Skeptic

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Posts by Skeptic

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  38

  Do we have double standards about JWs?

  by Skeptic in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do we have a double standard as far as jws are concerned?

  yes, i know that their claims of being better than any other religion sets them up for higher expectations.

  and yes, generally jws are judgemental.

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  Skeptic

  logansun, excellent post.

  That being said, I admit I get very annoyed when people make ridiculous remarks about the JWs and try and use fallacious material to criticise them.

  That annoys me too. The JWs hang themselves. There is no need to make them look bad by exaggeration or lying.

  I also get annoyed when I hear someone say that JWs are all unfriendly or that they condone child abuse. That is a tremendous distortion of the facts that only does more harm than good.

  Again, I agree. All it does is give JWs reason to complete discredit all ex-JWs. All they have to do is point to a statement such as "they condeon child abuse" as an example to discredit all the claims of ex-JWs. Statements like "JW policies protect child molestors" or "the organization protects its interests over abused children" are more accurate and harder to dispute.

  dedalus, I noticed that your fireworks were all on the 4th. Perhaps the issue was that it was Independence Day? What if you lit them a week or a month later?

  Richard
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  15

  Double Standards

  by Beans in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  hello brothers and sisters!.

  i have safley returned from my adventures across the ocean and happened to stumble and meet the german district overbier, german jw!!!

  what a pleasure it was to see him enjoying a beer as i entered the room, i could not help but join him in the ritual.

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  Skeptic

  This is good news. The more JWs that do normal things like holidays, not shunning, etc. the less control the Borg has. Eventually, the Borg will get "New Light" because they will not be able to enforce some of the really stupid rules.

  Two other factors help. More JWs are born into the religion, which means less of a need to differentiate themselves from other faiths. Another factor is that the Dubs need to attract more middle to upper class members, more well-educated members. So there is some pressure to seem more normal to outsiders.

  Richard
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  38

  Do we have double standards about JWs?

  by Skeptic in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do we have a double standard as far as jws are concerned?

  yes, i know that their claims of being better than any other religion sets them up for higher expectations.

  and yes, generally jws are judgemental.

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  Skeptic

  I feel that JWs are unfairly held up to higher standards than they should be. Whilst most of us have been hurt by JWs in one way or another, I think that we sometimes forget that they are no less human than we are. Sure, they put themselves up on a pedestal, but many I know are good, caring people, who think that they are serving God. After all, we were all JWs once, didn't we try to do things as best we could. Were we all perfect, or did we make mistakes now and then? Does being an ex-JW make us somehow more superior to JWs? I don't believe we are. Regardless of our religion or culture, we are all humans trying to make the best of what we've got.

  Prisca, I agree.

  Richard
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  52

  WHAT IS YOUR PET PEVE?

  by kls in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  what is it that really irritates you ,i mean the most annoying ,thing that when you see it or hear it you just clench your teeth,we all have them so let's hear yours.mine is religious boasting.there is this home builder that advertises on tv and says his crap then says we are a christien company.oh yes , because he said that i would trust him more then anyone else,he must have higher standards.

  (ya right).or those people who advertise with bumper stickers of their religion,and yes the freaking door bell ringers trying to push their crap on me.isn't it what you feel inside?why advertise to everyone?does it make you feel more important or more religious?because of the attempt to show me that you have faith does not make me feel i could trust you.

  this is just one of my irritants and hope not do offend,everyone has the right.

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  Skeptic

  Another pet peeve of mine is when people do not treat Prisca properly. I think Prisca is a fine lady.

  I agree completely, larc.
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  9

  Bill Bowen and Silentlambs

  by Trauma_Hound in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i did bill a favor the other day, by converting a flyer, from doc to pdf format, which is more universal, and can't get virus attachments like docs.

  i get an e-mail back from him thanking me for it.

  then stating, that he is not mad at me, that if i wanted to work with silentlambs again, that i need to basically shutup, and not make any negative comments about them, and to stop posting private e-mails.

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  Skeptic

  Then stating, that he is not mad at me, that if I wanted to work with silentlambs again, that I need to basically shutup, and not make any negative comments about them, and to stop posting private e-mails.

  Yeah, it sounds extreme. But most places don't want negative things said about them. Because you have been in a public dispute with him, the requirements will be stricter.

  I want to help people, but he is acting like an elder, and it's really starting to piss me off. What should I do?

  SilentLambs is Bill's baby, and he gets to call the shots. If you feel comfortable with his conditions, help him out. If not, and I don't think you are comfortable, then don't.

