Posts by Ireneus

91

Proof of God

by MrDantastic in

i'm an atheist as i do not see any evidence for the existance of a god.

i encourage critical thinking in everyone and am ready to debate anyone on whether or not there is a god and what that god might be like.

hmu..

“The most beautiful system of the sun, planets, and comets, could only proceed from the counsel and dominion of an intelligent and powerful being.” (Principia Mathematica, Sir Isac Newton). Like Newton there are many scientists who see evidence for the existence of a Supreme Organizer. Whether such ones are a minority or materialists are a majority matters not.

Problem is that people often look for high-profile reasoning for the existence of God. I have found proof for the existence of a Supreme Organizer in simple things. It is observed that there are some plants that wilt and die if enough care is not given. Dry soils cause plants to wilt. Why even wet soils can also cause plants to wilt. Plants grown in containers that do not have holes in the bottom for drainage, can be overwatered. As a results, roots rot and drown without sufficient oxygen in the soil. Outdoors, heavy rains can drown the roots.… How did such tender ones survive till today? This shows designer is also a Master Care-Giver.

Using symbols of lilies and birds, Jesus describes God as one who looks after everything. He looks after every living creature, and feeds each one according to its time. Here what is being highlighted is that sustenance is real, something we all depend on, which means Sustainer is more real (in much the same as saying if robbery is real, robbers are more real). If each one were taking according to his need (rather than greed), sustenance would have been felt more pronounced and The Sustainer would have received more acceptance!

13

In Search of An Analogy

by InjusticeSystem in

i hope this finds all of you well.

i'm also hoping some of you might be able to help me with a particular type of de-witnessing strategy that i'm trying to develop more in my own discussions with active family members.

it seems to me that analogy and metaphor plays a prominent role in the society's teaching (critical thought killing) techniques.

Ireneus

Here is one for you:

Would you still go to a tailor who made many times for you suits which had some problem, hence had to be discarded? See the changes JWs have made to their teachings. (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1UrjfNBy6jlZ8lSibVe7VSRgihTxkwqbrLUzIHLGFH-E/edit)

14

Do you still want to be identified as a Christian?

by eyeuse2badub in

most americans want some form of religious identity - even atheists are creating churches.

by j. warner wallace | fox news.

the number of self-proclaimed christians is shrinking in america.. i’ve been collecting data on this trend for over 10 years, and the surveys reveal an important truth: fewer people claim a christian affiliation than ever before, and those who claim no religious affiliation are the fastest growing group in america.. but while fewer people may belong to christian churches or communities, americans will likely retain some form of religious identity – especially if what’s happening in europe is an indicator of things to come.. a new pew forum survey conducted in western europe reveals that christianity is waning there even faster than it is in the united states.

Ireneus

My friend was saying priests, bishops, and even Cardinals in his homeland are filing case against each other in secular courts giving the impression that religious leaders are not able to sort out simple problems among themselves which raises the question: How can they be of any help to laymen?

5

Destruction to start from “God’s House”

by Ireneus in

here is the greatest irony: people proclaiming the destruction of others are the first ones to experience destruction, foretaste of which is already experienced in the form of shrinking glory, finance and confidence!.

babel means confusion, hence babylon the great means a great nation of confusing doctrines.

this nation is “intoxicated” and “drunk with the blood of god’s holy ones.” (revelation 17:2, 6) the greatest intoxication of christendom and its heartland jehovah’s witnesses is with their own claim of having monopoly on truth and thus treating rest of the mankind as pagan, a concept that kills everything god’s holy ones stood for (mathew 7:12).

Ireneus

Here is the greatest irony: People proclaiming the destruction of others are the first ones to experience destruction, foretaste of which is already experienced in the form of shrinking glory, finance and confidence!

Babel means confusion, hence Babylon the Great means a great nation of confusing doctrines. This nation is “intoxicated” and “drunk with the blood of God’s holy ones.” (Revelation 17:2, 6) The greatest intoxication of Christendom and its heartland Jehovah’s Witnesses is with their own claim of having monopoly on truth and thus treating rest of the mankind as pagan, a concept that kills everything God’s holy ones stood for (Mathew 7:12). Loving one’s own people only is described as the ways of “sinners” (Luke 6:32-36) and claiming God as belonging to a fraction of humanity is even a greater sin, as rightly stated by Sir Isac Newton in his Principia Mathematica: “The supreme God is a Being eternal, absolutely perfect” whom no one can call “my God, your God, the God of Israel.”

