Posts by Sirona

"hopefully this will mean that in britain if an elder harasses you before a case comes to court, the elder can be arrested for perverting the course of justice.".

Sirona

I'm not saying that if all the grown-ups the child trusts - as in friends or relatives - happen to be elders, they can't report (wait: little girl being molested trust other adult males and no-one else? likely...?)

Dacke, the comment in brackets is a bit silly. It could be a woman who is accused of abuse. Doh. Plus, the child may tell a congregation member, who then approaches the elders. How likely it is isn't relevant anyway. It happens.

But i don't think reporting single allegation to the police should be part of elder's job description. A child would approach someone because of a personal bond, not because "they're an elder". An elder in that situation should act in the capacity of that personal bond, not in the capacity of being an elder.

Oh, so I got it wrong when I thought they were supposed to be "loving shepherds". A place to run to...a rock. Now, all of a sudden elders are referred to as having a "job". They have such a position of influence and responsibility that they should either 1. be told that they always must go to the police or 2. be told that they should tell the congregation member that they must go to the police

I mean, if the Society decide to do that some day - change the elder policy in this regard - fine with me! I'm not an elder and never will I wish to become one. (But certain people on this board would probably consider me a mind-controlled freak because of it ;-) )
Blaming the policy for the elders is a waste of time and resources. I just don't think that's where the problem lies.

I'm glad you're open to a change of policy. So, where does the problem lie?

Sirona

23

Will they disassociate me?

by Sirona in

my boyfriend was disgusted with the jws after the panorama programme, and has decided to da himself.

none of his family are jw and he just simply does not want to be listed as a jw anymore.. since we are known by the congregation to be together, will they da or df me for seeing him?.

bear in mind, neither of us have set foot in the kh for a couple of years.

Sirona

Salud, I think that you have a point about "something clicks in the JW mindset". I don't want to have problems with my family. Thanks for your comments

Gopher, you made an interesting point about the engagement. OK I know it sounds wierd, but I used to be married to my boyfriend. We were married in a KH and everything. On leaving JWs we divorced but we are now back together. Would the elders consider that in the eyes of God our marriage tie was never broken? In that case, I'd be already in a sort of marriage with him although we have not decided to remarry.

?? what do you think?

Sirona

30

They do too go beyond what is written...

by Marilyn in

jw
friends

tdogg started this on another thread.

his comments were:.

i wish i had that quote when i was told i had to wear a tie and suit to meeting, when i played chess, when i bought star wars figures, when i had to do at least 5 hrs of service a month, make a comment at every meeting, not wear top-sider shoes, never see a rated r movie, wear a no-blood bracelet, highlight all the answers in my watchtower, not play organised sports, not salute the flag,....anyone want to take over?......

Sirona

Ok here are some contradictions:

You can't practice Yoga, but you can use yoga stretches and call them Pilates and its OK

You can't support your country, salute the flag, vote, or work for the government, but you can take advantage of the governments benefits services and other services such as policing

You can't say cheers, celebrate any so-called christian holiday, or say "bless you" because of the pagan connections, but you can use a pagan calendar, have certain pagan decor in your home (in wallpaper designs for instance), and wear a wedding ring (which has roots in paganism).

You can't celebrate birthdays because its so-called pagan and it elevates one person, but you can celebrate anniversaries and have a nice party in honour of the couple.

You can't give your children gifts on Christmas Day, but its OK if you give them gifts a few days before or after Dec 25th

You can't pray to Jesus or worship Jesus, but you can walk around saying you are Christian

You can't watch Harry Potter because of the supernatural connection which is demonic, but you can watch a film in which aliens kill people because thats just science fiction

If you are a woman, you can't pray out loud in the presence of a baptised man (without wearing a head covering), but you can go around saying that Jehovahs Witnesses see women as equal to men

You can't wear a skirt that is above your knee, but if you're on holiday and noone knows you, you can wear whatever you want

You can't speak to, or associate with someone who has been disfellowshipped for adultery, but you can speak to and associate with the unbaptised person who is guilty of adultery

You can't have friends who are not JW, but you can pretend to be a friend to someone who is not JW if you think they could be recruited

