Rainbow_Troll

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Posts by Rainbow_Troll

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  27

  Here's a morbid thought...

  by Rainbow_Troll in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  it probably will never happen but... imagine the gb recieved some new light that told them the great tribulation was imminent.

  the world is going to hell and all jws can expect until armageddon is terrible persecution the likes of which no christian has ever experienced in two thousand years.

  but jehovah has a solution: put yourself and your family 'to sleep' and after armageddon's over, jehovah will 'wake his people up' at the resurrection.

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  Rainbow_Troll

  It was a hypothetical 'what if?' question. To my best knowledge the governing body has never advocated suicide in any circumstance, not even in the case terminal illness.

  As for the GB admitting that they are fallible? That would be nice, but you'll have to show me a publication if you want me to believe that. If the GB thinks they are fallible, then why do they require JWs to conform to every little fiat they issue from their headquarters? I mean, they might be wrong ,so who are they impose their speculations on others? If they are fallible then why does any JW who disagrees with them, even on minor doctrinal points, get put before the holy inquisition (otherwise known as a judicial committee) who asks him to recant his heretical views or else face disfellowshipment? The statement "We are fallible." just doesn't follow from their behavior.
• 
  27

  Here's a morbid thought...

  by Rainbow_Troll in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  it probably will never happen but... imagine the gb recieved some new light that told them the great tribulation was imminent.

  the world is going to hell and all jws can expect until armageddon is terrible persecution the likes of which no christian has ever experienced in two thousand years.

  but jehovah has a solution: put yourself and your family 'to sleep' and after armageddon's over, jehovah will 'wake his people up' at the resurrection.

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  Rainbow_Troll

  It probably will never happen but... Imagine the GB recieved some new light that told them the great tribulation was imminent. The world is going to hell and all JWs can expect until armageddon is terrible persecution the likes of which no Christian has ever experienced in two thousand years. But Jehovah has a solution: put yourself and your family 'to sleep' and after armageddon's over, Jehovah will 'wake his people up' at the resurrection. How many JWs would be willing to go through with it. None? A few? Most? All?

  Considering how many JWs have allowed their own children and spouses to die when they needed a blood tranfusion, I'm betting most would happily chug the kool-aid and die with a big, bovine grin on their faces.

  Frankly, this is one of my nightmares. I know it seems improbable now, but keep in mind that even Heaven's Gate explicitely taught that suicide was wrong.. until Applewhite got his new orders from the saucermen. It wouldn't be hard to pull off either. The Org has a very efficient private grapevine that allows them to swiftly and discretely communicate with any congregation in the world. No need to publish anything in the official publications. It could be done in a matter of hours.
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  17

  Jehovah is unjust (outrageous article on slavery in last WT for public)

  by Master_Bob in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  according to the last paragraph of the article entitled "escape from slavery—then and now" (wt#2, 2017).

  jehovah god felt grieved by the harsh treatment of israelite slaves in egypt; he must feel the same way about similar injustice today.. .

  if you call modern slavery "injustice", wasn't the slavery during moses time also "injustice"?

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  Rainbow_Troll

  The link is broken so I can't read the article. In any case, I'm surprised to hear the WT flatly condemning slavery. Biblical references to slavery, old and new testament, are unilaterally positive. Not even Jesus seems to have condemned the practice (at least not directly).

  I wonder if this is just due to ignorance (unlikely) or the beginning of a less fundamentalist position. At this point it's only tacit, but if the GB could just concede that the Bible contains errors - both ethical and historical - it could begin a liberalizing trend for Jehovah's Witnesses. Who knows, 50 years hence there might be openly gay elders and teenaged couples holding hands in the Kingdom Hall.

  Wouldn't it be grand?
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  120

  The right to shun - wrong?

  by Simon in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  many people are understandably upset and angry at the notion that jws have the right to shun people.

  it seems such an obvious "no brainer" cruel and inhuman thing to do - it must be wrong ... surely?.

  of course we look at things from the perspective of those hurt and harmed by shunning.

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  Rainbow_Troll

  Some JWs do use shunning as pretext for cruelty, but there are plenty of exceptions.

  When I was being shunned by my best friend there was an instance when we accidentally met face to face (not in the KH) in a narrow hallway. Since the only way we could get away from each other was by turning around and going in the opposite direction, it was a very heavy, awkward moment for both of us.

  She stared at me. I stared at her... I saw that her eyes were beginning to tear up. I was going to say something when she suddenly turned her back on me and briskly walked away; probably so I wouldn't see her cry.

  She definitely did not want to shun me, but she had to. She wasn't an independent adult who could go anywhere she wanted. She was a 15 year old girl whose dad was an elder. When her half-sister was DFed, both of her parents resolutely shunned her, so my friend could have no doubt over what would happen to her if she did not shun me.

  I want to remind you that this person was my BEST friend. I had known her since she was seven and I was eight. We were like siblings. I can't just shrug my shoulders and dismiss her as a fair-weather-friend who was forced to show her true colors because of the GB's shunning policy.

