Writing a letter to the local Elders showing that requiring a certain number of hours in field service as a mark of maturity, and then using that supposed basis for recomendations and apppointments is unscriptural. Also for stating that the Holy Spirit cannot be involved in the appointment process if you are going beyond what is written in step 1. Further stating that James 1:26,27 is discussing worship, and this is not being done within the organization as it should be. Saying a brother can't be recommended because he doesn't get enough time, but brother nephew, brother-in-law, son-in-law, or son can be appointed and STAY appointed despite behavior, immaturity, low hours and extenuating circumstances makes a double standard. Saying the GB is fallible and using the WT literature to prove it. Saying I trust men on a conditional basis, provided they do not go beyond what is written. Questioning current doctrine. Questioning organizational procedures. Saying that I will confront them if my child is harmed by their sub-standard child protection policies.
DATA-DOG
JoinedPosts by DATA-DOG
-
155
Whats the dumbest reason youve been counseled?
by avishai inmy friend was counseled for having a bad attitude because he wore white socks w/ his suit.
-
-
-
100
2012 annual meeting notes
by lostinthought insorry for the wait guys.... .
part one.
moorse had the opening comments talked about historic annual meetings.. .
-
-
DATA-DOG
Good point LLG. Expect df'ings to increase. The org being cleaned will be the only possible " logical " explanation for those too afraid to see the corruption, or operation of error of the GB. How does this new light change the scandal of Mexico and Malawi?
-
70
New Governing Body Member: Hugo Riemer - More WT Revisionist History
by 00DAD inas part of the wt's recent push to get the r&f "to study and recount the history of the earthly part of jehovahs organization" there is a curious article in the from our archives featurette of the august 15th, 2012 watchtower.
it offers a highly sanitized version of early jw history.
but what is particularly strange is this revisionist history re-categorizing of an early bible student/jw, one hugo riemer.
-
-
DATA-DOG
The " Evil Slave " will be those who believe anything contrary to the GB. Any non-genuine/ Judas anointed who disagree with current beliefs will be removed from the Organization in the near future. This will convince the R&F that the GB is the FDS because they are cleaning the Organization for real this time. Remember everything has been delayed now. Everything they are doing is for future control of future dubs. The teaching of " Millions now living will never need the elderly and infirm seating " is false. They will all die soon. Only the extremely militant dubs will remain for much longer. They will shepherd the newbies, mostly foriegn speaking.
-
6
Old "Light" Cannot Be Right - Interesting Quote from Watchtower
by Darth Rutherford incame across this quote from w64 2/15 p.101:.
"when a belief is not correct but is wrong, then it cannot be right at the same time.
the most sincere belief and practice of that belief will not change it from being wrong into being right.
-
-
DATA-DOG
Great quote Darth!!! We need to compile all these into 1 source, perhaps by category. I like this one you found, as I have never read it before! KS is right, some will try to explain it away. It just means that they are not ready for truth. For those that are ready it could be a catalyst. Years ago I had a seemingly random conversation that really got my wheels turning. This was over 2 years ago, and now here I am. I started a new job and received a new work phone. While in service ( lol!! ) I receive a text from an unknown person. They had known the last phone user. I told them I was in field service ( being a good JW ) They asked if Christ was my personal savior. This started a couple weeks of back and forth conversations with me furiously " studying " WT publications to refute the deceived person on the other end. Their last statement was " Your future is not secure with the WT.". I never forgot that one statement. From then on I was in observation mode. So you never know what may help someone. By the way your avatar is my favorite on the entire site! Equal parts creepy and hilarious!! Keep up the research for hidden gems of " truth ".
-
31
Telling family about "new light"
by Billy the Ex-Bethelite inokay, now it's my turn to start a thread about the gb/fds "new light" now that it's been well covered by many threads.
i've noticed that a few have brought this subject up with dub family who accepted wt "new light" without objection, saying that it "made sense" for the fds to only be the gb.
so i have an idea of how to bring this up with my family in such a way that will highlight that this doesn't make sense... at all.. and the timing of this whole thing is incredibly convenient for me since it wasn't that long ago that this came up with my parents and i said that the wt interpretation of the fds in matthew was out-of-context and flawed.
