Posts by redpilltwice

76

Hi, all...I'm a faithful JW who is sick of lies about us

by James Donalds in

i was baptized 30 years ago and have been in the faith for over 35 years.. our organization isn't perfect.

but i'm sick to death of seeing stereotypes about us.

we are not mindless automatons.

redpilltwice

James, welcome.

Our organization isn't perfect.

Troll or not, this might be the understatement of the year. Every religion makes this claim, so I'd like to hear something else...

Prove why you don't belong to a false prophet.

16

Intro

by jc1985 in

jw
friends

hello all, many years i have been lurking on this site.

gradually i’ve learned the real truth, gone from serving as a servant and at bethel to inactive for almost a year, barely ever wasting time going to meetings.

my family is large and very active and so is my wife’s so leaving altogether is difficult.. though it seems now that everything is about to change.

Wow, I could have said welcome as well, but I see that you have been lurkng here for about 10 years and already posted back then. That's a long time ago and I feel a bit little now... nothing but respect for long time members.

But of course I truly feel sorry that you are in this current situation. It wasn't your choice to leave. Must be strange after having read so much info and personal experiences from others during all those years.

Yes, you WILL keep your head above the water. May your new life give you strenght and renewed energy and yes, this forum will always be there for advice, comfort, to vent......

23

1st month of fading

by Jrjw in

i'm nearly at the end of my first month of becoming inactive.

only my daughter knows.

i've had a cold half of the month so no questions or pressure has been put on me yet.

redpilltwice

Don't give too much personal info to anyone. Try to avoid suspicion. Like doc said, be busy, feel "tired" whatever... that really could be the best strategy. JW's usually respect medical/mental circumstances and hopefully will not spy on you. And by reading your first post , you DID experience tough times. Maybe your "cold" will not leave entirely and they will get used to your poor immune system. (What the heck do they know about you anyway, and as long as it serves your road to freedom...)

It's exactly like the Awake! once said...we live in a time of super bugs! JW's love that stuff!

Anyway, you can also search for "fade" or "advice fade" at this forum and you'll find out that all roads lead to Rome.

Good luck with your strategy!

52

What Made You Decide To Finally Leave The Organization?

by minimus in

jw
friends

was there one certain event or was it more a cumulative thing?.

redpilltwice

Cumulative from 2012 (Candace Conti) to the final nail in the coffin, the ARC 2015.

"Overlapping generation" and "type/anti-type" WT studies were also VERY "helpful".

17

Crisis of conscience

by Jrjw in

hi everyone.

what does anyone think of the crisis of conscience book?

.

redpilltwice

A powerful eye-opener that helped me on the way out. Impressive to see how everything is backed up with quotations and official WT letters.

46

Will Artificial Intellegence Make The Human Race Extinct?

by Brokeback Watchtower in

i think it is inevitable.

i don't worry about it but it just seems that the human race is going down a road that they can't make a turn off.. they are probing/discovering how the human mind works and produces intelligence down to the individual molecule.

now with the invention of the super quantum computer soon we will be able to build even better artificial intelligence greater than our own, so it will be easily able to out smart us because will we be a bunch of dumb apes first discovering how to make fire in it's eyes.. it will have it's own different agendas than us humans.

redpilltwice

Thank you too WeatherLover, I've read the article.

AlphaGo Zero also discovered new knowledge, developing unconventional strategies and creative new moves that echoed and surpassed the novel techniques it played in the games against Lee Sedol and Ke Jie."

What exactly is this new knowledge other than extremely fast calculation and trial and error of every possible move that could've be done? If the data is build up by playing against itself, it has to know the rules before it can decide what will be a better move and what isn't. By being able to play a zillion games in no time and ongoing trial and error it seems to have reached perfection. That's cool, having the potential to scan and evaluate every move that could've been made by anyone anytime anywhere. Of course, the outcome will surprise us. We are individuals, not knowing what all other players know. Humans also have emotions and sometimes do things by intuition, not knowing where and when the same situation occured in the entire history of this game. This "cold" approach and the relentless way the algorhythm is programmed gives it a unique helicopter view that is unparalleled in exhausting all the meta-data.

Impressive? Yes, very! But I remain sceptical because it still didn't go beyond what is has been programmed for... play against yourself, remember and store the data, improve by trial and error and become better and better and better up to the point of perfection. No human being will be able to have access to so much data at once by using memory, but we can build machines that do it for us because we program them to do that specific task, they have no free will.

