Posts by TonusOH

7

Philosophical Question

by budbayview in

according to the bible, there was dissention in heaven or god’s kingdom.

in god’s own courtyard, the factors existed for such, that perfect creations morphed into gods’ opposition, even in the presence of the universal creator.

accordingly, they are still at it, hell bent on destroying all.. here is my question; how is it that the creation thinks they can win a war with the universal creator?

That always struck me, the notion that the beings closest to God would ever turn from him. I had the impression -as did many other Christians I knew- that God is the ultimate being, a person of vast intellect, wisdom, and love. The perfect father, the great teacher. To meet Him would be an unimaginable experience.

And yet... one angel is so unimpressed that he turns against God, to such a degree that he earns the title of "opposer" (or something to that effect). The two humans who were direct creations of God are easily turned away from Him as well, by a talking animal of all things. Other angels apparently chose their own boners over fealty to God. That is insane.

21

The Great Tribulation

by Fisherman in

will the great tribulation hurt individuals more than what job, jesus, roman punishment, naz&i germany, hiroshima, jail, capital punishment, disease, pain, terror, horror, soldier in the battlefield or some terrible pain people experience this very moment?

how worse can pain and suffering get.

it is very common.

TonusOH

He means "Y". As in, "not Z."

8

Help needed

by NewLight in

jw
friends

i’ve been visiting this site for quite a long time, although i rarely posted.

i would like to thank simon and all the participants, for the valuable information and support that is available here, for anyone searching about the jw organization.. just a brief introduction of myself: i live in europe (english is not my native language, so please bear with any mistakes i make).

i was born in a jw family and i’m still in the organization, but i’ve been “on the fence” about leaving the organization for quite a long time.

TonusOH

Hi NewLight,

I faded over a very long time, and it wasn't deliberate. I just found it harder and harder to make the effort to go to meetings or go on field service. But I believed in what they taught and figured it was my own failings, so when elders tried to encourage me, I was earnest in my desire to 'improve.' But it simply wasn't happening.

By the time I realized I wasn't a JW, I had faded pretty completely. I had even stopped going to the memorial for a few years at that point. I think they took it easy on me because I wasn't stirring up trouble and because my mom is still a diehard JW, and I think they did not want to do anything to upset her.

I can't really say what the best option is, because we're all different. If I had not wanted so badly to remain a JW, I doubt I would have faded so gradually. I would not have been able to make even the half-hearted effort I was making until the early 2000s, when I stopped trying but kept telling myself I'd get back in. I think that, once you realize it's not for you, you need to consider all of the factors before you decide on a course of action. Good luck.

21

The Great Tribulation

by Fisherman in

will the great tribulation hurt individuals more than what job, jesus, roman punishment, naz&i germany, hiroshima, jail, capital punishment, disease, pain, terror, horror, soldier in the battlefield or some terrible pain people experience this very moment?

how worse can pain and suffering get.

it is very common.

TonusOH

Perhaps a more interesting discussion would be to ask what each person thinks the great tribulation will be like. Russell saw it as a period of anarchy, with conditions getting worse until such time as Jesus stepped in to establish the kingdom of God and destroy man-made governments. But what would that be like? 2019-2021 USA? Present day Venezuela? Russia? North Korea? Ukraine? Some other example? Something even worse?

Either of the world wars would seem to have been an example of a great tribulation. People dying in large numbers, the economies of many nations being almost wiped out, humanity in such disarray that either disease or despots took advantage to introduce even more suffering. But we have kept on going. So the great tribulation would need to be even worse, since it would need to be cut short to save humanity from extinction. What else could happen that was worse than those times?

13

Article: The Crypto Ponzi Scheme Avenger - [A former JW]

by AndersonsInfo in

jw
friends

(this article is available by subscription only so i copied and pasted it below.).

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/11/11/business/crypto-ponzi-scheme-hyperfund.html.

here's part of the information about mr. de hek's past as a jw:.

TonusOH

FOMO = Fear of missing out

Crypto is the latest speculative bubble, IMO. They occur with a certain regularity, and it's always the same thing-- people assign a quickly inflating value to an item that is far beyond its actual worth. The early investors make impressive returns because the rush to invest drives up prices, and their success makes it difficult to point out the flaw in the bubble, because everyone thinks you're just a jealous buzzkill. Eventually it reaches a point where no one can afford to invest, and prices begin to drop, and panic selling starts, and the people who are the most leveraged watch as their massive investment disappears.

56

Senior JW member in Australia charged with sex crimes and torture

by Nathan Natas in

see: https://7news.com.au/news/crime/senior-jehovahs-witnesses-member-charged-with-rape-torture-and-assault-of-teenage-boys-c-8044666.

"senior jehovah’s witnesses member charged with rape, torture and assault of teenage boys...".

the 61 year-old man "faces 21 counts of rape, 17 counts of sexual assault, 13 counts of procuring sexual acts by false pretence and one count each of incest, torture and common assault.".

TonusOH

Good to see someone taking the traumatic first step of reporting this crime and seeing actual action as a result. And it seems he may get some justice and possibly closure for several others.