-
-
DATA-DOG
In a parable, Jesus indicated that from the first century onward, there would always be some genuine anointed Christians on the earth.....Let uis consider a few examples."
Nothing in this new teaching contradicts that.
Those 2nd century - 19th century guys were anointed, but they were not part of the "faithful and discreet slave".
They have in effect created a 2-tier system of anointed Christians - those of the FDS, and those who are not.
It seems to me that has been a two-tiered system in place for some time before the " Nu-lite ". Check this question from readers W 75 5/1
Without a doubt, if one of the anointed unrepentantly falls away, Jehovah does call another individual to take his place. (Romans 11:17-22) However, the number of genuine anointed ones who have become unfaithful is likely not large. On the other hand, as time has gone by, some Christians baptized after 1935 have had witness borne to them that they have the heavenly hope. (Romans 8:16, 17) Thus, it appears that we cannot set a specific date for when the calling of Christians to the heavenly hope ends.How should a person be viewed who has determined in his heart that he is now anointed and begins to partake of the emblems at the Memorial? He should not be judged. The matter is between him and Jehovah. (Romans 14:12) However, genuine anointed Christians do not demand special attention. They do not believe that their being of the anointed gives them special "insights," beyond what even some experienced members of the great crowd may have. They do not believe that they necessarily have more holy spirit than their companions of the other sheep have; nor do they expect special treatment or claim that their partaking of the emblems places them above the appointed elders in the congregation. They humbly remember that some anointed men in the first century did not qualify to serve as elders or ministerial servants. (1 Timothy 3:1-10, 12, 13; Titus 1:5-9; James 3:1) Some anointed Christians were even spiritually weak. (1 Thessalonians 5:14) And sisters, although anointed, did not teach in the congregation.
So before the Nu-lite, anointed ones were not granted special insight. Which is not consistent with bible teachings. Christ told his followers the Holy spirit would lead them to the truth, ALL OF THEM. So anointed ones are not to even question the Elders who are merely other sheep. Even when this article was written the GB is top dog. Even though they contradict themselves by claiming special insight, but at the same time claiming to be genuinely anointed ones who do not claim special insight. So one thing that is clear, is that they have always felt that they ( GB ) have special insight, and no other members of the FDS " class " did. The problem was how to make it official. It wasn't a big deal until the number of partakers started to grow every year, so much so that the dwindling number of the remnant had to be removed as a " line of evidence " about the nearness of the end from talk outines. They could not have members of the FDS class, that Christ foretold, contradicting their teachings. So they eliminated that class to buy themselves some time. They simply chose a path where they believed they could keep the damage under control with fast moving symposiums at conventions, coupled with a never ending to-do list for the sheeple to keep them so busy they can't think straight, plus articles to cause the cycle of guilt and works to continue.
So the sentiment has always been there, it is just becoming official new light. Most will swallow it. If we hammer out the details, at least those waking up might get some help. What else can you do? You can't make someone see.
-
76
Is Pacifism Ethical?
by cofty inin another thread about things the watchtower got right two posters have expressd agreement with the fact that the wt refuses to take part in war.. i don't want to derail that thrread so what's your thoughts on pacifism?.
personally i think there are times that killing your enemies is regrettably the lesser of two evils.. .
edited to add - this link may help in defining various shades of pacifism.
-
-
DATA-DOG
I wanted to enlist in the Military when I was younger. It's in my blood I guess, going back for a few generations. It all seems pretty romanitc when you are young and inexperienced. I realized in time that I could not take orders from a nameless, faceless entity and take lives for them without knowing all the details, which of course is impossible. The Military is compartmentalized for that very reason. As far as my private life is concerned, I quote Ra's al Guhl, " There are those without decency who must be fought without hesitation, without pity ". So being a true pacifist is not possible or moral in my opinion. For the record, I do not judge any persons in the Military, that is not my place.
-
6
do some stop attending meetings because they do not receive an appointment?
by solomon inconsider ryan from jan study watchtower.
ryan, a 32 year old ministerial servant, relocated to a new congregation.