  And my story isn't unique. So many ex-jws have had same experience. Shunning destroys friendships and families every day. Good people get hurt on both sides. It needs to stop.
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  16

  Wow what do you think true story

  by poopie in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  this is an actual case.

  a jw was recently disfellowshipped heres the reason.

  he was and elder and regular pioneer at the time baprized 40 years he decides to rent a room from a women who rents rooms out to singles ,he moves in and there's another guy there also renting a room he happens to be disfellowshipped .

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  Rainbow_Troll

  I'd say this guy must have done something to really piss off the other elders. But then, some people are just cruel by nature...
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  11

  How long until some of the Biblical apocrypha will be inserted into the WT teachings?

  by nonjwspouse in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have read through some of these, though not in complete, but enough to see some of these writings could fit into the wt views, such as arian beliefs of jesus.

  it would also help separate themselves quite a bit from "christiandom" and their bible.

  the "new light" of books not accepted in the canon.

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  Rainbow_Troll

  It will never happen and here's why: If the governing body added apocryphal books to the JW Bible, they would have to concede that the Bible as we know it didn't arrive gift wrapped from heaven. They'd have to explain that the Bible they have been deriving their teaching from all these years was voted into being by the Roman Catholic Church - yes - the whore of Babylon herself! A revelation like that would totally undermine the entire Watchtower theology.
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  120

  The right to shun - wrong?

  by Simon in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  many people are understandably upset and angry at the notion that jws have the right to shun people.

  it seems such an obvious "no brainer" cruel and inhuman thing to do - it must be wrong ... surely?.

  of course we look at things from the perspective of those hurt and harmed by shunning.

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  Rainbow_Troll

  If JWs were free to shun or not shun, I would agree. But the fact is that JWs who don't shun their DFed friends and family risk being disfellowshipped themselves. That's coercion, not a free choice, and if there were a way to prevent the governing body from exerting this coercion on the JWs I would be in favor of it.

  As to how it could be enforced, I have to admit that it probably isn't possible.
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  50

  Why Finding the One True Religion is Impossible

  by Simon in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  jws like to think they have found the one true religion.

  but like so many other religious people, it's usually the religion they were born into, the only religion they know because it's the first one they found or, at the most, one of two or three (typically the second one after they left their first / born-in faith).. the trouble is, there simply isn't enough time to explore and investigate each and everyone of the many thousands of belief systems, religions and sects around the world.. think of it this way: which is the best neighbourhood to live in where you would be most happy and most successful?

  not just in the city or even the country you are in, but the entire world.. how would you ever know?

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  Rainbow_Troll

  It's a crapshoot. Any 'proof' a given sect might offer a prospective convert can be met by another one. Every religion worth its salt has scriptures, prophets, and miracles to boast of.

  "Oh, you've got a holy book?" Says the Catholic. "Well, I see your holy book and raise you an apparition of the virgin Mary!"

  "Apparitions?" the pentecostal cuts in. "I see your phony apparition and raise you spontaneous remission of my aunt's brain tumor and my pastor dancing with rattle snakes while chugging a gallon of strychnine!"

  And so it goes...

  In terms of 'evidence' they are all on equal footing.
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  35

  Question for those that have been Disfellowshiped for apostasy VS succesfully fading

  by NikL in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  there are quite a few here who have been disfellowshipped for apostasy.. then there are those that have successfully faded.. why the different outcome?

  are the ones that got df more out spoken?

  or does the discrepancy lie with the elders?.

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  Rainbow_Troll

  "The Governing Body is neither inspired nor infallible. Therefore, it can err in doctrinal matters or in organizational direction."
  

  "But if you disagree with us one tittle, you are evil and should be shunned!"
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  35

  Question for those that have been Disfellowshiped for apostasy VS succesfully fading

  by NikL in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  there are quite a few here who have been disfellowshipped for apostasy.. then there are those that have successfully faded.. why the different outcome?

  are the ones that got df more out spoken?

  or does the discrepancy lie with the elders?.

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  Rainbow_Troll

  Since I hadn't been baptized they couldn't officially DF me, but I was shunned nontheless.

  But the bottom line is that most elders are pragmatists. They don't care what you think because they know they can't really control your private thoughts. All they really care about is what you SAY and DO. You get DFed for smoking, not for thinking about smoking, just as you get DFed for spreading 'false doctrines' or openly questioning WT doctrine, but not for having your own private little doubts.

  If the WT really cared about what JWs thought, shunning would become very problematic. How would they know if an apostate truly repented or was simply pretending to agree in order to stop the shunning?

  When I was a JW I knew plenty of fellow sheep who, in private, disagreed with lots of things the org taught but they were prudent enough to keep those thoughts between them and a few trusted friends whom they knew wouldn't run to the elders with it. I can't know with any certainty, but if I had to guess I'd say that at least half of the JWs you know aren't as brainwashed as they would want you to believe, they're just afraid of being DFed.