Posts by HappyHappyHappy1914

13

Just realized this recently - as a JW, I never "owned" any of my accomplishments or talents & abilities....

by Muddy Waters in

just realized this recently - as a jw, i never "owned" any of my accomplishments or talents & abilities....we were always told how we are nothing, just specks of dust, grasshoppers, worms.... lowly, despicable sinners in need of redemption, born into sin & misery, constantly facing temptations that we could never handle on our own but only with "jehovah's help"... so we were continually marginalized, all our abilities and talents... they would even quote scriptures that said things like "why should we boast as if we didn't receive these abilities..?

"it was a weird mentally psychotic dichotomy -- being told we were worthless sinners, undeserving of god's kindness -- and on the other hand being the only ones who would survive the great day of jehovah the almighty god at armageddon.

(well, probably, maybe, if we did enough and *kept* doing enough...)so we didn't "own" any of our abilities and accomplishments.

HappyHappyHappy1914

I really appreciate what has been said in this post so far. One of greatest instruments of control the organization has is to make sure all the young ones only feel good about themselves for accomplishments inside the organization. You could cure cancer at 16 and the congregation would eye you suspiciously for not pioneering. They want your self worth to be determined by how many hours you put in each month or what "privileges" you have. Academic accomplishments are treated like nothing.

And this has a hugely traumatic affect on a person growing up, particularly teenagers who are have a natural tendency to please people. Once your self-esteem is tied to the organization, they have you were they want you. They can use guilt to make you do more and reward you for accomplishing everything by love-bombing and other carrots.

It is an absolutely cruel and horrible thing to do to a child to not celebrate their accomplishments. To punish them for pursuing anything other than a narrowly defined path. To relegate them to second-class citizen for not parroting WT thinking or fitting into some bizarre circuit assembly demo mold.

I think it is incredibly important to have discussions like these because sometimes we forget how controlling the environment and how manipulative the organization can be.

17

Ex elders vs. Current elders

by dothemath in

in our congregation there are now more ex-elders than current ones.

(probably very common).

what i notice most of all, is that the ones who were the best speakers (we actually had some good ones) are the ones who have all stepped down.. i'm of the opinion the better teachers recognize its all a joke, and can't be bothered to reach out again.. so the ones left who are taking the lead are the most boring ones available.

HappyHappyHappy1914

My hall has over a dozen former elders, although I doubt many of them would be considered "awake"

The trend seems to be that these brothers either get burned out or feel guilty about not handling a specific situation properly and have stepped down.

I made a similar thread on reddit a few days ago that linked good speakers with those "woken up"

It seems to me that a number of you on this board were circuit and district speakers or, at the very least, viewed by the congregation as a good speaker. I think this is because good speakers are ones that aren't content parroting exact phrases and thoughts from the WT. You guys know exactly those kinds of talks. Those brothers seek to "get through" their talks and often try to mimic a particular CO or DO, but often without the charisma or gravitas that those brothers typically bring.

91

Is the Watchtower organisation facing the biggest crisis of its history?

by slimboyfat in

recent developments make me think they might be.

the problems they are facing are not just lack of funds but also draining authority, and the two could be a heady and explosive mix.

one of the best analyses ever written of the watchtower was a book called "trumpet of prophecy" by sociologist james beckford in the 1970s.

HappyHappyHappy1914

I can't speak to the wider issue, but this is exactly why I woke up one year ago. Growing up, I took pride in the fact that most of us couldn't even name the governing body members. These humble men were not interested in promoting themselves. No matter how crazy someone was in the hall or how strange a talk might be, I found immeasurable comfort in the watchtowers and how reasonable they appeared at the time. I love research and I was totally impressed by the mountain of literature, the rows of neat bound volumes, and the "scholarly nature" of both the insight and reasoning books.

But the changes have been a shock to my system. Any attempt on appearing deep or well researched has been abandoned. Those in congregation I was most embarrassed by now seem to be the ones that are most catered to. All the publications are now either geared towards children or people with little to no reading ability.

The broadcasts may just be the most damaging thing. Many of the more reasonable have chosen to not watch them at all for fear that their faith may be weakened. Some sit with eyes glazed and mouths slightly ajar as they gobble up everything said like it was from God himself.

times they are a changing

14

Chapter 1 My Bethel Experience First Posted 9 Years Ago A Walk Down Memory Lane

by new boy in

part 1. i when to bethel march 21,1970. at the time you had to be a pioneer for two years to apply, by the time i left in 1974 they were calling people in who had never pioneered..........average stay was 5 months (they had signed up for 4 years)..........the reason they left was......well, it was hell.. one of the reasons was, knorr hated bethelites, but he loved the gilead students and why?

because when they screwed up they were thousands of miles away!........just before i got there, they had kicked out over 30!

homosexuals (at one time) ....the would kick out 1-2 bethelites a week.