"i expected to be recommended as an elder soon," ryan relates, "but a. year went by without that happening.
-
-
DATA-DOG
I cannot speak for everyone, but for me the Appointment/holy spirit mumbo-jumbo was part of the awakening process. The endlesss cycle of reaching out/guilt, always trying but never being good enough and seeing the hurt caused to good brothers ( although blinded ), bothered me for years. I have no desire to be in a spotlight being an INTJ, but I honestly wanted to help others, and just could not understand why some were being passed over and others ( almost exclusively related to Elders ) were being appointed. After a few other odd occurences I realized that Holy Spirit has absolutely nothing to do with appointments, just read the Shepherd book for confirmation. I won't pretend to know others motives for leaving, or switching halls. It could be that some are appointment hungry douches, others may know that something is wrong but can't figure out what. If they are still trapped in the guilt cycle they are probably just trying to survive. When your very spirituality is measured by " theocratic " appointments, and every six months the Elders and a floating sales rep for the WTBTS talk about you in a star chamber, it can get to you. I can't blame the hall switchers really. If all you supposed " friends " are just conditional anyway, why stay in one spot for too long? If I was single, i would immediately start switching around, find a legitimate reason for it like work or health. Then I would just dissappear.
-
45
We Need A Group Of Anointed To Challenge The Governing Body
by DT ini believe that a coup is one of the governing body's worst nightmares.. imagine a splinter group led by anointed ones that draw off enough of a following to cause confusion about who is directing the organization.. this may be one of the reasons the governing body removed the special status of the anointed and placed it on an organizational arrangement that they just happen to occupy.. the irony is that this action is a coup in itself.
by declaring themselves leaders in complete control of the organization, they have created a rival group composed of those who disagree.
these people have no obligation to follow these newly self appointed leaders.
-
-
DATA-DOG
sorry posted from my phone.....
-
45
We Need A Group Of Anointed To Challenge The Governing Body
by DT ini believe that a coup is one of the governing body's worst nightmares.. imagine a splinter group led by anointed ones that draw off enough of a following to cause confusion about who is directing the organization.. this may be one of the reasons the governing body removed the special status of the anointed and placed it on an organizational arrangement that they just happen to occupy.. the irony is that this action is a coup in itself.
by declaring themselves leaders in complete control of the organization, they have created a rival group composed of those who disagree.
these people have no obligation to follow these newly self appointed leaders.
-
-
DATA-DOG
Well,...that sounds awesome, but there is a problem. The sheeples are too brainwashedright now. I love my wife, but she is brainwashed. She straight up told me that she would let our kid die if the GB said organ transplants were cannibalism today. Even if they are wrong, or there is doubt, the sheepies will not disobey. The only hope is for individuals to escape. If you believe the scripturesthen you will partake if you are a christian. It doesn't matter to anyone though. I told the Elders that i partook in private. I baked my own bread and bought wine. I told them about a few things that needed changing. 5 Elders meeting later, I have zero assignments in the kh. Thats fine I dont care, but the point is there is NO getting through to anyone. I chose not get df'd at this time. If I wanted out it would be easy. The only real chance for most dubs is for the Org to self-destruct. Even then they will get scooped up by a splinter groupmost likely. If the bible is right and God has all organized religion destroyed, that would be great. I don't even care if who we call God is from Planet x, as long as religion as we know it is gone. Maybe if some HUGE scandals break, that cant be hidden some individuals will leave, but a mass exodus for any reason but the final destruction of organized religion is not gonna hapen in my opinion.
-
33
Fluff: Which Actor/Actress did you crush on secretly as a JW?
by yknot ini need a break from the jw-xmas noo-lite stuff ....... .
today my crush was on tv and a quick blush came to my face as i remembered all the silliness i did to run into him when he was attending jr. college near my grandparents....sigh.... so who was yours?
did your parents highly discourage/disapprove such?.
-
-
DATA-DOG
#1
Princess Ardala
#2
This galactic cutie!!
#3
Geeze i hope that is a girl robot.
#4
This was just last week by the way
