Posts by HereIam60

25

Fear not those who kill the body, but cannot destroy the soul (Not in the new song book)

by slimboyfat in

jw
friends

i finally got my own copy of the new song book in english.

i notice that the lyrics in one of the songs have been changed from:.

fear not those who kill the body, but cannot destroy the soul.

HereIam60

...Just trying to refresh my own memory here... I think the explanarion given in the now-long-ago 'You Can Live Forever in Paradise on Earth" study book was that the "soul" was the Person, the living combination of the physical body and the spirit, or "life force" that Jehovah placed within it.

Scriptures used being Ezekiel 18:4 (The soul that is sinning will die...) and Ecclesistes 12:7 (...the dust returns to the earth...the spirit returns to the true God who gave it.) At death the body ceases functioning and eventually decays, and the 'spirit' /'life force returns to God, who gave it, and who can re-create the body and restore the spirit, of those in his memory, bringing back that unique individual Person.Thus the original body can be killed, but the soul/Person cannot be destroyed, as Jehovah always has the power to bring him back if he so chooses

They used to go into explanations of the Hebrew "nephesh" and Greek "Psyche" but that has long since been dropped, and since the 2013 revision of the New World Translatiion, the world Soul is very rarely used in Watchtower writing, although Matthew 10:28 still reads "...cannot destroy the soul..." with a footnote stating "or life, that is life prospects

I am not maintaining that this is a correct interperetation, just trying to recall what I was taught...

8

What did the WTS say the "inner rooms" to find safety

by blondie in

jw
friends

as recently as 2025, the wts has compared the "inner rooms" to the congregation as a place of safety.

do you remember this?

notice the "weasel words" the wts uses to lay the foundation for "adjustment" or "clarification" of their statements.

HereIam60

I was surprised that reference to these verses was not made during the Covid pandemic, when Kingdom Halls were not in use, and meetings were held on Zoom with Witnesses in their individual homes, that we were "in our interior rooms until the calamity passes".

But yes, I remember those Watchtower quotes,. I've noticed that often vague, speculative statements are made, sometimes for years in print, before something is stated directly. Here the progression over several years iis ...could be...appear to be...we will likely...

Similarly, fior many years " the faithful and discreet slave" ( then said to be the remnant of annointed Christians still on earth), was said to be "closely associated" with brothers serving at the World Headquarters of Jehovah's Witnesses, then eventually it was blatantly 'announced' that the FDS is the Govening Body alone.

6

Changed View of Post Armageddon and Paradise Conditions ?

by HereIam60 in

when i first came into contact with jehovah's witnesses they were talking about god's kingdom bringing about a peaceful new world.

the scripture used being psalm 37:10,11 "just a little while longer and the wicked will be no more.you will look at where they were and they will not be there., but the meek will possess the earth and they will find exquisite delightin the abundance of peace..".

i took this to mean, then, that when jehovah intervened, at his appointed time, it would be instantly, invisibly, and painlessly.

HereIam60

Dear BluesBrother:

I have seen the clip online several times and went searching but could not locate it. There are some ex-jw-reddit posts on it, but they seem inconsistent as to what and when it was from. It was said to be a Convention talk.

In looking I came across another Splane "masterpiece" . Talking about how resurrected Bible characters will have to be brought up-to-date on how to worship acceptably, he actually says, (as examples)...."No Abraham, that child does not need to be circumcised!...You're no longer a king, David, if you want a glass of water you'll have to get up and get it yourself!....I know you're happy to be resurrected Samuel, but we don't offer animal sacrifices anymore. Put down that knife and leave that bull alone..!"

15

Bible Reading Schedule, Dumbed Down?

by Slidin Fast in

jw
friends

has any body noticed that the bible reading schedule has been reduced to one chapter per week.

does any one know if this is a policy change or something temporary?

at this rate the complete cycle will take 22 years plus..

HereIam60

I also have wondered about this. Allegedly it is to provide more time for meditation and reflection, which it does, but I also wonder if it's an intentional stalling while the Governing Body and their writers work on a major overhaul in interperetation.

We spent most of last year on Psalms and are just underway in Proverbs. If one chapter per week continues it will be a long long time before we reach the Gospels and Christian letters again. Lip service is still given to Read The Bible Daily and by reading 3 chapters a day you can read it in a year., but this schedule is the Weekly Bible Reading for the mid-week Christian Life and Ministry meeting.. The Spiritual Gems part, where people can share what they learned from the reading, is one of the few opportunities for individual expression left. I would say locally that 90% of the comments just repeat Watchtower quotes, but there still are occasional original or independent thoughts expressed.

