Posts by shepherdless

28

My JW Articles

by Salutaris in

hey there, .

i have an apologetics website, and i've recently posted three articles on jw doctrine.

i was wondering if you all could make suggestions to improve them, or for new content.

shepherdless

Salutarias

The following are a few ideas that come to mind for future articles. On each of them the JW's teach something diametrically opposed to what RC's teach:

Was it a Cross or was it a Stake? You could go into history, archaeology, medical evidence etc. (You could point out that despite what JW's say, the only religion that requires you to believe the wooden implement was a specific shape, is JWism.)

How to read the bible. Should it be read as a literal book of history and science, or is that missing the point.

Is a belief in evolution inconsistent with a belief in God?

What does the bible really teach about blood?

Is it right or wrong to read the bible for yourself on your own, in order to interpret it? (You might mention Romans 14:1)

Presumptuously speaking on behalf of God - False predictions, and what they indicate (Deut 18:20-22, Luke 21:8, Matthew 7:15, Matthew 24:11 and 24:22-27)

How to interpret Revelations: Who was the "beast".

Trinity: May be difficult to accept, but it is clearly in the bible, unless you "translate" it out.

History of the use of "Jehovah" in bible translations. Also, why the word Yahweh appears in some parts of the bible but not others.

Shunning: Would Jesus do it?

Peddlers for profit (refer 2 Corinthians 2:17). A history of Watchtower and colportage.

What does Jesus teach a Christian to do. (emphasis on charity, caring for poor, sick, unfortunate etc)

150

Evolution: The Deal Breaker

by Hadriel in

first off i do believe there are some evidences of evolution or i should probably say adaptation.

i do believe this exists in various forms.. however the deal breaker for me with evolution is the chick or egg problem.

there are tons of theories that get passed around as proof of evolution however these are usually examples much further down the evolutionary chain.. what i mean is let's start at the beginning!

shepherdless

I am certainly no expert on this, but I will throw my 2 cents worth into this discussion. (Besides, when has a lack of expertise been grounds for not commenting, here).

Hadriel seems to be focused on the step from an RNA world to a DNA world, and how could that have occurred.

We know RNA based lifeforms could have existed in the past, because they still exist in the present. For example, picornaviruses (such as Polio, various forms of Hepatitis, common cold, etc) are just self-replicating RNA, in a protein shell. They have no DNA. The reason that they mutate so fast is that RNA is less stable than DNA. You might think that they need a protein shell to survive, but I recall reading that even an RNA strand on its own has proven to be "contagious" and dangerous.

Even simpler than picornaviruses are "viroids". They are basically RNA lifeforms that do not even have a protein shell or even produce any protein. You could argue that they are not living things; just a complex chemical molecule that has a certain shape that tends to duplicate itself over and over, if in the right environment.
More complex than viroids and picornaviruses are double-stranded RNA viruses (eg gastroenterisis), which (my guess - I am no expert) could have evolved to the first DNA viruses. Or the intermediate step in the evolution to DNA viruses could have been through something similar to a retrovirus (which is self replicating RNA but uses DNA as part of the process).
So there you have it. Simple RNA lifeforms that dont rely on or make any protein, slightly more complicated RNA lifeforms that DO make protein, still slightly more complicated lifeforms that are essentially RNA but use DNA as part of the process, other RNA lifeforms where the RNA is arranged in a very similar way to DNA. All these lifeforms living on earth today. They are not science fiction.

The point I am making is that, although the exact route from an RNA world to a DNA world is unknown, the mystery is NOT that it couldn't have happened, it is which of the many possible ways it could have happened, did it happen.
Oh, and in relation to abiogenisis, coding, and the monkey typing out Shakespeare analogy, I recall reading somewhere that in a lab they have been able to create a self replicating RNA with a chain of only 120 or so "characters". you might think that even getting 120 characters in the correct order is unlikely. However, it only has to happen once, there are multiple orders that will self replicate, and that keyboard only has 4 keys on it.

