Posts by TonusOH

3073

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars (continued)

by Simon in

jw
friends

uh oh, looks like the mega thread gave up the ghost, so while i investigate / fix it just continue the discussion here .... it's been a long 9 years lloyd evans / john cedars.

TonusOH

I'm imagining a JW looking for answers in 2024 and finding Evans's channel. They have heard good things and apparently he is the "go to channel" for exJW content. Cool! Let's see what we have...

Hmmm, atheist video trashing religion. No thanks.

Hmmm, ranting about the Silvio Mob and asking for money? Maybe not yet.

What else? Using psychoactive drugs to combat depression? Um... what?

How about... how to negotiate with a sex worker when your funds are low? WTF!?!?

Jesus... where is the JW content???

14

Essential Beliefs

by LeeMerk in

if the watchtower really wants to move more mainstream they need to take a lesson from evangelicals in the united states.

they seem to say there are "essential beliefs".

a handful of core beliefs that are necessary to be considered true christians.

TonusOH

Isn't there one essential belief for Christians? Jesus offered up a sacrifice on behalf of humanity so as to redeem any who accept it. Everything else is up for debate, more or less.

The problem with the WTS's approach is that they have chosen so many odd hills to die on, with the blood policy as a good example. Their interpretation has not stood the test of time, and they have modified it until it serves only as a way to express unquestioning devotion to the GB. The fact that it has cost lives does not seem to bother the leadership.

73

Did God know adam and eve would sin?

by gavindlt in

to all those on this forum, i would love to know what your take on this vital question is..

TonusOH

The future could be undetermined and god could still predict the future. He is able to control the minds of people and control events with complete precision. If god says that 'one day, X will happen' he can direct events so as to make X happen. Yes, that interferes with free will, but an unstoppable cosmic power probably doesn't give a rat's ass that you're upset that he made a woman name her child "Jesus" instead of "Bruno."

Presto: you have a universe where things can happen that god does not predict, but where god makes predictions that come true. If god could read a timeline and tell us what will happen, doesn't that mean he is subservient to that same timeline? In which case, there is something more powerful than god out there. Here's a thought experiment: could god create a reality where the timeline is fixed so that even he cannot act freely?

Bribie: If there is no God then the complexity and tremendous diversity of life on our unique planet does not make sense.

The thing is, no engineer considers complexity to be the hallmark of good design. A good design is simple and efficient, and life on Earth is nothing like that. If there is a god, he's not a very intelligent designer.

But also, if we use complexity to justify god's existence, then we have to account for a being who is far more complex than anything we've discovered or even imagined. Doesn't that make even less sense?

44

Geoffrey Jackson has a beard now

by Tahoe in

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TonusOH

Looks like the CEO decided to vote himself a ~~pay raise~~ beard.

41

God cannot lie

by psyco in

the bible does not say that god does not want to lie, but that he cannot lie or it is impossible for god to lie.

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so, if god cannot lie, for what purpose and why did he create creatures (satan, demons, humans) who can lie?.

TonusOH

I think the more interesting concern is that the serpent is believed to be Satan, the Devil by most Christians. The father of the lie did tell the truth when he told Eve she would not die, that instead she would become like god. God himself confirms that this latter claim was accurate. We can even claim that the serpent did not lie when it told Eve she wouldn't die- she did not die on the same day, as god had warned. Indeed, one can interpret the Genesis story to mean that god was upset with the serpent because it showed these first humans that god was keeping a valuable gift from them. And that he did so using threats.

1

Did Jesus have a pre-existence or was he fully human, begotten at his human birth.

by gavindlt in

so when was jesus begotten.

was he truly and wholly fully human.

did he exist in two states, part human part god.

TonusOH

I don't see how anyone can determine that. You're talking about what is, in effect, a magical being, capable of doing anything it sets its mind to. Jesus could have been a human puppet able to behave normally until god transplanted some part of his own consciousness into the body. Or he could have been a human puppet that god occasionally controlled remotely. Or he could have been the most advanced NI (natural intelligence- nothing artificial here!) to ever exist.

I would even say that it isn't possible to determine how he was "begotten." Presumably, there was no physical act of sex, as god would not need so crude a method to inseminate a human woman. One can imagine that the same being who can wish an entire universe into existence would do the same in order to cause an embryo to magically appear in the uterine wall of Mary.

And how would one explain these "states"? Has god ever been only half-god? How would that work?

73

Lloyd Evans Patreoff Pool February 2024

by DerekMoors in

happy new year!

time to give us your vote for lloyd's fall from grace this month.. december 6th he was at 406. as of today, january 3rd, he's at 388. that is exactly, on the dot, where he was january 3rd of last year!

he's lost all gains from his begging videos and reminders and tin cup waving and etc.. so, fire up the shrooms and let us know where you think flab boy will be on february 2nd.

TonusOH

Yep, like T5 said- you need to click "About" and scroll past the message and you will see how many paying members there are. 385 as of this moment. The landing page will only show the total number of followers, which includes people who sign up for free.

73

Did God know adam and eve would sin?

by gavindlt in

to all those on this forum, i would love to know what your take on this vital question is..

TonusOH

I think he knew it was probable. After all, he created all living beings, and that meant designing their minds and how those minds work. Why do I think it was probable? Because in the Bible, there are a few times when perfect beings break his rules. Obviously the serpent did, which means that the angel who used it to deceive Eve also turned his back on god. Adam and Eve, two perfect humans, disobeyed the single rule they were given. Later on, other angels left their posts in heaven to have sex with human women. Revelation implies that as many as a third of the angels fell along with Satan.

When that many perfect beings cannot follow god's rules, it's pretty clear that there is an issue with the design, or that the design was intended to have this effect. So the odds were in favor of Adam and Eve breaking god's rules.

41

God cannot lie

by psyco in

the bible does not say that god does not want to lie, but that he cannot lie or it is impossible for god to lie.

.

so, if god cannot lie, for what purpose and why did he create creatures (satan, demons, humans) who can lie?.

TonusOH

I always saw it as god not needing to lie. It makes no sense to imply that god is somehow incapable of deceiving someone or saying something that isn't true. That would actually mean he was limited in some way.

But when you are the incalculably powerful magic overlord of a universe that you created with your own hands, why would you need to lie? Who would he need to fear, that he would try to misdirect them? Who could block him from any thought, word or action? It's not that he is somehow unable to lie, it's just that it wouldn't make sense.

28

JWs And Superstitions

by NotFormer in

prompted by a mention in a different thread.. cracks in the sidewalk, a pinch of salt over the shoulder, black cats🐈‍⬛; do jws have such superstitious beliefs.

are they allowed to?

would they be counselled if the elders became aware?.

TonusOH

I remember hearing stories like that. About sisters who managed to go door-to-door in a dangerous neighborhood, and when asked why they were left alone, a person in the neighborhood explained that no one wanted to tangle with the large dog that accompanied them. And of course, the sisters would explain that there was no dog with them... *insert Exorcist theme*