They've done away with type/antitype teaching, and most of the old Revelation book explanations will likely have to be discarded, (such as the trumpet blasts being resolutions read at long-ago conventions).

For a time I thought a new Revelation study volume might be in the works, as a couple years ago there were 2 Watchtower study articles giving an overview of Revelation, which contained time-line charts of the sort used in the most recent study publications. If there were plans for this they are possibly on hold, as the next book to be studied congregationally is the children's 'Lessons You Can Learn from the Bible'

I can never decide if there really is some Master Plan, or if the GB has no clue where they are going. Sometimes suspect it's possibly both, with some members " in the know" and some in the dark..

54

1975 !

by Sea Breeze in

how many of you here remember 1975?

i hope the newer generations never forget.the true believers got shamed for it.

those who were hedging their bets, fared much better.

HereIam60

I was studying in 1985, when concerned friends and relatives brought up the 1975 predictions, of which I was unaware, I asked the young couple studying with me, and they gave me the standard answer "Oh, some Witnesses thought that...but the 'Society' never said..." Of course they were just repeating what they had been told. Had I been alert I might have asked "But I thought you all spoke in agreement! Why would they think that?" But I didn't, and when I pressed for more information they gave some goofy reply about "We don't know how long Adam was in the Garden of Eden before Eve was created"

Our Kingdom Hall had an extensive library, so researching myself, I saw the statements that were made in Watchtowers, but it was so far removed from where I was mentally at that time that I was puzzled but it didn't really impact me. Some time later, the older brother who conducted the then-in-private-homes Group Book Study, and liked to reminisce, recalled a Convention where "...Brother _______(I've forgotten the name...)...really made it sound like it was 'comin' that year.."

Later when I heard that some had bought cars, gone into debt, thinking they'd never have to repay, I was extremely puzzled, because the brother who first studied with me, though young, was very severe, and had heavily emphasized that we were to be NO part of the world, it, and its Religious, Political, and Commercial systems were passing away, and if we were tied into it, in any way, we would pass away along with it. This led me to believe (for a time) that we should not own property, have insurance, or debt. Later, reality set in...

As many others have proved amply, much was printed and said to raise, promote, and encourage expectations. And there used to be that blurb in the magazines about "a peacerul new world, sure to come, before the generation thst saw the events of 1914, passes away..

62

Probability of Earth and life being how it is

by ballistic in

jw
friends

there are some things we don't know about existence and whether the earth is a simulation or even a creation.

but we can do some statistical analysis on it.. the probability of a planet like earth existing in the goldilocks zone and having a moon that perfectly eclipses the sun is extremely low, but it's not impossible.

the habitable zone (or goldilocks zone) around a star is the region where a planet could potentially support liquid water on its surface.

HereIam60

I know I'm out of my league here but will express. In the past I've briefly questioned: What if everything I "know" is a dream, illusion, hallucination ? Then I think, with Everyone and Everything else involved I couldn't possibly have invented or imagined all this, so it must be a shared reality. Life comes from pre-existing life, so tracing it back there must be an original Source or Energy. I can somewhat accept that a random event could initiate an evolutionary process, but what develops qualities such as caring, affectiion, love and willing self-sacrifice ?

Nor do I know if it's all overthinking, a waste of time, or good mental excercise.

6

Changed View of Post Armageddon and Paradise Conditions ?

by HereIam60 in

when i first came into contact with jehovah's witnesses they were talking about god's kingdom bringing about a peaceful new world.

the scripture used being psalm 37:10,11 "just a little while longer and the wicked will be no more.you will look at where they were and they will not be there., but the meek will possess the earth and they will find exquisite delightin the abundance of peace..".

i took this to mean, then, that when jehovah intervened, at his appointed time, it would be instantly, invisibly, and painlessly.

HereIam60

When I first came into contact with Jehovah's Witnesses they were talking about God's Kingdom bringing about a peaceful new world. The scripture used being Psalm 37:10,11 "Just a little while longer and the wicked will be no more.You will look at where they were and they will not be there., but the meek will possess the earth and they will find exquisite delightin the abundance of peace..".