Dividing God’s children into two group (chosen ones and pagans) is “injustice” towards fellow humans and also rejection of God as the Father of all humans (Genesis 1:27). Such injustice and rejection of primary truth is also the very essence of being anti-Christ because according to Christ, “the poor in spirit, those who mourn, the meek, those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, the merciful, the pure in heart, the peacemakers, those who are persecuted because of righteousness …” and all those who act humanely towards one another are the ones who are going to be “blessed by God the Father.” (Mathew 5:3-12; 25:31-46) Such “blessed” ones are found in all religions. Thus those who exalt themselves over others set themselves against truth, God and His Christ which invites adverse judgment from God: “All those who exalt themselves will be humbled.” (Luke 14:11)

Bible and historical books report ‘those who exalted themselves as God’s own people calling others as pagan’ were ‘brought to their ruin and left them naked’ twice on the world scene (in 586 BC and 70 CE) by great empires of that time whom Bible describes as “God’s servants” into whose ‘hearts God had put those thoughts of desolation burning them with fire.’ (Romans 13:6; Revelation 17:16, 17). Just like First World War was the shadow of the Second World War, and both would be shadow of the Third World War, those are the shadow of the greater destruction that is to come on greater nation (Christendom, epicenter of which is Jehovah’s Witnesses) that makes the same claim as ancient Israel did. When Ezekiel asked Sovereign God: “Are you going to destroy the entire remnant of Israel in this outpouring of your wrath on Jerusalem?” God answered him: “The sin of the people of Israel and Judah is exceedingly great … full of injustice … I will bring down on their own heads what they have done.” (Ezekiel 9:8-10) God hates a proud heart (personification of which is Satan). Elevating oneself above others is spiritual cancer that eats up the very possibility of love. (Proverbs 16:18)

19

Diminishing glory of JWs, confusions are at the root

by Ireneus in

when the world shuns jws because of difference of opinion, it is described as the action of satan.. when jws shun others because of difference of opinion, it is described as theocratic action.. such confused mind is at the root of getting wrong teachings.

jws shun anything what anyone would rate as the best of the bible or christian traditions:.

1)cross (with a longer descending arm) is the symbol of controlling the less powerful (“acts of the flesh”) with the more powerful (“spirit” within)—galatians 5:17, 19, 25.

Ireneus

Hi Drearyweather,

What you say I have already read in some commentary.

You have the satisfaction of having explained something, and I have the satisfaction that John 3:13 was never uttered by Jesus.

If what you say is what Jesus really meant, Jesus could have worded it exactly the same as you say. Yet we have very candid theologians like William Barclay who in his commentary admitted that Jesus never uttered this, it is the wording of the writer. It is such brave and faithful theologians we want.

19

Diminishing glory of JWs, confusions are at the root

by Ireneus in

when the world shuns jws because of difference of opinion, it is described as the action of satan.. when jws shun others because of difference of opinion, it is described as theocratic action.. such confused mind is at the root of getting wrong teachings.

jws shun anything what anyone would rate as the best of the bible or christian traditions:.

1)cross (with a longer descending arm) is the symbol of controlling the less powerful (“acts of the flesh”) with the more powerful (“spirit” within)—galatians 5:17, 19, 25.

Ireneus

Hi Drearyweather,

Here is something for you to ponder over.

