<Goodboy, you ain't "up-to-date" lots of Dutchies are considering to emigrate to Canada (overheard on the radio today) people are thinking it is'nt safe here any longer. (because of the fundamental Islamic murder and murderlists)> Yes, I read about Theo Van Gogh and I can only imagine how that event is polarizing the Dutch. Frankly I'm surprised they tolerated so much Islamic immigration anyway. What do you mean by murderlists?
Goodboy
JoinedPosts by Goodboy
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21
Watchtower and Masons book?
by Goodboy inhello all.
i am trying to locate a copy of fritz springmeier's book, "the watchtower & the masons".
can anyone help me locate a copy?
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21
Watchtower and Masons book?
by Goodboy inhello all.
i am trying to locate a copy of fritz springmeier's book, "the watchtower & the masons".
can anyone help me locate a copy?
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Goodboy
The link to an audio version seems instead to be an interview, but I'll buy one anyway. Googling (duh) did not turn up any info that led me to a place I could buy a copy. It is my undrestanding that the author Fritz Springmeyer is in jail. Is this so? In an interview I read at http://www.whale.to/b/sp/springmeier1.html, he seemed pretty lucid. He mentions a conspiracy between the Watchtower and the LDS (Mormons). I find this very interesting. Well, if anyone can help me find this book, I'd be happy to scan it and post an analysis somewhere. In lieu of paying the author through regular channels, I imagine we could each contribute to Fritz's legal defense fund on our own. :^) Branda: Holland is sounding great right about now. How's your guest room?
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Watchtower and Masons book?
by Goodboy inhello all.
i am trying to locate a copy of fritz springmeier's book, "the watchtower & the masons".
can anyone help me locate a copy?
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Goodboy
Hello all. I am trying to locate a copy of Fritz Springmeier's book, "The Watchtower & the Masons". Can anyone help me locate a copy?
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44
JW Code and Silent Lambs
by Goodboy ini have been busy for the past few weeks and finally got around to reading the thread containing bill bowen's latest letter to the governing body.
apparently the gb just locked the gates and ignored them.
correct me if i'm wrong, i haven't dug through all the posts... .
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Goodboy
Wow, glad to hear you folks found this thing useful. I spend so much time typing code that I forget if I'm speaking like a human or a computer.
I'd say "Marked" is relatively the same as shunned, but anyone can feel free to modify this thing as they wish. Just don't repeat a letter or it gets confusing, and don't complicate it too much. Some of you say, "I don't fit" and then your mom was a JW or whatever-- Look, if you were dragged to meetings below the age of ten, I'd call you an "R". That's the point" You didn't "discover the truth" with a fully-formed adult brain.
Hell, this code could be modified until it's useless, but really, like I said, the last component, B, U or N is the most important. Either you believe is a god who gives a crap about us (which also makes him responsible for tornadoes, deformed babies and ovarian cancer) or you don't. I can accept the idea that Jehovah exists, the bible is true--and he's a total prick who doesn't give a flying **** about us. That seems quite plausible, but it still makes me an "U", because I don't believe he cares, see?
Goodboy
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44
JW Code and Silent Lambs
by Goodboy ini have been busy for the past few weeks and finally got around to reading the thread containing bill bowen's latest letter to the governing body.
apparently the gb just locked the gates and ignored them.
correct me if i'm wrong, i haven't dug through all the posts... .
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Goodboy
I have been busy for the past few weeks and finally got around to reading the thread containing Bill Bowen's latest letter to the Governing Body. Apparently the SilentLambs march didn't go exactly as some folks would have liked. Apparently the GB just locked the gates and ignored them. Correct me if I'm wrong, I haven't dug through all the posts...
Before I get to the question of the letter itself, theres something I've always wanted to do. I want to suggest a system of reference:
There are two ways you came to the truth:
- (R)aised (born into, etc)
- (F)ound (at the door, by a friend, etc.)I mention this first because it CANNOT BE CHANGED. Let's use the term, 'R' for Raised and 'F' for Found. (I've seen this topic discussed elsewhere, but I only scanned through it). The point is; you are either a Raised or a Found--forever. You cannot change your status.
R's will generally have a pain that the F's cannot understand-- or so they tell themselves. Raised ones will always believe they would not have been duped at the door. They wonder how the Founds got trapped. The Raised feel like more-seriously violated victims, especially the female ones (in whose case, its pretty correct).
F's will generally feel a greater private guilt (especially males who had/have responsibility). They are secretly embarrassed that they got tricked. They seek each other out to discuss the matter or they rationalize it to them and move on. The R's do not and cannot understand this embarrassment or shame. They have no frame of reference for it.
