Posts by DogGone

115

Survey---who is inactive, disfellowshipped/disassociated or active?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i am inactive for about 10 years now..

DogGone

Baptised as a teenager in 1993. 100% all-in.

Disfellowshipped 2003 - "loose conduct".

One year of trying to get reinstated. The reinstatement meeting was an eye openner. Absolutely terrible. I was denied, of course, but I had expected that. It was the asinine questions, the sheer incompetence and lack of care... my life, even my eternal life, was hardly worth a 15min conversation to these guys. So concluded the most painful period of my life.

Fully woke up from the period of 2004 to 2006. Getting professional assistance for my issues helped (whereas all the study/service/prayer/meetings never had). Having an inactive friend disfellowshipped for attending a function with me marked the first time I felt comfortable calling it a cult.

Am extremely happily married and have a brand new daughter (3 weeks old). Many of my JW friends left during the interim period. We are still good friends and I love them all very much. Remarkably, one who left before me returned. This after years trying to convince me my faith was wrong... such a strange planet. Course, as an Elder's son he never was disfellowshipped for his open drug use, sex, divorces, apostasy, etc. Such is the way of man made power structures and those who know how to game the system. I was stupid enough to go to the elders and confess everytime I sinned.

When I look at my daughter and lovely wife, I can't be bitter for anything. It brought me to this, humbled me greatly, instructed me on mercy, and forged a strength in me I did not know I had.

25

What's the dirt on the GB? Proven not anecdotal.

by punkofnice in

i have no respect for the governing body of jehovah's witnesses(tm) as i consider them to be wicked men.. having said that, is there any proven dirt on them that could expose them for the critters they are?.

i heard that jaracz was a sex offender but where's the evidence?.

.

DogGone

Apognophos and Old Goat,

Thank-you for your balance and intellectual honesty. Sometimes it seems those who once swallowed every good yarn from the WTS now swallow every slander.

76

What is the biggest regret or source of resentment because of being a Jehovahs Witness?

by stuckinarut2 in

i'm sure we could all write long paragraphs about this question, but in a few words, what is your biggest regret, or frustration in life due to being a witness?.

what missed opportunities did it cost you?

.

DogGone

My biggest regret is that it simply wasn't true - or at least, precious little of it

I actually had a great time as a JW. I'm not sure I'd have left if they hadn't kicked me out, so strong was my mental conditioning and social bond. I once told my worldly mother that I'd probably be dead if I hadn't stumbled into the faith at an early age. In hindsight, I can see I'd have benefited from any high control group. A military school would have done me equal or better.

The three KH's I was a part of had well-meaning brothers, even if they did forget you existed for a year or two. Half of the COs I met seemed to be good guys. The other half were obvious @$$holes. But, I was fortunate at the time to have a social group of liberal JWs who would acknowledge such things. We'd make fun of the idea that the flood was global, that lions eat grass, that the celestial signs were sputnik, that the trumpets of Revelation were Cedar Point Ohio. We felt secure that the core teachings were correct and the GB just went off on strange side streets. We used to talk over scotch about how the Society was better in the "old days" which we were too young to be a part of. It seemed to us that the religion had gone soft and stupid, but that was just another sign of the times.

You can see the mental gymnastics at work. A touch of arrogance that we were smarter than the average JW and a willingness to make endless mental adjustments for truly crazy teachings.

I had great friends, great experiences, and learned a lot. In a way, the KH took over from my failed family and finished raising me. There were times the Elders provided me profound assistance. Mostly, the advice was unintentionally damaging, though.

However, it was all "the Matrix". A completely made up construct. A cult. I'm not too hard on them, since the rule books they follow derive from cults every bit as obnoxious and brain washed. It was ever thus.

17

Do Current WT writers review Early Russell Writings? Obviously not.

by objectivetruth in

jw
friends

from the book "the divine plan of the ages" - c.t.

russell 1886. as a forcible illustration we mention the sodomites.

surely, if we shall find the restitution of the sodomites clearly taught, we may feel satisfied of the truth of this glorious doctrine of restitution for all mankind, spoken by the mouth of all the holy prophets.... unto the jews of capernaum he said, "if the mighty works which have been done in thee had been done in sodom, it would have remained until this day.

DogGone

I'll copy my post from last time Splash presented that list:

A more charitable list, IMHO:

Original view - Resurrected

1st Change - 1941 - Not Resurrected

2nd Change - 1965 - Resurrected

3rd Change - 1988 - Not resurrected

I think the 1967 reference is not conclusive in suggesting the people will not be resurrected. To me it is drawing a comparison to how the cities were never rebuilt as they were destroyed by fire and sulphur with how souls will be destroyed by the fire and sulphur of Gehenna. I see how a reader might see this as pertaining to the souls therein, but it does not appear clear to me.

Clearly, there was one change of views in 1988, not multiple changes. The 6/1/88 WT announced the change, books already in production had the old view. Arranging the articles and publications to suggest otherwise doesn't sit well with me.

When a fair presentation makes the point, why embellish?

