellectually for most of my upbringing, this seemed too good an opportunity to pass up.

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  philo

  A new-found place
  Led by angels
  Empowered for good
  With Reasoning and compassion
  Against ignorance I engaged 'The World'.

  Feeling the forces of darkness and light
  Enchanted to be an atom of truth
  Accelerated toward living and dying
  For the final cause

  As one they spoke:
  Gather and huddle among us sheep
  Safe from the wolves
  Exemplars of love
  Humble but honest exemplars of love

  Lifted from water, Washed of myself
  Subjected to law, Induced into order
  Reduced and refined, Defined as of "Us"
  18 and a Brother

  Raised the curtain: the act begins
  Of qualities new
  Line by line
  Quantities placed
  Step by step
  Qualifications met

  Manifesting spirit for the corps
  And door to door showing myself
  Frame to frame
  Contentedly doing, and doing again

  Seeming my place amidst the compelled
  United in one unit in a column
  By hundreds and tens, adding or subtracting
  From sullied or saved

  Down, head down
  Lowly high-blown
  Pasted, untasted Scriptures to view
  Gap-filling gruels
  Groaning fools
  Gnawing plainchant

  Magazines selling
  Creases and collars
  Polished pattering
  Doubt suppressed
  And hours to impress on the soft terrain
  Of the unteachable

  Step up:
  I spoke to the multitude
  To the moulded and manoeuvred,
  To approximate that holy shape:
  The public speaker

  Victory of body and troubles of mind
  Brought unrequited thought
  And I voiced my small voice
  And dug calm nails in the listening wall

  And on I prayed aloud on the stage
  Weaving loathed acclaim for my name
  From the fibres and the formulas
  Of model material

  But as one man fell to icy oblivion,
  And I heard low "Resurrection Oh"
  Weak bromides,
  Then I comprehended my gain and my loss

  Slowly it came, and without hope
  I found my own unjust judgement
  In a new place
  With the former things not called to mind

  Yet how light that congenial care
  Which took to the air
  As double honours announcement made
  And stepped heavily from the stage

  If angels beckon a second time
  I will fall at their feet
  Then to the dust I will ask
  Only to be shown Christian love

  What price you paid in human sacrifice
  Of gentle histories
  To fulfil the words of he who sighed
  "By their fruitage will you recognise"?

  For my friends -
  That famous love of yours was weak
  And I gaped at your efficiency
  At your own hearts' bloodless surgery

  When in every one of your places
  Would I have done to you the same,
  My brothers?
  Oh to my shame, I would have.
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  32

  When Reinstated...NO APPLAUSE!

  by Disengaged in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the other evening a young person was reinstated and the jerk-water elder making the announcement went out of his way to remind "the friends" that applauding would not be proper.

  what mind control, bunk, dribble, bull................ they are so loving aren't they?

  i shoulda applauded anyway.

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  philo

  I think the society was getting concerned that people might be getting shunned, putting themselves through endless agonies, out of a desire to get attention. A round of applause is a dangerous intoxication only truly worthy of the society itself (and its high ranking officers). For example, you applaud the TALK not the speaker, very wise advice.

  philo
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  10

  The Island of Feelings

  by Prisca in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  love asked, "richness, can i come with you on your boat?

  next, love saw sadness passing by.

  " "it was time", knowledge answered.

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  philo

  I know what you mean, Logical, but when i think a bit more I know you are wrong, in my case and yours. You are not so bad really, hate ya to death!

  Prisca, you are, I suspect, verging on the wonderful.

  philo

  ,