35

what do you think is the main reason why so many young ones are waking up?

by Crazyguy in

seems as though the number of baptisms even for the young ones is down from what people report here.

at my former hall the young ones are all in totally sheltered even while going to school.

expressing thier desires to pioneer etc.

shepherdless

I think for young kids, it is not just the internet on its own. Kids coming out of school now are really the first generation that have been using the internet for most of the time as part of their schooling. Even primary school kids these days are required to use the internet to do research, prepare projects, reports, presentations etc. They are also taught how to tell if info on the internet is reliable or not.

In addition (as others have mentioned) these days they often research something on a tablet or phone.

As a result, they see the internet as reliable and neutral. I think they tend to trust info on the internet more than any individual adult, which is fantastic.

55

Just wondering who on this board has a spouse that is fully in and your awake?

by goingthruthemotions in

i am just curious who on this board is in the same situation has i am?

a spouse that is fully brain doogled in and you are awake to ttatt.. without going into serious detail and no names are given.

i would like to possible talk with one of you all, it's just so helpful to communicate with someone in the same situation as me.. i am located in the southwest united states..

shepherdless

I am in pretty much the same situation. My wife was fully out when I met her (but not mentally or intellectually, as it turned out). She eventually got dragged back in.

26

WTBTS vs. Islam

by kairos in

jw
friends

the articles and meeting parts have been missing something all along, as far as i can see.. jws are taught to demonize all 'worldly' ( not jws) organizations, individuals and religions as having no value only to be destroyed by god at 'harm-you-gettin'-( armageddon ).. why do they not mention islam?no scathing denouncements?.

the only publication i really remember, was the "mankind's search for god" book that touched on the beliefs and practices of muslims.. why do you think this is the case?.

shepherdless

Yes, Muslims are a hard sell, as SonoftheTrinity says. My understanding is that they:

don't accept the bible as being inspired (so there is no point in arguing over one or other interpretation or translation),
think giving God/Allah a name such as Jehovah is wrong (even sacrilegious) as it implies there are other gods,
are taught a key fault with Christianity is that a person is able to have a direct connection to Allah, without any other person (or organisation) acting as intermediatory.

Add to that that, leaving Islam would be leaving a community.

Maybe Watchtower is scared of saying anything negative about them. No multinational organisation would want to be seen as openly anti-Islam these days. Watchtower has never penetrated the middle east (except where there are expat Christians), and perhaps they want to slip in under the radar. Or perhaps Watchtower just can't work out a suitable rhetoric to deal with them.

50

Australia Branch to end magazine printing

by no-zombie in

jw
friends

just one week from the zone overseer's visit is the announcement that the magazine production by the australia branch will end in a few months.

the task being transferred to the japan branch.

while i'm not 100% certain, i understand that this effectively ends all major printing bar perhaps tracts, handbills and other loose items.

shepherdless

It has the "ring of truth" about it for me, as well. In fact, I want it to be true.

I want it to be true, because I see it as a mistake. konceptual and freddo make good points. And they probably reflect Watchtower thinking. However:

(1) Watchtower will have to keep printing its rags for its field work, etc. Printing half as much paper doesn't halve the costs. I just can't see JW's going door-to-door with a tablet in their hand, and even if they do, they will still have to leave something behind with the householder to make it worthwhile. Also, what are they going to stack their trolleys with? So JW's in Aust (and NZ) will still need lots of printed material.

(2) Yes, nobody will donate for their rags in this day and age (and that is why I said their business model is broken, in a thread some months ago), but they have to keep producing them for their style of preaching. There is no real halfway option.

(3) It is one thing to have one printing branch in, say, Europe or North America, where you could distribute by road or rail around the whole continent. Asia and Oceania combined is huge. For Australia, they would have to airfreight the printed material from Japan to Australia, over a distance much greater than between London and New York. If each Australian publisher were to need even just 20 Watchtowers/Awakes per month, my rough calculation is that would amount to 100 tonnes of airfreight per month. That is nearly a full Boeing 747 freighter per month, flying a third of the way around the world, just to supply Australia, alone.

So I am not disagreeing with anyone. I just think that it will prove to be a mistake by Watchtower.