Two verses contradicting each other can occur, and it is natural when two writers are involved. Yet Bible writer named John was so careless that he could produce a verse that is inherently contradicting itself: “No one has ascended into heaven except he who descended from heaven, the Son of Man.” (John 3:13) It means only Jesus who descended from heaven has gone into heaven, no one else has gone into heaven! Jesus ascended into heaven at the end of his ministry, after his death. Hence how could he say he has ascended into heaven at the start of his ministry? This is because writers just thought what Jesus could have spoken or done if he were treading on earth and wrote them down. Yet its contradiction goes even beyond itself. There were others who went to heaven without dying, such as Enoch (Genesis 5:24). Regarding Enoch, you can say like JWs. However, if that's what it means, why can't the writer write it exactly what it meant instead of "Enoch was no more because God took him away." (Genesis 5:24)

19

Diminishing glory of JWs, confusions are at the root

by Ireneus in

when the world shuns jws because of difference of opinion, it is described as the action of satan.. when jws shun others because of difference of opinion, it is described as theocratic action.. such confused mind is at the root of getting wrong teachings.

jws shun anything what anyone would rate as the best of the bible or christian traditions:.

1)cross (with a longer descending arm) is the symbol of controlling the less powerful (“acts of the flesh”) with the more powerful (“spirit” within)—galatians 5:17, 19, 25.

Ireneus

Drearyweather, Jesus himself says in Mathew 7:21-23 that he would not make such statements.

22

Teachings/beliefs that fade into oblivion without explanation.

by smiddy3 in

"millions now living will never die" that teaching persisted for a number of years from the early 1920`s ,sad to say that their would not be anywhere near millions alive today.and with another few years their won`t be anybody alive .. the year 1925 was supposed to see the resurrection of faithful men of old such as abraham issac and jacob and noah who were to be princes in the earth.

of course no such thing happened and we don`t here anything more about that prediction anymore.. the time period between adams creation and eves creation was an excuse why armageddon was delayed in about october 1975 because they didn`t know how much time had elapsed between the two.

that`s all forgotten about now.. six thousand years of human history was supposed to have ended in about october 1872 according to studies in the scriptures vol.2 1906 , the "time is at hand" page 11 (forward 1916 ) puts the start of the one thousand year reign of jesus christ as of the year 1873. so in 1906 they the i.b.s.a.

Ireneus

Yes, that makes sense. When a worldwide and influential organization makes a change in the teaching, they must explain why they are replacing the old teaching.

19

Diminishing glory of JWs, confusions are at the root

by Ireneus in

when the world shuns jws because of difference of opinion, it is described as the action of satan.. when jws shun others because of difference of opinion, it is described as theocratic action.. such confused mind is at the root of getting wrong teachings.

jws shun anything what anyone would rate as the best of the bible or christian traditions:.

1)cross (with a longer descending arm) is the symbol of controlling the less powerful (“acts of the flesh”) with the more powerful (“spirit” within)—galatians 5:17, 19, 25.

Ireneus

Hi Drearyweather,

Church required a verse that says it is appointed by God, hence they added such portion in Mathew 16:18. Context of this verse is Jesus’ famous question “Who do you say I am?” However, if you compare this portion with its parallel account in Mark 8:27-38, you will find that Jesus never made such church-friendly sentence. Jesus had unequivocally declared that he won’t appoint any church or organisation to work on his behalf after leaves the stage till the end of the world (Mathew 7:21-23), and judgement is based on whether a person acted humanely or not, not according to one’s religious affiliation or worship (Mathew 25:31-46)

Such additions being made to what Jesus originally said was common in early days. Hence Luke deleted whatever added in his life-time. (Luke 1:1-3) For example, teaching about ransom sacrifice of Jesus was a Church doctrine which they added to Mathew 20:24-28 which is not found in the parallel account of Luke 22:25-30

46

What is the most troubling or disturbing biblical passage you ever had to rationalise when a Jw?

by stuckinarut2 in

now that we have stepped away from the jw faith, how do you feel about the bible itself?.

what about those awkward sections of scripture?

how did you rationalise or justify those sections?.

Ireneus

My first jolt occurred when I imagined myself, for a moment, as Isaac being tied up by Abraham at the command of God, and counting the seconds for the dagger to pierce my neck. Imagine the trauma that Isaac was subjected for no reason. God first preventing the conception till Sarah becomes old, and giving a child in the old age, and asking the child to be sacrificed ...all of which make no sense.

Only when I read Jeremiah 7:31 I understood that God would never ask such a thing from anyone, and it is story made by 'liars' (Jeremiah 8:8)