I took this to mean, then, that when Jehovah intervened, at his appointed time, it would be instantly, invisibly, and painlessly. That everything harmful, and those who would persist in wickedness would just vanish, and those left would live and work together in peace. (I had come out of a long period of depression and mental illness, and I guess I was hoping for some kind of " magical transformation"). It was only later that the idea of Armageddon was introduced to me, and the pictures in publications of lightning, fire and hail falling from heaven, with people running through the streets screaming as buildings toppled and the ground opened up. I was disturbed by this, but by then had been drawn in by the association, and kept being assured that if I kept praying and studying everything would eventually be clear.

At that time, early 1980s, we were still getting hardline, old school talks and articles on how "every last vestige of Satan's wicked system of things would be shaken to the ground." Then following Armageddon we of the Great Crowd who were protected and survived would spend considerable time digging through the rubble. They used to go on and on about those prophecies about the birds feeding on the bodies of the slain. I used to ask others if that was literal or symbolic but no one would commit to an answer.

Everything would have to be rebuilt from the ground up, building houses, planting vineyards, welcoming back the Resurrected Dead, everyone being judged and instructed in righteousness as the effects of sin were gradually removed, until the end of rhe Thousand Year Reign and a Final Test, after which all would attain perfect everlasting life and "the glorious freedom of the children of God".

In recent years the Governing Body seems to have gotten and advanced the idea that somehow Watchtower properties and facilities will be spared and still functional. In one of his last talks before stepping out, Anthony Morris lII said (of the videos (purportedly) to be produced at Ramapo "... these videos could be....or may well be...used to teach resurrected ones!..."., and recent Watchtower illustations have depicted brothers teaching resurrected people using tablets and screens.

Even the " glorious freedom" is now seen as more directed and conrolled. Once it was said life could never be boring, we would have unlimited time to explore the earth and all of Jehovah's creation, to develop new skills and talents, to travel and eventually become a friend of everyone, and who knows, beyond that? Now they pitch the idea that people will be "assigned". David Splane said in a talk."... suppose you love the country, but you are assigned to live in a city?...Well you can learn to love the city!"

Also, some don't seem able to think beyond the Paradise pictures printed in the publications for so long. A visiting Sunday speaker here recently concluded a talk asking the audience to see themselves there..."Picture it! Your great-great-great- great grandchildren running up to you begging "Grandpa! Tell us again how Jehovah destroyed the nations at Armageddon!"... and imagine...the 10,000th time you rub that lion's belly will be just as delightful as the first! Well, perhaps, but with eternity in view I kind of thought we'd also move on to other pursuits...

Sorry so long, but would be interested in any thoughts...

71

Did the Fred Franz style of writing cease after he died?

by SydBarrett in

jw
friends

i was completely out by 1991 and 1989 would have been the last time i had to attend regularly.

that over the top franz writing style was still there in the 1980's although i've heard he wasn't actually doing much writing by then.

but his style was definitely picked up and imitated for many years beyond its wacky, outlandish peak of the the 50's - 70's.

HereIam60

One major change in the writing is the de-emphasus on the annointed. The two destinies, limited heaveny group , and unlimited earthy group, are still taught, but in the old school articles much was said about the responsibility of the remaining (then decreasing) number of annointed ones to carry out the preaching comission, and how essential it was for the other sheep to do good to 'Christ Brothers' by assisting them in this work. These ideas are still in effect but seldom directly stated. The term "the annointed remnant", once used constantly, seems to have gone totally out of use.

As the number of people claiming to be annointed rose unexpectedly, the Governing Body introduced the idea that some of those professing this were mentally unstable (calling their own claims into question)...and when they declared that they, and they alone made up " the faithful and discreet slave" it was essentially a dismissal of the rest.

At the last annual meeting they seemed to embrace the idea that the number has gone up..."Why how could you think the numbers would go down...the scriptures say that the chosen ones would be gathered from the four corners of the earth before the end...so we should not be surprised...nor is an apology needed for not getting it quite right before...

13

Does the GB Desire to be Worshipped?

by Sea Breeze in

how did i miss this after studying the rev.

book 3 times:.

obeying christ’s kingdom rule, they (the great crowd) hope to inherit its blessings here on earth.

HereIam60

Psychos want sychophants.

12

Too Much Video ?

by HereIam60 in

does anyone feel the same way?

i am not anti-video, just feeling overload.

since the jw organization started video production there has been such a flood of it that no one can, or possibly even wants to keep up with it all: some thoughts and questions i"ve had -.

HereIam60

Antony Mous

Online I do often play them at 2x speed!