Yes, it's tougher to keep people shielded from the WTS's past. When you can show someone the org's own words in its own publications, it is a real test for them.
TonusOH
JoinedPosts by TonusOH
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176
No more REPORTING field service!!!!!!!!!
by BoogerMan inthis is going to break the hearts of a lot of uber-jw's!
reddit has now removed the video link of samuel herd telling jw's they will no longer have to report time or placements - just tick a box which says "active.".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=akdshyx79rm&t=13s.
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New Zealand - JWs head to court on Abuse in Care Inquiry - RNZ news story
by EasyPrompt inhttps://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/jehovahs-witnesses-head-to-court-on-abuse-in-care-inquiry-victims-feel-a-kick-in-the-guts/hwjsnshi5vfv7ghjztr63goseu/.
"by bill hickman of rnz.
the new zealand branch of the jehovah’s witnesses is going to court in an attempt to have the church made exempt from the abuse in care inquiry today.. in the high court at wellington, lawyers for the church are seeking a declaration that the church is not responsible for the care of children or vulnerable people in new zealand.. abuse survivor advocate and former church elder shayne mechen said the church was trying to use a technicality to side-step its inclusion in the inquiry.. .
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TonusOH
The WTS argument seems to be that they did not provide facilities where such abuse could have occurred, so they cannot be a part of the inquiry.
That's not what the inquiry is about, is it? I assume it's the same as the ones in different countries, where they are saying that the WTS did not do enough to protect children from such predators, or do enough when they learned of such abuse. This is not the same as saying they are liable because abuse happened in facilities they managed or controlled.
It is a bad look for them.
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This answers the question if the organization was going to go more Hardline or mainstream.
by nowwhat? inlooks like we can expect a kinder, gentler jehovah and jesus during the great tribulation.
the door will not be closed to all non jws at the start of the tribulation.
but will have time to repent after false religion is destroyed.
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TonusOH
Making the religion less onerous might help get more people to join. But at the same time, if you're offering nothing and leaving the door open to a last-second conversion, what reason would anyone have to join?
For the rank and file, there is the sudden realization that, after a century of promoting the door-to-door work as critical and a lifesaving effort... it didn't really matter. All that matters is signing on at the very end. Makes for a nicer god, but not a very profitable religion.
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3154
It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars (continued)
by Simon inuh oh, looks like the mega thread gave up the ghost, so while i investigate / fix it just continue the discussion here .... it's been a long 9 years lloyd evans / john cedars.
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TonusOH
The change they made in the 1990s with literature might have started them on the path that they find themselves on now. I think a major reason for these changes is the decrease in income, which wasn't a problem when they were 'placing' millions of books and magazines and receiving payment for each one.
They could afford to advise the rank and file to eschew higher education and better-paying jobs when they could raise money from literature sales. And it was simple greed that ended the practice; they didn't want to pay taxes on literature sales, so they figured they could dump the responsibility on the individual publishers and get around it. That did not turn out the way they hoped.
Now they are looking to open the doors in the hopes that people will join and provide a quickly-growing base from which to collect donations. I don't think that will go very well for them, but it should be interesting to watch.
Hmm, I'm looking at my analysis in light of the topic we are in, and it almost seems an appropriate comparison. Make bad decisions based on personal desires, and watch as things start to fall apart...
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Has The WT Allowed Outsiders to be Saved?
by NotFormer inhttps://www.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/1734baj/they_just_had_a_huge_meeting/.
this reddit post suggests that the cessation of reporting hours isn't the only thing announced at the recent meeting.
can anyone in, or sufficiently well versed in jwdom confirm that the op's understanding of this announcement correct?.
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TonusOH
Interesting. If the idea is that you can wait until actual proof is established, then faith becomes meaningless.
It could be damaging to the WTS if they are promoting this idea, but it actually makes sense. A just god would make sure we knew the truth instead of just waiting to see if we believe it, sight unseen. It's not the sort of idea you can make money off of, though. I don't expect it to become popular.
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67
Real reasons behind this change?
by Gorb injust a good conversation at home about the hour report change.. we think the change was not impmemented because the gb are such a lovely bunch of old grandpa's having the best in mind for us individuals.. there will be only, and we say only, an organizational reason for it.
a legal reason, to protect jw.org and it's officials and wealth.. next step?
maybe selling more kh and when jw hollywood studio's in rampoo are ready a change to tv subscription.. what do you think?
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TonusOH
It could actually be a boost to informal witnessing, since you can claim time if you have a few conversations with people. Much better than knocking on rows of doors on a weekend morning, or accosting people on the street.
On the other hand, people will soon tire of having every conversation turned into a JW pitch meeting. Can't win them all!
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67
Real reasons behind this change?
by Gorb injust a good conversation at home about the hour report change.. we think the change was not impmemented because the gb are such a lovely bunch of old grandpa's having the best in mind for us individuals.. there will be only, and we say only, an organizational reason for it.
a legal reason, to protect jw.org and it's officials and wealth.. next step?
maybe selling more kh and when jw hollywood studio's in rampoo are ready a change to tv subscription.. what do you think?
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TonusOH
This is a very desperate move, in my mind, because of the effect it will have on congregations.
There was always a sort of "haves / have nots" mindset with regards to activity. If you could spend a certain number of hours a month in field service, you could become a "pioneer." An auxiliary pioneer was nice, but a regular pioneer was someone to look up to. Unless you were a MS or elder (more have/have not), you were a secondary citizen to the pioneers. Oh, you put in a big effort and did 20 hours this month? Please. The auxiliary pioneer did 60. The regular pioneer did 90. Still feel proud about your 20 hours? And did you even place a single magazine, or conduct a single study?
That divide is bigger now. Only pioneers need to report hours. You think they resented you when they had to do as many hours in a day as you did in a month? Now you don't even have to tell anyone how many hours you did!
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3154
It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars (continued)
by Simon inuh oh, looks like the mega thread gave up the ghost, so while i investigate / fix it just continue the discussion here .... it's been a long 9 years lloyd evans / john cedars.
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TonusOH
His most fervent supporters pretend that Evans has no obligation to his patrons, because what happened isn't their business and he is free to spend his earnings as he pleases. That may work fine for someone who is expressing an opinion about him, but not for someone whose opinion is backed by financial support. Look, it's not difficult to figure out:
Patron: I am not comfortable knowing that my money might be supporting prostitution, or that the person I send money to is ruining his marriage and being a bad role model.
Evans: My personal life isn't your business, and I am free to spend my earnings as I please.
Patron: *cancel subscription*
Does this make it clearer? Do you understand now why it is their business? And why he can't just dismiss their concerns? And why this forum thread drives him crazy?
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Breaking news - no more reporting
by wannaexit ini didint search to see if its been talked about.
big news for jws sheeple , no more reporting.
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TonusOH
Judge Rutherford must be spinning in his grave.
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3154
It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars (continued)
by Simon inuh oh, looks like the mega thread gave up the ghost, so while i investigate / fix it just continue the discussion here .... it's been a long 9 years lloyd evans / john cedars.
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TonusOH
My guess is that the court has dismissed it. But we will see.
Thanks again to DerekMoors, Inna, and Kim for pursuing this. I wonder how Evans will justify his lack of action on the case, when he spoke of it as being the most important thing to him (since Kim's betrayal was the worst thing that ever happened to him!). Three people from around the world managed to get more done in a few weeks than he got done in two years.