46

Will Artificial Intellegence Make The Human Race Extinct?

by Brokeback Watchtower in

i think it is inevitable.

i don't worry about it but it just seems that the human race is going down a road that they can't make a turn off.. they are probing/discovering how the human mind works and produces intelligence down to the individual molecule.

now with the invention of the super quantum computer soon we will be able to build even better artificial intelligence greater than our own, so it will be easily able to out smart us because will we be a bunch of dumb apes first discovering how to make fire in it's eyes.. it will have it's own different agendas than us humans.

redpilltwice

Thanks for your input Island Man. I appreciate different approaches of the matter, that's what makes it intriguing. We are uncertain about the amount of control we can have in the future and we're talking about huge things that certainly will influence our lives. Therefore I also agree with ttdtt because we develop AI to help us and perform certain tasks more efficient, not because scientists want to become digital alchemists and deliberately open pandora's box.

It learns how to do its task by being fed lots and lots of data. It finds patterns in the data and creates and tweaks its own rules for processing data based on those patterns. It is like a child that learns to talk and learns the meanings of words by listening to others talk and the context in which specific words are used. It's learning the way we learn, albeit in a far more rudimentary way - for now.

How did it "learn" to learn in the first place, by itself or by intelligent human input?

How does it "find" without acting within the laws of programming? Does it "want" otherwise? No, it has no will or desire.

I believe that we can only reason and try to predict from experience and so far our experience is that codes do not write themselves, they are written by us. A defect or virus will not improve its working, a program can even be shut down because of it. So why expect such a huge positive "mutation" in non-living matter/digital machinery?

A lot of people get hung up on the issue of consciousness and self awareness. But these aren't needed for AI to be a danger.

True, and that's why I mentioned the millenium bug. There was potential danger (so we were told), and no one will claim it had to do with some AI being self aware.

All that's needed is superintelligence. AI has already proven itself superior to us in basic strategic reasoning used in games

I disagree, it is not superiour to the sum of our collective intelligence in any way. Algorhythms are not capable of learning, they can solve problems because they are programmed to perform certain tasks, such as calculation and data processing and darn, they do it superfast! But let's take chess. It has no freedom to create new rules, it can only search all options, no matter how many. It can even detect patterns of the human player because it can have access to all past and current data that has been stored during its gameplay history. None of those options is unknown to our collective knowledge of chess. It is not intelligent in the sense that it can create something "new" in the world of chess.

I know that people like Stephen Hawking fear a 'rise of the robots' in the future, but so far every smart machinery that has been invented by humans has been improved or replaced because it became outdated. So why would a machine or computer suddenly be "miraculously blessed" with the will and intention to jump ahead its own purpose, become smarter and do its own thing?

Furthermore, wouldn't any attempt to create, test and develop AI only take place under strict and controlled circumstances/protocol? How could any certain artificial attempt to think for itself go unnoticed by the scientists involved? Wouldn't they rigorously study everything that is happening in detail before going any further?

Like was said in the OP, I also don't worry too much but for my own reasons. I do NOT fear a human extinction because of AI.

46

Will Artificial Intellegence Make The Human Race Extinct?

by Brokeback Watchtower in

i think it is inevitable.

i don't worry about it but it just seems that the human race is going down a road that they can't make a turn off.. they are probing/discovering how the human mind works and produces intelligence down to the individual molecule.

now with the invention of the super quantum computer soon we will be able to build even better artificial intelligence greater than our own, so it will be easily able to out smart us because will we be a bunch of dumb apes first discovering how to make fire in it's eyes.. it will have it's own different agendas than us humans.

redpilltwice

Brokeback, this has always been a very intriguing topic. I haven't watched your video's, but boy, did I enjoy all the Terminators and Matrixes! My stance however has become very sobering through the years.

I believe AI will just do what it is programmed for...by very, very, very intelligent programmers becoming even more intelligent because of research, testing and experience. Yes, their work is very impressive but no matter how much data and capacity we're talking about, isn't the formal goal to do exactly what it is programmed for? When it doesn't, the user will not be pleased with flaws and the risk for damage (remember the fear for a nuclear armageddon because of the switch to the year 2000? That wouln't have been AI). Even a random search or function without any goal would still need to be programmed to NOT look for or do something specific.

In case of some sort of "evil" doom scenario... in order to rise above our OWN human intelligence and what it has been programmed for and deliberately turn against its human creators, AI should need to develop self awareness, creativity, independent thinking, long term strategy, and maybe even feelings, emotions and its own standard of morality.

Aren't those characteristics what we only find and exclusively see in a mind, a thinking brain? (not talking about plants, trees or animal instinct here).

In fact, I believe the future is bright... medical, space programs, otherwise... let them robots come!

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