It's amazing to me how the brain can do mental gymnastics to justify an absurd belief. I see a lot of cake having and eating here. We called it cognitive dissonance when we left the JW's.
rem
Posts by rem
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105How do you defend your god's inaction?
by AlmostAtheist inthis is a question for those that believe in a god or gods, particularly those described as "all knowing" or "almighty".. how do you defend to yourself that your god has not in any modern situation saved his people from anything?.
people of all faiths are regularly killed by various natural elements.
of course, if you knew such a thing was going to befall a person and you could do something to protect them, you would.
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rem
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rem
I'm ok with people who have faith and freely admit that their belief is irrational. I only get annoyed when they insist that their faith is based on some valid logic or that I'm missing out on something real because my mind isn't open to unfalsifiable claims with no solid evidence in their favor.
rem -
46
astrology and compatibility with your mate....a grain of truth???
by kid-A inlet me start off by saying i dont believe in astrology and most certainly not horoscopes.
having said that, i have often considered the real possibility that the time and season of the year we are born in can dramatically influence our pre-natal development and the resulting personality, i dont think this has anything to do with "stars" or cosmology, but we do know that babies born in certain seasons or months are more prone to certain illnesses, temperaments etc.. i'm an aries and had a really lousy relationship with a "cancer" for many years.
she always pointed out that all of the compatibility charts state that aries and cancers are fundamentally incompatible and it turned out....she was right!!
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rem
Robdar,
Did you know which one corresponded to Libra before your friend did your chart? If so, that doesn't sound double-blind to me. In any case, even if the methodology is sound, the experiment has to be performed many times so you can get statistically significant figures.
Cheers,
rem -
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Should I get the New Jerusalem Bible?
by inquirer ini've already got the other catholic bible new american bible.
i've always thought it was a rather good translation, but unhappy at the verse order -- in job some verses have been taken out completely and only used in the footnotes!
this has really got me down, because it's not just in job but they have taken this course in isaiah, habakkuk and many other "minor prophet" books.
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rem
the_classicist,
Yeah, actually I have that book... tons of Jewish pseudopiagraphica (sp?) and Gnostic writings. Really opened my mind at the time about what the Bible really was. That's really interesting stuff!
rem -
46
astrology and compatibility with your mate....a grain of truth???
by kid-A inlet me start off by saying i dont believe in astrology and most certainly not horoscopes.
having said that, i have often considered the real possibility that the time and season of the year we are born in can dramatically influence our pre-natal development and the resulting personality, i dont think this has anything to do with "stars" or cosmology, but we do know that babies born in certain seasons or months are more prone to certain illnesses, temperaments etc.. i'm an aries and had a really lousy relationship with a "cancer" for many years.
she always pointed out that all of the compatibility charts state that aries and cancers are fundamentally incompatible and it turned out....she was right!!
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rem
Or better yet, look at several chart signs without knowing which one correlates to what birth time and decide which one describes you best. Then see if you picked the "predicted" chart.
If the methodology is sound (double blind), I would expect a number of such experiments to pick the "correct" chart no better than by chance.
rem -
16
Should I get the New Jerusalem Bible?
by inquirer ini've already got the other catholic bible new american bible.
i've always thought it was a rather good translation, but unhappy at the verse order -- in job some verses have been taken out completely and only used in the footnotes!
this has really got me down, because it's not just in job but they have taken this course in isaiah, habakkuk and many other "minor prophet" books.
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rem
I have to say that the New Jerusalem Bible is one of my favorite translations, both for its accuracy and for its footnotes. I also like the fact that since its a Catholic translation you get some extra books and even extra verses, I believe, that don't exist in the protestant translations; for instance, the end of Daniel.
rem -
46
astrology and compatibility with your mate....a grain of truth???
by kid-A inlet me start off by saying i dont believe in astrology and most certainly not horoscopes.
having said that, i have often considered the real possibility that the time and season of the year we are born in can dramatically influence our pre-natal development and the resulting personality, i dont think this has anything to do with "stars" or cosmology, but we do know that babies born in certain seasons or months are more prone to certain illnesses, temperaments etc.. i'm an aries and had a really lousy relationship with a "cancer" for many years.
she always pointed out that all of the compatibility charts state that aries and cancers are fundamentally incompatible and it turned out....she was right!!