30

Opinions on the Divine name in the New Testament? + an interesting question

by Blotty in

i am genuinely curious and mainly posting this for research purposes, i do not have enough knowledge on either of these subjects to debate them in any useful manner.. (this information is as far as i am aware and may be incorrect in places)as most know the nwt is known for placing a form of the divine name in the nt (new testament) - while i agree the evidence is significantly weak for it too appear in the nt, a few things must be considered - (from my limited research)rev references the name twice (3:12, 14:1)early copies of the lxx contain the divine name (likely the versions that the nt writers copied?

stafford has a couple of videos on this subject)it was emphasized over and over the name [divine name, which ever form you prefer] would be "known" (other words used aswell) forever - if this is true, why then go against your own message in some cases and replace it with a surrogate?some also claim the nwt is dishonest for not translating some occurrences of "lord" as the divine name - common ones i notice are: phil 2:10-11, 1pe 3:14-15, heb 1:10yet these all use "lord" as a title not a proper noun, seems to be staunch trinitarians who make this claim most oftenscholar qualifications:why does a scholars qualification's matter?

sounds dumb i know.

TonusOH

Blotty: It was emphasized over and over the name [divine name, which ever form you prefer] would be "known" (other words used aswell) Forever

If this is the case, then there is no cause for concern: God would make sure that the divine name would be known. And if it was that important to Him, He would make certain that it was pronounced as He intended. (And if it's not the right God, then the whole thing is moot.)

Otherwise, I am not sure if there are any manuscripts that are considered as a source that is used above all others to determine such matters? If we lack the original writings, then we are going by copies (and in many cases, copies of copies etc). Without some sort of rules for how to organize them, I guess one could go with the model that is most prevalent. But even that has issues, since many manuscripts are incomplete and some are just fragments.

146

Science News article: ‘Case closed’: 99.9% of scientists agree climate emergency caused by humans

by Disillusioned JW in

a news article has the headline of " ‘case closed’: 99.9% of scientists agree climate emergency caused by humans"; see https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/oct/19/case-closed-999-of-scientists-agree-climate-emergency-caused-by-humans .

the article says in part the following.. 'the scientific consensus that humans are altering the climate has passed 99.9%, according to research that strengthens the case for global action at the cop26 summit in glasgow.. the degree of scientific certainty about the impact of greenhouse gases is now similar to the level of agreement on evolution and plate tectonics, the authors say, based on a survey of nearly 90,000 climate-related studies.

this means there is practically no doubt among experts that burning fossil fuels, such as oil, gas, coal, peat and trees, is heating the planet and causing more extreme weather.. a previous survey in 2013 showed 97% of studies published between 1991 and 2012 supported the idea that human activities are altering earth’s climate.. this has been updated and expanded by the study by cornell university that shows the tiny minority of sceptical voices has diminished to almost nothing as evidence mounts of the link between fossil-fuel burning and climate disruption.. the latest survey of peer-reviewed literature published from 2012 to november 2020 was conducted in two stages.

TonusOH

The headline: ‘Case closed’: 99.9% of scientists agree climate emergency caused by humans
The article: The scientific consensus that humans are altering the climate has passed 99.9%
The article: The degree of scientific certainty about the impact of greenhouse gases is now similar to the level of agreement on evolution and plate tectonics, the authors say

Am I the only one who sees a difference between 'human activity affects the climate' and 'there is a climate emergency'? The article writers add a blurb at the end stating that "global heating is supercharging extreme weather at an astonishing speed." But this isn't demonstrated in the article, which seems to be explaining that there is a consensus among scientists that human activity is warming the planet. What is the scientific consensus on whether there is a 'climate emergency' and what is the nature of that emergency?

The governments of the world took sudden, drastic, and continuing action to deal with COVID-19, which makes it seem as if they take that threat very seriously. Why is it that those same governments seem utterly unconcerned with a "climate emergency"? They have willingly and unhesitatingly ruined lives and set economies back to deal with COVID. But after decades of hysteria, they still don't think that climate change is an issue. I think those governments can see the difference between "we affect the climate" and "the climate catastrophe is coming!!!"

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

TonusOH

The airport in Croatia (or wherever he would have landed) is probably quite a drive from his home.

Toblerone5: Back then they were both JW.

In his book, he talks about sexting with girls (his word) while he was still an MS or elder. Being a JW didn't really present a problem for him. Having his wife find some of his text messages was an inconvenience, though.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

TonusOH

KIMSILVIO: I don’t know whether Lloyd doesn’t understand or chooses not to see.

I think it's a bit of both. It is clear that he does not think that his use of sex workers disqualifies him from being involved in efforts to confront organizations that have tried to suppress evidence of CSA in their ranks. I think he is also trying to make prostitution seem like a victimless crime, at least where his own activity is involved.

Neither of those views makes me think that he is qualified to take part in efforts to get justice for those who have been victims of sexual abuse. But he may not care, at least until such time as he is forced to confront his actions and his attitudes.