  XenaWarrior once made a comment advising that we should keep toxic people out of our lives. This is good advice that I have personally followed and benefited from. I don't know Bill, so I cannot comment about him personally. If your relationship with Bill is toxic, don't expend any more emotional energy on him. It will relieve a lot of stress and give you energy for other activities.

  If you want to help victums of abuse, find another group you can enjoy helping, or start something on your own. Though I am sure you would prefer to help victums of WT abuse, you can get a lot of satisfaction and meaning from helping non-JW groups as well.

  Your relationship with Bill is not healthy, and will not be anytime soon. I would move on.

  Richard
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  71

  The "Left Behind" book series. Has anyone read the books?

  by Yizuman in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  has anyone read the "left behind" book series?

  http://www.leftbehind.com .

  yizuman.

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  Skeptic

  Yizuman, I have not read them myself, but have heard from religious and ex-religious friends that they are very good.

  Richard
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  38

  Do we have double standards about JWs?

  by Skeptic in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do we have a double standard as far as jws are concerned?

  yes, i know that their claims of being better than any other religion sets them up for higher expectations.

  and yes, generally jws are judgemental.

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  Skeptic

  If JW's didn't make such a big deal about how wonderful, and god-blessed they are (unlike everyone else of course), I don't think they'd get as much flack. I don't believe too many other religions try to promote such a flawless image.

  I agree that they would get much less flak if they didn't make such grandeous claims for themselves. And if they allowed members to leave without any consequences.

  If they do, then yes, I think they do deserve to have their flaws pointed out.

  I agree to an extent; but I believe that this has limits. Exactly what those limits are, I am not sure. Whatever is reasonable, I guess.
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  38

  Do we have double standards about JWs?

  by Skeptic in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do we have a double standard as far as jws are concerned?

  yes, i know that their claims of being better than any other religion sets them up for higher expectations.

  and yes, generally jws are judgemental.

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  Skeptic

  amac,

  I've been labeled as a JW Apologist for sticking up for them when I think they are unfairly criticized.

  Human nature is interesting, isn't it? When I was a moderator on H2O, people thought I was a rabid JW. And I primarily only gave warnings for posts that contained unprovoked rudeness. Richard
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  38

  Do we have double standards about JWs?

  by Skeptic in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do we have a double standard as far as jws are concerned?

  yes, i know that their claims of being better than any other religion sets them up for higher expectations.

  and yes, generally jws are judgemental.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Skeptic

  Do we have a double standard as far as JWs are concerned? Yes, I know that their claims of being better than any other religion sets them up for higher expectations. And yes, generally JWs are judgemental. But even those things have limits.

  Picking examples out of my head:

  Rudeness by Witnesses often gets commented on. But other people are rude too.

  Any misconduct by elders. Statistically, some elders are going to be bad eggs (unless a perfect God appointed them, of course). Do we have same standard for our church? (assuming we attend one).

  Misconduct by JWs. Do we have similar standards for our friends?

  This thread was inspired by a poster here. In two unrelated threads, this poster thought abusive behaviour was both OK and terrible. The "OK behaviour" was done on purpose by non-JWs/ex-JWs, and the "terrible behaviour" was by JWs, most likely out of complete thoughtlessness (the behaviour itself was still inexcuseable). I am sure the poster is not aware of the apparent double standard. I am not going to get more specific, as I am not looking for a flame war. If it bugged me enough, I could just email the poster; I almost did but thought What's the point? So I left it, and this morning wondered about double standards that we all have, including myself.

  Now, I know that the JWs set themselves up to an extent. But JWs are human too, and I wonder if sometimes we have a bias against JWs, and tend to think that bad behaviour of a few means they are all rotten.

  Do we hold JWs to a similar standard that we would hold anyone else to? Or are we needlessly harsh when it comes to JWs?

  Richard
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  22

  What have you read that helped you?

  by yesidid in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my journey out began with this and other ''eyeopening" internet sites [thank you simon].

  i have since read ray franz's two books and greg stafford's "dissertations".

  although i am very grateful to have found out that my years of questions had a solid base and i now see the wts for what it is, i have decided i need more positives in my life.

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  Skeptic

  Awaken the Giant Within by Anthony Robbins is excellent in many ways. It works.

  How to Make Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnegie has a tacky name, but is a classic book on how to get along with people. The examples used are outdated, but the principles and practical advice are timeless.

  SuperSelf by Charles Givens is very good if you want to achieve goals.

  Richard