I'm an R, just so you know. Gave my first talk at age 5 (sitting down, facing my dad like the sistas do). Baptized at age 15 (already losing faith, but was in love with a Pioneer girl (an R) who required it of me).
The next classes can ALL BE CHANGED. Pay attention...
Currently, you are one of three groups:
- (C)urrent JW (baptized)
- (X)-JW (was baptized, now DF'd, DA'd, Shunned, etc.)
- (A)ssociates of either.Let's use the codes 'C' for Current, 'X' for X-JW, and 'A' for Associates.
C's can only be reasoned with at the most basic level. They are not thinking properly, plain and simple, but there is definite hope for them.
X's are the champions, either by force or by situation. They are cut off and on their own. At this point in history, they are Pioneers in the true sense. X's spend a considerable portion of their time supporting C's as those ones ask questions and struggle with the enormity of abandoning an entire life-system. They also spend a lot of time explaining this madness to their friends, who are A's.
A's are simply bewildered by all of this. They cannot comprehend it, but they are often fascinated by it. Most C's and X's wish they could be A's (including me, I guess).
I'm an X. Hung around to get my bearings and save my wife, finally walked my DA letter over and handed it to the congregation P.O. My wife and I are out now, friends living separately and fully enjoying our lives. I'm proud of my accomplishments, but would just as soon have met her now and fallen in love with her at age 29 than to have had to salvage our love at such a cost of pain and suffering.
Finally, there is one another major class-distinction and it's the BIGGEST one. You are currently either:
- (B)eliever in God (specifically, a God who gives a damn)
- (U)nbeliever (in a God who gives a damn)
- (N)ot SureThis is where a lot of stickiness comes into play. Before I discuss it, let's solidify the JW Code:
Goodboy is an RXU (Raised, X-JW, Unbeliever)
Vivamus is an FXN (Found, X-JW, Not Sure) --Viv, correct me if I'm wrong.
My mom is an FCN (Found, Current JW, Not Sure if God gives a damn) --Mom, give me a call, willya?Before we can discuss any topic, I think we should identify ourselves with a code like this. It quickly gives the person to whom we are speaking a convenient frame of reference while not demeaning anyone. We are all interested in JW issues, but we are all very different.
How can a RXB discuss the issue of homosexuality with an RXU? One of them believes in Paul's writings, and the other does not. Yet both of them were raised as JW's and are now being shunned. Shouldn't they be able to sit and talk about their common issues? This code will enable them to respectfully discuss the issues they have in common.
(BTW, If you do not know someone's status in one of the classes, just substitute an asterisk, '*' in the appropriate column. In referring to Ray Franz, I could say he's a "*XB" because I don't recall if his parents were JW's. Bill Bowen would also be a *XB for the same reason.)
Having done that, and speaking as a RXU, I can say that there are many people I love who are still *CB's. They are beyond my reach, yet I love the memory of the person who was inside them. Understand; this is the only reason I am even here on this message board. I am quite happy to walk away from the Watchtower forever.
So how do we reach those people? And how do we "Protect the Children" (a politically worthless but nonetheless valid ideal)?
Well, in regard to Bill Bowen's actions, let me just say this: He is engaged in a chess game. The only difference is that the pieces each weigh a hundred pounds for Bill, and they are effectively weightless for the Watchtower. Lawyers are nothing to them. Not only do they have the money to afford Johnny Cochran, they have an elite law corps, raised, trained, (molested?) by them. How can one win such a game when one cannot even lift the pieces?
Ray Franz slowly learned how the gameboard was set up. A couple differences about Ray: (A) he was the observer to the things about which he wrote, and (B) he was the Thousand-Pound-Gorilla in regard to his credibility. The man was a member of the Governing Body, for goodness sake. He still knew he couldn't win the game so he wrote a brilliant essay on the matter, tossed it on the gameboard and walked away.
Enter Bill Bowen, a 'Nobody'. An anonymous elder from some backwoods Kentucky congregation, who somehow managed to get Connie-Freaking-Chung to expose some seriously heinous goings-on (on primetime TV no less!) within the JW membership and also how the organization tried to hide it. Well done, William. You have ALREADY succeeded beyond anyone's wildest dreams. Not to mention the fact that you've helped two really sweet girls (and hundreds of other folks, both male and female through the website) tell their story of abuse to the world.
Bill Bowen has no lawyers. Those of you who mumble, "This now should be handled by lawyers" should dig deep into your pockets to pay for such legal services or shut the hell up. Plain and simple. As my dad (an FCN disguised as an ex-uber-elder who stepped down long ago to deal with his rebellious son but never stepped back up once the son was gone) used to say, "If you're not suggesting a better solution, you're just a whiner." How much have you donated to the Silentlambs legal fund through PayPal? So you drove/flew to New York and were disappointed. Give us a break.