HappyHappyHappy1914

I've heard alot of stories about bethel in the mid 70s. Really sounds like it was a bit of the wild west. And they have all commented on how if, for any reason, they fell into disfavor, they were sent to do laundry as punishment.

11

Ever wondered which country in the JW Annual Report is most likely to reflect overall decline/progress of the WTS?

by besty in

a bit of spreadsheet fun - trying to ascertain which country is the bellwether for the wts.. my methodology was as follows:.

take the individual ar's from 2010 - 2016 and calculate an accurate (.00) ave pub increase/decrease for each country.

sort the countries into descending order by this value with the grand total row included in the mix.. assign the countries 5 places above and 5 places below the grand total 1 point.

HappyHappyHappy1914

The big change this next year will be in countries that relied heavily on a dense special pioneer population. The growth rate in some of those smaller countries in south and central america will be dramatically different in 2016. Most of those special pioneers cannot find work in their assignment and will be forced to move towards larger cities or leave those countries entirely.

30

What are the economics of cart witnessing?

by slimboyfat in

on another thread shepherdless sketched out the past business model of jws and its demise.

until 1990 they were a straightforward publishing business with the tremendous advantage of free labour in production and free distribution agents.

since then they've been relying on donations for literature to keep the old model going.

HappyHappyHappy1914

I tend to think most on this board tend to overstate how much cart witnessing is done. It is easy to feel that the organization is going almost entirely to carts because they are much more visible. In my area, the carts are only manned by pioneers. And not even all pioneers. You have to be specially recommended. So cart witnessing is more of a status symbol and another class distinction.

I would argue that the main purpose is to keep people pioneering and motivate other to pioneer in a way that appears effective. I know many in my area who have stopped because they can recognize how unproductive house to house is. With cart witnessing, even if no one stops, you can argue that you made a witness simply by being seen.

43

Beards galore at the Assembly

by Truthexplorer in

ok, at our recent assembly, i noticed that there were quite a lot of brothers wearing beards.

not just the older dudes, but right across a range of ages, young men, middle aged men and older men.

is watchtower beginning to relax this rule at last?

HappyHappyHappy1914

I too am interesting on where this was. I have yet to see any beards at my assemblies or conventions in the midwest USA. Ive heard that some locations, specifically Northern Europe, are a little more tolerant.

32

Peer presure to use Ipad

by Gorbatchov in

jw
friends

earlier this season i advised my retired father to ignore the use of a tablet during his kingdom hall congregational visits.

his response was hopefull, but between the lines i could hear he had no choice.. yesterday he showed me his new 600 euro 64 gb ipad air 2. he had no clue what he has to do with it, he told me one of the elders will install the jw.org apps.. so, i feel he had to deal with presure to buy this ipad and i think he is not the only one.. do you recognize this?.

gorby.

HappyHappyHappy1914

There is definitely strong pressure. At the sample meeting video, nearly everyone has an Ipad. And like good little sheep, many will look at that and start desiring them. In my hall,though, most of the older ones have dug in deep and refuse to get any kind of tablet. Part of me feels really sad for them. I think they get the sense that the "chariot" is passing them by as it pursues younger and more useful victims.

32

What more do they need to see?

by stuckinarut2 in

so bethelites are being decreased...bethel homes even sold off.... special pioneers no longer being funded.. magazines getting smaller and published less frequently.. building work stopping or being reduced.. no large conventions and renting of venues.. etc.... so, money is not coming in anymore to cover the "expenses"??.

didnt the first ever watchtower said that when this occurs, it would be evidence of god no longer blessing the activity....

oh, and throughout the years, we have constantly been told that the "growth of the org and the projects such as buildings and contributions" etc were evidence of gods blessing.... .

HappyHappyHappy1914

I feel like the whole belief structure is built around minimizing your own opinion and to not trust it. When something is off or strange, everyone does a collective "I don't understand, but Jehovahs is taking care of it" approach that after awhile it becomes normal. And despite all the videos, so much is done in secret. I wouldn't be surprised if most peoples reactions to the SPs being removed is...."I'm sure there planning something big they aren't telling us yet. I'm so excited!!!"

50

Coordinator of Elders Problems in One Southern England Circuit!

by The Searcher in

information just passed to me.

let's hope this becomes even more widespread.

i wonder if the britain branch suspects a conspiracy?

HappyHappyHappy1914

We just had our co visit and he made it clear to "remind the brothers of their dedication" i.e. Guilt the, into serving out. Over the next few years, when this problem gets worse and worse expect more pressure to be put on those not serving. Anthony Morris' comments about being 23 and a MS makes it clear how the gb feels about those serving.