Posts by Saethydd

36

Does enforced shunning violate free will?

by poopie in

jw
friends

and ..

Saethydd

Saeth... you are not wrong in that individuals can be df or da for openly associated with a df or da person. I would question you as to what you mean by "force"? The company is telling and individual... if you want to be a member you have to shun... So an individual has to say "i want to be a member therefore I am making the choice to shun this person" If they CHOOSE to shun then they have made a value judgement for themselves that being a member is more important than contact with the person who is to be shunned.

Well, couldn't that argument be applied to anything? "No officer, I didn't extort money from him, he just chose to keep his kneecaps intact, instead of keeping the money he had in his safe."

If you are taking a negative action against a certain behavior then you are enforcing against the behavior.

36

Does enforced shunning violate free will?

by poopie in

jw
friends

and ..

Saethydd

There is no such thing as "enforced shunning". That's not to minimise the powerful, coercive effect of Watchtowers hold over its members but ultimately shunning is a choice that every individual JW must be held accountable for.

Perhaps I am wrong, but I was under the impression that freely and openly associating with a disfellowshipped person is something one can get disfellowshipped for. Therefore, if that person does not shun, then they will be shunned themselves. That sounds like "enforced shunning" to me.

10

Picking up the pieces

by longgone in

just needing a listening ear, so in advance thanks for being here, no one other than ex-jw's could understand.

they may try, but i think only a person who lived through it could know what's its really like.. i wish i could be supporting others here but i'm so broken myself i can't seem to do that yet.

i hope that will come in time though.. for now, i'm trying to undo the damage done to my family by the wts.

Saethydd

I'm only a young man myself, still haven't left my parents home, so I don't know how much practical advice I can offer you. I will say this, though, I think you've made steps in the right direction with leaving the JWs and seeking out professional help. The only further advice I could offer would be to do your best to create a circle of friends, develop a support system that spreads beyond your family and do the best you can to deepen the support given and received between your family including your other children.

28

Sparlock is making his rounds again

by stillin in

i was at the meeting last night and the dreadful video about caleb and sparlock was forced upon the audience.

honestly, i had forgotten how bad it was.

the mother's manipulative over-reaction and caleb's acceptance that his toy was evil.

Saethydd

@sparky1 Oh I wouldn't be too sure about that, I know some really committed JWs that wouldn't even let their kids watch Disney movies with magic. (Glad mine weren't like that, I even got to watch Lord of the Rings for awhile until my parents changed their view a few years back.)

21

Are Children born crippled/diseased, uncared for, and dying prematurely proof that God does not exist?

by anointed1 in

are children born crippled/diseased, uncared for, and dying prematurely proof that god does not exist?.

1) what do children born healthy and well cared for prove?

2) what do babies aborted (many of whom might have led a normal healthy life, and some of whom might have contributed much to the society like many scientists, doctors, engineers ....) prove?.

Saethydd

Are Children born crippled/diseased, uncared for, and dying prematurely proof that God does not exist?
If so,
1) What do children born healthy and well cared for prove?
2) What do babies aborted (many of whom might have led a normal healthy life, and some of whom might have contributed much to the society like many scientists, doctors, engineers ....) prove?
3) What do babies killed in wars (some of which are created for the sake of war) prove?

I will use the word indicates here instead of "proves," because "proof" requires a large body of evidence, therefore these few pieces of evidence don't qualify.

I would say that things indicate a random selection for life and death, not completely random mind you because a certain amount is determined by genetics, chemistry, and society, but it is somewhat random and chaotic nonetheless.

28

Sparlock is making his rounds again

by stillin in

i was at the meeting last night and the dreadful video about caleb and sparlock was forced upon the audience.

honestly, i had forgotten how bad it was.

the mother's manipulative over-reaction and caleb's acceptance that his toy was evil.

Saethydd

I can't help but notice how they failed to define magic in that video. Perhaps because magic can be considered anything that defies natural explanation. Say, for example, parting an ocean with a staff, or raising people from the dead. The fact is, the Bible is full of humans who invoke magic, (referred to as miracles) to accomplish things.

It could even be argued that Moses was in fact, a "Warrior Wizard," after all he used magic to bring the Israelites out of Egypt and then organized the nation like a warrior would under Joshua.

19

Stranger asks about your kids mental wellness. ..

by purrpurr in

last night at the meeting there was a suggested presentation about the new mags, which cover the issue of depression in minors.

the jw jumps straight from "hi how are ya" to "how is your kids mental well-being " and of course the hh is more than happy to discuss the inner workings of their child's mind with a stranger whose just knockedmon their door(!).

if it was me i'd be majorly creeper out!.

Saethydd

Another thing, I fail to see how further burdening your teenager with strict rules that build their "spirituality," will somehow make them less depressed. Especially, rules which, by nature of and adolescents physiology and psychology they can not but help to fall short of, in their thoughts if not their actions. If anything this is likely to spiral them further into depression, based on feelings of guilt, a phenomenon I'm all too familiar with amongst my peers.

19

Stranger asks about your kids mental wellness. ..

by purrpurr in

last night at the meeting there was a suggested presentation about the new mags, which cover the issue of depression in minors.

the jw jumps straight from "hi how are ya" to "how is your kids mental well-being " and of course the hh is more than happy to discuss the inner workings of their child's mind with a stranger whose just knockedmon their door(!).

if it was me i'd be majorly creeper out!.

Saethydd

I was thinking the exact same thing in those few moments I looked up from reading "Reluctant Apostate" to see what tripe they are pushing this month. Perhaps they should start sending these videos out to householders so they know the appropriate responses to such situations.

15

Spiritual paradise or proverbial straitjacket?

by UnshackleTheChains in

noas a current or past jehovah's witness, do you / or did you feel part of a spiritual paradise with full liberty in christ as the watchtower society/organisation describes?.

or do you / did you feel you were wearing a proverbial straitjacket in the sense you feel / felt restricted and controlled by the watchtower society / organisation?.

Saethydd

I wouldn't call it a straight-jacket so much as a bubble. I was raised in my little bubble and told it was a paradise and no world worth seeing existed outside of it, and in fact, this bubble was in place for my on protection. As I aged I began to notice that parts of the things that existed in the bubble were pretty awful, but instead of doing anything to fix those awful parts I was taught to simply shrug my shoulders and say, "ah well, things outside the bubble are so much worse." I even managed to catch sight of things going on outside the bubble that seemed quite nice, but always managed to convince it couldn't have been so.

All of this changed however when I was forcibly ejected from the bubble, and instead of just sitting quietly outside the bubble I decided to take this as an opportunity to actually explore whether or not things out were as bad out here as I had been led to believe. I realized, of course, that they aren't. I mean it's far from perfect, but then again things inside the bubble were never perfect either, not for me anyway.

28

Sparlock is making his rounds again

by stillin in

i was at the meeting last night and the dreadful video about caleb and sparlock was forced upon the audience.

honestly, i had forgotten how bad it was.

the mother's manipulative over-reaction and caleb's acceptance that his toy was evil.

Saethydd

Heh, coincidently I recently decided to go ahead and watch the Harry Potter movies. They are actually pretty great movies in my opinion.

Maybe someday someone will make a movie about young Caleb growing up, going to high school or college, waking up from the manipulative teachings of the JWs and finally getting to see whether all that interest in Sparlock was warranted by his classmates.