Rivergang

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Posts by Rivergang

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  5

  In Defense of the Crusades

  by aqwsed12345 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  christians in the eleventh century were not paranoid fanatics.

  muslims really were gunning for them.

  by the time the crusades started, muslims had already captured two-thirds of the christian world.

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  Rivergang

  If Constantinople had fallen in 1100, the Turkish army would have descended upon Europe four hundred years earlier, and the flourishing late medieval culture that was beginning to emerge at that time might never have developed:

  The problem was, though, that the Fourth Crusade (1204) sacked Constantinople. In doing so, they fatally weakened the Byzantine Empire - which was Europe's key defence against Muslim expansion.

  That the Crusades ever kicked off at all was because of an appeal for help by the Byzantine Emperor, Alexios I Komnenos. In 1095, he asked for assistance from Western Europe to resist incursions into his territory by the Seljuk Turks. What the emperor envisaged was an addition of another force of mercenary soldiers to reinforce his army - an army which already contained a large number of mercenaries. (Those mercenaries included Muslim troops - the matter was a lot more involved than just "Good guys wearing white hats, bad guys wearing black hats").

  However, what the emperor wanted and what he ended up getting were two quite different things! While the First Crusade did take a little of the heat off the Byzantine Empire, in the longer term the Crusades weakened it to the point where it no longer served as an effective bulwark against Turkish invasion.

  The real unsung heroes in defending Western Civilisation would have to be the Poles. Twice (in 1683 and again in 1920) they saved Western Europe from disaster.

  In 1683, Polish forces under Jan Sobieski lifted the Siege of Vienna and inflicted a decisive defeat on the Ottoman Turks, thus saving Western Europe from invasion. Then again in 1920, when the seemingly unstoppable Red Army was poised at the River Vistula and looking certain to burst into Western Europe, it was routed by the Polish forces under Jozef Pilsudski. Were those Soviet armies not defeated at the Vistula, there would have been very little to stop them from sweeping through to Germany and beyond. The "Iron Curtain" would have been in place a generation earlier than it was - and would have bordered right on the English Channel!

  (The Battle of the Vistula is well described in Dennis Wheatley's Red Eagles)
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  49

  40 Years Ago Today: May 15th 1984 "1914 Generation" issue was released. False prophecy, thy name is WatchTower.

  by WingCommander in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  it's incredible how this cover, and also this "series" of watchtower's is burned into my mind.

  i was almost 5 years old when these were released.

  “1914 and you” — may 1, 1984 watchtower.

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  Rivergang

  I don’t recall those 1984 articles causing a lot of excitement. Perhaps the group of JWs I was with had been through the fiasco of 1975, and had developed the attitude of “Oh, yeah - whatever!”
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  7

  Materialistic and Soon

  by OnTheWayOut in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i was reading a bart ehrman book, .

  armageddon: what the bible really says about the end.

  no, i won't bore you with complicated various theories i was reading.

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  Rivergang

  Perhaps it was regional thing?

  To be fair, I only ever recall “I’m having that house after Armageddon” being said in a tongue-in-cheek sort of way. Nobody that I knew seriously expected to be able just to walk into a nice house of their choice once the system had ended.

  Of course, little did they imagine that even spoken in jest, such remarks were perfect ammunition for propagandists!
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  23

  Armageddon Car

  by OnTheWayOut in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  how many of you bought a nice sedan, suv, or even a minivan back in the days that you described as your "armageddon car" that you would care for and it would last until the end arrived?.

  i was driving a 1974 plymouth volare wagon in 1992 when i managed to get an 8-year old buick century.

  it was low mileage and had a very luxurious interior.

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  Rivergang

  Gorb,

  What do they say:

  ”Cows may come, and cows may go, but the bull in this place goes on forever.”

  It is certainly the case when “This place” is JW land!
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  23

  Armageddon Car

  by OnTheWayOut in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  how many of you bought a nice sedan, suv, or even a minivan back in the days that you described as your "armageddon car" that you would care for and it would last until the end arrived?.

  i was driving a 1974 plymouth volare wagon in 1992 when i managed to get an 8-year old buick century.

  it was low mileage and had a very luxurious interior.