Bobby Fischer is the greatest verifiable chess player in history. His games against 'superior' chessmasters are analyzed to this day, especially his game at age 13 against Grandmaster Donald Byrne, commonly referred to as "The Game of the Century". When he was a child, he lost a few initial encounters with the world's best, but he always came back to beat them soundly and permanently. In analyzing his games, chess players will often comment, "That move is the _wrong_ move!" yet Bobby Fischer understood gameplay in its truest form. The ultimate rule in chess and in any game is this: Play the board when you face a weaker opponent, but play the player when you know he's stronger than you. Men are predictable and if you understand their patterns, their size and strength become non-issues.
My point:
You aren't Bill Bowen and you aren't sitting at the gameboard. Remain silent until the game is done. Moves, which make no sense, become "Brilliant" if the game is won. I don't know how good Bill Bowen is at chess, but I know brilliant moves when I see them. Here's hoping he (or the next guy/gal) brings the 'tower crashing to the ground because I'll be the first one sifting through the wreckage for the people I loved and still love.
Goodboy.
Edited by - goodboy on 5 October 2002 5:8:33
Edited by - goodboy on 5 October 2002 5:11:23
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Polyamorous/Open Relationships
by LucidSky inbut what makes this social taboo still unacceptable by many even today?
we'll define polyamory as a sexual or romantic relationship involving more than two persons during the same time period.
all persons involved understand this up front.
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Goodboy
If you want to see how poly could really work, check out any good Heinlen book. Start with 'Friday', one of his better and more recent ones. The idea of the family as an corporatation into which you buy a "share" (expensive, like a mortgage), but once you do, you become a fully fledged part of the family, with sexual rights and everything. The lines of parent, spouse, child become blurred in a strangely wonderful way. Gals get to take their three husbands all together at once if they want, etc.
Actually tho', the world is much simpler. Whenever one of my wives complains, I just quote Brigham Young to her:
"Now if any of you will deny the plurality of wives,
and continue to do so, I promise that you will be
damned." (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 3, p. 266)....this rarely works and I do get the sh** kicked out of me often, but oh that makeup sex!
Goodboy.
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on the subject of sex
by Vivamus ini am being very serious here, i am having some thoughts on the subject of sex.
what is it that determines the way you view sex?
is it upbringing, or genes?
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Goodboy
Viv: I am offended by this question when you are currently raising our children.
Seriously tho', of course folks have different sex drives and of course people are going to screw around when they get out. Why don't you tell us what your adventures have been? Do you have any funny stories of your post-JW physical pursuits?
Goodboy.
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New Link CNN Bowen interview video capture now up!
by Trauma_Hound init is encoded in windows media format, will have larger mpeg later on, it's about 8 megabytes in size.
enjoy .
new link!.
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Goodboy
I put the Chung clip on Xolox (it's a file sharing program like Napster). Download Xolox from:
http://www.xolox.nl/client/software/
...install it (delete the suggested share of the "My Music" directory), find a suitable folder to share to the world and and search for the filename "chung_081402.wmv" which you'll download to the folder. After it downloads (could take hours on a 56k modem), you'll be sharing the file with anyone else who wants it, directly from your computer.
This sort of thing is cumulative: Everyone who downloads the clip and keeps the Xolox software on their system will automatically be sharing the load with everyone else. None of us wants to donate fifty bucks a day, but we can all keep the clips on our computer at a low-bandwidth download rate.
Have fun! I'm sure T.H. can answer any technical questions as well.
Goodboy.
Edited by - Goodboy on 15 August 2002 20:10:26
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New Link CNN Bowen interview video capture now up!
by Trauma_Hound init is encoded in windows media format, will have larger mpeg later on, it's about 8 megabytes in size.
enjoy .
new link!.
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Goodboy
Yeah, I'm paying 10 bucks for every gig of data downloaded. If this clip gets downloaded 500 times, it'll cost me roughly 40 bucks.
The best solution is to put the file on Kazaa or Morpheus or Gnotella. Does anyone have prefrence?
Goodboy.
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New Link CNN Bowen interview video capture now up!
by Trauma_Hound init is encoded in windows media format, will have larger mpeg later on, it's about 8 megabytes in size.
enjoy .
new link!.
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Goodboy
Try to get ahold of "Elsewhere" as he had offered server space.
My version of the clip is at: http://www.sweetbomb.com/cc081402.wmv
I'm gonna be watching the logs but I'll put it up for a little while. 600 requests for a 7 meg file is 4 gig of bandwidth, which is pretty high. I think just those 600 requests would cost me 50 bucks. At that rate, (50 bucks a day?) we'll have to set up a central location with a donation link to Paypal or something. There's gonna be a lot more clips.
Goodboy.