29

Kansas City Shooter-Nazi in US Today

by Band on the Run in

jw
friends

i just heard on breaking news about a shooter in kansas city.

he is in his 70s and has a decades long history of antisemitic hatred.

i believe he killed three people near a jewish center.

DogGone

Space Madness,

Bad form.

You are moving the goal posts.

Your original statement was clear. You said that "Jews are literally the most racist people on earth." Note, you didn't say that Israel is among the most racist countries or that Israeli society is one of the most racist social arrangements on earth. That would have provoked some interesting conversations. This is a subject I've done some reading on and there are many aspects of Israeli history and society that I find deeply troubling. That could have spun off into a general discussion about the merits of the very idea of a "nation state" and the makeup of the political map of the 20th century. *hint, the notion of "nation-states" as obvious units of national organization is an inherently racist myth, IMHO.

But you didn't. You said that Jews are the most racist people on earth. Jews. Some of the most vocal critics of Israel are Jews, such as Noam Chomsky (whom I am not hereby endorsing). If you cannot see the bitter irony inherent in your statement, then you are a fool.

You make a generalization from fictional evidence

Your original post on this thread also made the bold claim that "Jews probably kill about 3 Palestinians a minute in Israel". Wow. That would be 4320 dead Palestinians a day or 1.577 million Palestinians murdered every single year. Not quit Nazi killing rates, but certainly up there. Amazing since there are only about 1.66 million Palestinians in Israel proper with another 2.7 million in the West Bank. Or maybe the killing machine extends to the other surrounding countries, including Gaza? How about you defend that statement.

You commit a non-sequitur

I don’t think all your comments about the ills of Israeli policies are out of line. But you started this rant in response to a post about the shooting of three people by a deranged person targeting a Jewish center. You said, “I don't buy into this so called antisemitism nonsense”. That does not follow. Even if you believe that “Jews” kill 3 Palestinians a minute, how can targeting Jewish people in another country NOT be anti-Semitism?

Let me show you your non-sequitur in another form:

My neighbor killed my dog today after repeatedly stating that he hates all dogs and wants them gone.
Well, dogs kill neighbors everyday
So, I don’t buy this so called anti-canine nonsense

3 does not proceed from 2.

84

100 things I learned from watching "The Prodigal Son" DVD

by Perversion of a truth in

these are things that were said or insinuated, i start with the first 15.

enjoy!!.

1. working for a corporation in the city makes you fall out of the truth.. 2. if you become inactive or leave jehovah you will make your whole family sad and ruin everything.. 3. all worldly people cheat.. 4. all worldly people curse.. 5.

DogGone

Thanks for bumping this thread up. Hands down the most hilarious thread I've read in ages. What a bunch of clever people we have here!

51

Is this proof that JWs are false prophets?

by Comatose in

.

DogGone

Wow... Comatose and Bennyk... Wow. Thank-you for sharing these quotes.

59

BOTR- Announcement

by Band on the Run in

jw
friends

law school is obviously not the hardest program to follow.

it isn't something that can be replicated on the internet.

a first year student can find the law.

DogGone

Best wished BOTR. Sometimes a thick skin is needed around here. Especially if you are trying to bring perspective to a topic where passions run high. I will miss your input.

19

Sodomite resurrection flip-flops -- recent WT confession?

by FatFreek 2005 in

within the last few years i understand watchtower has issued a concession (no apology) of minor proportion.

they don't admit to the avalanche of some 8 sequential positions (yes, no, yes, no, ...) of, "will the sodomites receive a resurrection?".

i think they admit to about three of them.

DogGone

A more charitable list, IMHO:

Original view - Resurrected

1st Change - 1941 - Not Resurrected

2nd Change - 1965 - Resurrected

3rd Change - 1988 - Not resurrected

I think the 1967 reference is not conclusive in suggesting the people will not be resurrected. To me it is drawing a comparison to how the cities were never rebuilt as they were destroyed by fire and sulphur with how souls will be destroyed by the fire and sulphur of Gehenna. I see how a reader might see this as pertaining to the souls therein, but it does not appear clear to me.

I don't think I need to elaborate on how 1988 was one change in thinking by the GB, not multiple changes.

19

Sodomite resurrection flip-flops -- recent WT confession?

by FatFreek 2005 in

within the last few years i understand watchtower has issued a concession (no apology) of minor proportion.

they don't admit to the avalanche of some 8 sequential positions (yes, no, yes, no, ...) of, "will the sodomites receive a resurrection?".

i think they admit to about three of them.

DogGone

FatFreek,

You are correct - this has long bothered me about this list. Clearly, there are years when a change is made and some publications are already in print. Particularily with stitch bound volumes like the Insight books. There was one change of teachings in 1988 - not a flip-flop back and forth. Likewise, one of the references in the 60's is to the destruction of the city, not the people.

There are so many legitimate reasons to call out the WT for the shifting sand that I cannot fathom why we need to invent more by a lack of charitable reading or by obvious order manipulation.

In the early 90's I came across this argumentation and it reinforced my conditioned response that apostates lie and twist things.