33

Christians Know Who God Is

by Loi_241 in

many of us christians have a good question for you to ask, “who is god?” there are more than six scriptures to share with you.

you know the bible itself a true message for all the people on earth.

the bible explains ‘in the beginning god created everything: heaven, earth, animals, people and everything.’ thus, you notice god created humans, adam and eve.

shepherdless

From the quote of Genesis 1:26, it looks like Loi is quoting from the King James Version of the bible. That is the version that mentions unicorns.

Loi, do you believe in unicorns?

50

Australia Branch to end magazine printing

by no-zombie in

jw
friends

just one week from the zone overseer's visit is the announcement that the magazine production by the australia branch will end in a few months.

the task being transferred to the japan branch.

while i'm not 100% certain, i understand that this effectively ends all major printing bar perhaps tracts, handbills and other loose items.

shepherdless

This makes no sense. Japan is too far away from Australia, NZ etc. It will cost more to ship magazines than to print them. If Watchtower really wanted to save money, it could just outsource the printing in Australia to a commercial printer.

I don't believe it is to avoid payments related to ARC, either.

I suspect the explanation is one of the following:

(1) Some clown in Brooklyn thought it would be a good idea, without researching it, and given the Borg's inability to tolerate internal dissent, nobody pointed out it would cost more, not less.

(2) Watchtower wants to sell some of its better real estate in Sydney, and this is a preliminary step.

(3) It is not true.

I guess time will tell.

143

Fidel Castro and the WT

by Hecce in

i am going to engage on a trip to the past and share with you some of the matters that marked the beginning of the jws persecution in cuba.

you will be surprised that the pattern that was followed is very similar to what happened in other dictatorial countries.. in the cuban case, i am going to surprise you and tell you that like what happened with hitler; the wt was partially responsible for their clash and confrontation with the cuban government.

during the early 60s the revolution was fighting for survival and they were willing and ready to demolish any perceived enemy to their cause.. a prime example was their war against the catholic church that was the most influential religious entity in the country; it took the supreme leader only a few public discourses to send the vast majority of clergy packing and back to their country, in this case spain.. the jehovah’s witnesses were an insignificant minority but they over estimated their importance and displayed a belligerent attitude, it was known that this was a us based religion and an easy target to connect them with the cia.

shepherdless

Fisherman - Government was able to show that the WT was just a publishing house and that they were never registered as anything else, certainly not a religion.
That is a lie. It is a fact that the WT is a religion.

I don't necessarily disagree, but perhaps it depends on your definition of religion.

Fisherman, which ones of the following are religions?

(1) Scientology

(2) Pastafarianism

(3) Our Lady of Perpetual Exemption

Our Lady of Perpetual Exemption is explained in the following link if you haven't heard of it:

http://time.com/3999933/john-oliver-televangelist-church-alst-week-tonight/

I would be interested to know your answers.

87

Excellent Conversation At Literature Trolley

by cofty in

yesterday my wife and i enjoyed one of our regular days out at edinburgh - movie, lunch, walk, meal etc.. in the late afternoon while mrs cofty went shopping i had an hour at the excellent museum of scotland and arranged to meet up outside the national gallery on princes street.

on my way back i saw the jw trolley was at the usual spot on the royal mile.

there was an older man and a young woman standing well back trying hard to look inconspicuous.

shepherdless

Quarterback - JW's do not take the Genesis account literally. When it says the Earth was created in 6 days, a day is not understood to be 24 hrs long.

Yes, that is what I meant when I said they aren't "young earth" creationists.

Quarterback - You do realize that some scientists accept the Creation account when it comes to explain how it all started such as in the Big Bang theory.

I have never read anywhere a scientist in any scientific literature stating something like, "therefore the creation account must be correct..." in relation to the origin of the universe. By the way, can you specify this "Creation account" in Genesis (or elsewhere) that explains the Big Bang theory?

Quarterback - I don't think you can get to a version of evolution by logic, deduction or reason.

Well I can't agree on that. To me it is just the obvious explanation for so much I see in the animal kingdom and the plant kingdom. It explains why certain insects become resistant to pesticides, why certain diseases become resistant to antibiotics etc.

Anyway, each to their own. I expect Cofty will be along soon with a few questions for you.