You are discouraged from pursuing any "wordly career" or from going to college, but if you're a man, when you get married you must support your family

You should see problems as persecution from Satan unless the person with the problems is subsequently removed from the congregation....in that case the problem is Jehovah sorting out the wheat from the chaff

You can't go to nightclubs but you can get away with going to a pub that is open until 2am

You should look after the elderly and the orphans, unless they are not JW (in which case they're bad associates and should be generally avoided)

You can't do any sort of charity work for "worldy" organisations, but you can allow yourself to feel righteous for handing out magazines

You can critisise and deeply examine the catholic church and its past, but you can't look into the past of the Watchtower, and if you critisise it you may be disfellowshipped

You can say "worldies" have no love and will die at armageddon, and also say that you don't judge people

You can pick up on every story about catholic pedophiles, but on lots of evidence can deny it happens at your church and that the victims are liars

Sirona

23

Will they disassociate me?

by Sirona in

my boyfriend was disgusted with the jws after the panorama programme, and has decided to da himself.

none of his family are jw and he just simply does not want to be listed as a jw anymore.. since we are known by the congregation to be together, will they da or df me for seeing him?.

bear in mind, neither of us have set foot in the kh for a couple of years.

Sirona

Hi

My boyfriend was disgusted with the JWs after the panorama programme, and has decided to DA himself. None of his family are JW and he just simply does not want to be listed as a JW anymore.

Since we are known by the congregation to be together, will they DA or DF me for seeing him?

Bear in mind, neither of us have set foot in the KH for a couple of years. The problem is, some of my family are JW and at this current time I'm living with my JW mum. I'm soon to move out and get my own home, but clearly this will be a deciding factor for the elders, won't it?

I'm worried, but my BF may not go ahead with the DA if he thinks it will really affect me...

Sirona

36

JW protecting molesters on purpuse? Panorama!

by Dacke in

a lot of people here are laughing.

"englishman" wrote (i think):.

"hopefully this will mean that in britain if an elder harasses you before a case comes to court, the elder can be arrested for perverting the course of justice.".

Sirona

You think elders should report to the police? i think the victims and their parents should. the elders should only deal with congregational matters. And that is how the WT policy is outlined.

I think parents of the victims should go, or the victims themselves. What about a situation where it is a family member who is abusing and the victim can't possibly approach a parent? The victim goes to the elders, often terrified, hoping for help....are you trying to say the elders should just say "oh I'm sorry little 9 year old girl, but I only deal with congregational matters"

Sirona

36

JW protecting molesters on purpuse? Panorama!

by Dacke in

a lot of people here are laughing.

"englishman" wrote (i think):.

"hopefully this will mean that in britain if an elder harasses you before a case comes to court, the elder can be arrested for perverting the course of justice.".

Sirona

Hi Dacke,

Welcome to the forum. I liked reading your slant on things.

Theres no excuse if an elder, or anybody else, "advises" the parent of a (suspected) molested child not to go to the police.

I agree wholeheartedly with this. However I have a comment on your next words:

The letter from the Society read out at meetings recently stated very clearly that if you suspect or know that your child has been molested, you may choose to report the matter to the police, and nobody can tell you that you mustnt. If I was in that situation, I wouldn't hesitate for a MOMENT to go to the Police.

I have bolded the words that I have a problem with. You MAY choose. Well I say that this is where the societys policy fails in that it does not say "you must" or "you should" go to the police to protect children. In the US, some states do not require that abuse be reported by law, yet clearly from a moral standpoint abuse should ALWAYS be reported to police. The watchtower policy of choosing whether to go to the police or not allows an elder to simply choose not to report it and the abuse continues.

Strange isn't it that the only thing you must do if you hear of abuse is phone Watchtower legal dept?

It appears from the documentary that the JWs protect and hide child abusers on purpose

I didn't get that impression from the programme. It was saying that the WT policy on what to do about child abuse has failed many children. It was saying that abuse has happened and has not been reported. It was saying that the WT will not admit that it's policy has been wrong for a long, long time and that its policy has made things worse for the children abused.

Sirona

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