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rem
Kid-A,
I say give it time, my friend. :)
Seriously, though, I don't know of any studies that show any corrolation between tempermant and time of birth. In fact, study after study shows the opposite.
What we are seeing is a well known psychological phenomenon called the Forer Effect, or the Barnum Effect.
rem, party pooper. -
369
Why naturalism is irrational
by Shining One inirrational naturalism (#201) .
by henry morris, ph.d. .
abstract .
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rem
Yeah, it makes my head spin!
I think I've said enough to damn myself to the 7th demension of hell on this thread so I'll leave it to you intellectuals to hash the rest out. :)
Cheers, mate
rem, deluded class -
369
Why naturalism is irrational
by Shining One inirrational naturalism (#201) .
by henry morris, ph.d. .
abstract .
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rem
LT,
>> You're determined that we have to use YOUR definition of the word "delusional", huh?
I have a good reason for this as I have demonstrated. The strict interpretation of the word does not account for unfalsifiable claims, which is silly because I think we can all agree that *some* unfalsifiable claims are so out-to-lunch that any person believing in them is truly delusional. Therefore, my definition is actually more correct because it is how people actualy use the word in the real world. To use the strict definition is, in my opinion, just playing games with semantics.
Do you not agree that people who believe invisible yellow dragons live in their basement are delusional?
What about the claim being non-falsifiable makes it out of bounds of delusion?
>> What's wrong with Gyles definition, that tolerates harmless beliefs (in contrast to a world leader who may or may not be acting on them on a cataclysmic scale)?
I do tolerate harmless beliefs... that's why I said before I would not call someone who believes that we all see the color green differently delusional. I simply wouldn't agree, but there's not enough physical evidence to say one way or another. If they insist without evidence I would probably just think they were a little weird.
>> Regardless of your consistency, the consensus is that you're intentionally using charged language. Being consistent in calling someone a b*st*rd doesn't make it any nicer.
I'm chosing consistency over niceness. But really, I have admitted that I'm not immune to delusion either. It's part of being a human.
>> You also make a number of assumptions, such as there being no evidence for an "external dimension" by which I assume you mean those theorized by scientists? You also claim that you have issues with certain things not being falsifiable, however I would posit that you take for granted that green is "green", with narly a whimper.
I was referring to a spiritual realm when I said "external dimension". Sorry for the confusion. I have already explained my stance about the color green.
>> There's a lot about the mind that remains unknown, with Psychology and Psychiatry being evolving sciences.
But but but... there is a lot that *is* known... and that's what I've been trying to explain. Not taking the time to understand what we do know about the brain and how easy it is to fool, in my opinion, makes a person more susceptible to delusions.
>> Nonetheless, there are very few people being locked up or even medicated because of religion or spiritual beliefs. I wonder why that is? Could it be because science doesn't yet deem such people as "delusional"?
As I said before, it doesn't seem to be a very dibilitating issue in real life... probably not dibilitating at all for most people and maybe even advantageous for others. It's just scary to me that people with these delusions can end up in power and decide public policy or persuade people to reject modern medicine or convince people they can find their missing family members, etc. based on their delusions.
rem -
369
Why naturalism is irrational
by Shining One inirrational naturalism (#201) .
by henry morris, ph.d. .
abstract .
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rem
Oldsoul,
I'm not trying to prove anything. I know for a fact that people hallucinate for various material reasons. I don't have to know exactly why a person is hearing voices or believes that he has a relationship with a non-material person - I just have to know that physical reasons exist.
This doesn't prove that the person has a physical reason for his perception, but it does mean that the most parsimonious explination is a physical one. There's no reason to make up or trust untested, unfalsifiable reasons when perfectly fine physical ones exist.
rem