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  Rivergang

  Blondie,

  No, you wouldn’t have wanted to share that with others. In their wisdom, sometime in 1968 the WTS declared that “Now was not the time to be hiding behind Matthew 24:44” (The article was entitled “Why are you looking forward to 1975?”).
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  23

  Armageddon Car

  by OnTheWayOut in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  how many of you bought a nice sedan, suv, or even a minivan back in the days that you described as your "armageddon car" that you would care for and it would last until the end arrived?.

  i was driving a 1974 plymouth volare wagon in 1992 when i managed to get an 8-year old buick century.

  it was low mileage and had a very luxurious interior.

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  Rivergang

  I don’t know about an “Armageddon car”, but I well remember an Armageddon set of tyres. Early in 1975, one of the congregation’s elders was certain that the set of rubber on his Fiat 125 sedan was going to see out the system.
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  48

  What's the Worst Advice You Heard of an Elder Giving Someone?

  by Sea Breeze in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i believe an an elder told someone who's daughter (14 yo) became sexually active with a 26 year old in the neighborhood, that maybe they should get married.

  so, they did... with parental consent.

  he turned out to be a ex-convict who shot his first wife in the face with a shotgun.

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  Rivergang

  LHG

  Thanks!
• 
  48

  What's the Worst Advice You Heard of an Elder Giving Someone?

  by Sea Breeze in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i believe an an elder told someone who's daughter (14 yo) became sexually active with a 26 year old in the neighborhood, that maybe they should get married.

  so, they did... with parental consent.

  he turned out to be a ex-convict who shot his first wife in the face with a shotgun.

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  Rivergang

  Beth Sarim,

  I notice that those who have remained with the religion are a bit like “Christendom’s” church members:

  - they may give lip service to everything their religious leaders say, while quietly ignoring the more extreme demands of their religion.

  (In gambling terms, I believe it is called “Taking a bet both ways”)
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  48

  What's the Worst Advice You Heard of an Elder Giving Someone?

  by Sea Breeze in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i believe an an elder told someone who's daughter (14 yo) became sexually active with a 26 year old in the neighborhood, that maybe they should get married.

  so, they did... with parental consent.

  he turned out to be a ex-convict who shot his first wife in the face with a shotgun.

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  Rivergang

  Another thing about that bloody lot is the way they seem to think that they can - as it were - " Both hunt with the hounds and run with the hare - all at the same time".

  Just one example of this was during the big push for pious-sneering pioneering during 1980s.

  I can well recall in 1982, when our Circuit Overseer posed the question "Do you really think this system will still be going in ten years' time?" However, in his next sentence, he attempted to somewhat cover his backside, with the escape clause "Please don't go around saying 'The Circuit Overseer said the end will happen within the next ten years' ". (Sorry, Sandy Pannel, wherever you are now!)

  Aside from that, other bad advice which was commonly dished out during those years of the late 1960s / early 1970s was to do with the acquisition of property. Young couples were warned off from buying their own home, being told that they were "better off renting". Later, when things did not develop the way the WTS predicted, many now found that owning their own home was out of reach - when earlier, they might have been able to purchase one. (This is exactly what one can expect when religion pokes its ℲUCꓘIИǤ nose into people's personal affairs).

  Otherwise, how I envy those of you that didn't totally swallow the Kool Aid and are now retired! Now in my late sixties, I am still working full time (though luckily, my job - classified broadly as a "Busted @ss Electrician" - is not that physically demanding that I cannot manage). With a bit of luck, though, I ought to be able to give it way before my 70th birthday (which falls early next year).
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  48

  What's the Worst Advice You Heard of an Elder Giving Someone?

  by Sea Breeze in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i believe an an elder told someone who's daughter (14 yo) became sexually active with a 26 year old in the neighborhood, that maybe they should get married.

  so, they did... with parental consent.

  he turned out to be a ex-convict who shot his first wife in the face with a shotgun.

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  Rivergang

  Firstly, the usual - i.e. an elder who had sufficient sway over my father was able to prevent me from going to university.

  Not being content with that, though, some 12 months later this same prize act then told me to throw in my apprenticeship. (After being stopped from attending university, I had got a job as a trainee telecommunications technician).

  Damned fool that I was, I actually listed to this F#ck-wit!