Posts by Duran

20

Defend Your Borders or Listen to the Watchtower?

by raymond frantz in

https://youtu.be/dnoww-4jfao?si=ehzmc5-gxqukgn7q.

with ww3 on the horizon the watchtower is bringing out their best hits on the issue of neutrality and the latest instalment on jw.org with stephen lett has the theme " why ancient israelites were allowed to go to war but as a christian you can't " or to paraphrase for a 2024 audience " why the modern state of israel is allowed all the nuclear weapons to defend their borders but you as a western european or north american you aren't supposed to compliant against open border policies and uncontrolled illegal migration" isn't that the exact same rhetoric or is it my imagination?

so one of stephen lett's go to arguments is that christians do not take up arms because we don't live in ancient times where israelites had a mandate to occupy the holy land where as we gentile christians we don't.

Duran

The 8th king is the same as the MOL and when the restraint holding back the MOL comes off at God's time for it, then the MOL/8th king will come to power to rule the NWO and under that rule there will be those proving to be God's true people by refusing the 8th king and there will be those that prove they do not belong to God by their supporting the 8th king.

[ 8 Then, indeed, the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will do away with by the spirit of his mouth and bring to nothing by the manifestation of his coming.]

Jesus will do away/kill the MOL when he (Jesus) comes. This means that the MOL is on hand, acting in his foretold role, at the time prior to Jesus coming.

It is clearly stated the before Jesus can come that the MOL has to come first.

In regard to the MOL coming and the foretold purpose, it says:

[4 He stands in opposition and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he sits down in the temple of God, publicly showing himself to be a god. 9 But the lawless one’s presence is by the operation of Satan with every powerful work and lying signs and wonders 10 and every unrighteous deception for those who are perishing, as a retribution because they did not accept the love of the truth in order that they might be saved. 11 That is why God lets a deceptive influence mislead them so that they may come to believe the lie, 12 in order that they all may be judged because they did not believe the truth but took pleasure in unrighteousness.]

Notice that connected to the MOL is a judgment from God. This means that those that believe all the powerful works, lying signs, etc. are misled to believe and support the MOL's claim. These people will perish/not be saved.

____________________

[6 And I saw another angel flying in midheaven, and he had everlasting good news to declare to those who dwell on the earth, to every nation and tribe and tongue and people. 7 He was saying in a loud voice: “Fear God and give him glory, because the hour of judgment by him has arrived, so worship the One who made the heaven and the earth and the sea and the springs of water.” 9 Another angel, a third, followed them, saying in a loud voice: “If anyone worships the wild beast and its image and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand, 10 he will also drink of the wine of the anger of God that is poured out undiluted into the cup of His wrath, and he will be tormented with fire and sulfur in the sight of the holy angels and in the sight of the Lamb. 11 And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever, and day and night they have no rest, those who worship the wild beast and its image and whoever receives the mark of its name. 12 Here is where it calls for endurance on the part of the holy ones, those who keep the commandments of God and hold fast to the faith of Jesus.”] [19 And I saw the wild beast and the kings of the earth and their armies gathered together to wage war against the one seated on the horse and against his army. 20 And the wild beast was caught, and along with it the false prophet that performed in front of it the signs with which he misled those who received the mark of the wild beast and those who worship its image. While still alive, they both were hurled into the fiery lake that burns with sulfur. 21 But the rest were killed off with the long sword that proceeded out of the mouth of the one seated on the horse. And all the birds were filled with their flesh.]

There it shows that the beast is thrown into the fiery lake/done away with when Jesus comes. That means that that beast had to be on hand doing his foretold role prior to Jesus coming.

Also connected to that beast is a judgment from God and all those that believed the signs etc., so were misled to support/take the MOTB, these will also be killed/perish/not be saved when Jesus comes.

How likely is it that there are two separate entities on hand at the time Jesus comes, that he is said to do away with both at that time of his coming, that are both a cause for judgment by God, that results in the judgment of death for those that believe/mislead to support either entity?

Surely it is not reasonable that they are two separate entities, but instead they are one in the same.

Next, I will show how the KOTN is the same...

406

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

.

colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

Duran

LOL! I am not nor was ever a JW.

And only a true idiot would reply with an explanation to what was a facetious comment.

Why don't you two get a room...

406

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

.

colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

Duran

@Rattigan350

Hey, I thought Satan is God...so, I guess Jesus is Satan...

New International Version
The God of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel that displays the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

New International Version
The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.

13

Unchangeable wisdom from the "slave" of yesteryear! 😀

by BoogerMan in

brethern, and cistern, today's lesson from the golden calf is one of profound importance - never to be forgotten!.

w56 6/15 p. 360 - "we usually believe what we want to believe, and one thing we like to believe is that we do our own thinking.

they plant the thought and nourish it, but do it so subtly that we think it is our own.

Duran

[8-22-78 Awake – EDUCATION teaches you how to think. Propagandists tell you what to think. True educators present all sides of an issue and encourage discussion. Propagandists hammer hard on their view and discourage discussion. Many times their true motives are hidden. They sift the facts, tell the favorable ones and conceal the others. They distort and twist facts, specialize in lies and half-truths. Your emotions, not your logical thinking abilities, are their target. Many fall easy prey because it takes no effort to feel, whereas thinking is hard labor. And the propagandist sees to it that his message is made to seem wise, the right and moral one, and gives you a sense of importance and belonging if you follow it. You are one of the smart ones, you are not alone, you are comfortable and secure—so they say. Proverbs 14:15 states: “A simple man believes every word he hears; a clever man understands the need for proof.” (The New English Bible) Many today are like sponges; they soak up whatever they are submerged in. It is the easy way. Exercise for the muscles is hard work; exercising the mind is even harder. It is so much easier to soak up whatever is around—and today, for the most part, that is television, the printed page, radio and movies. There are, however, some good books, movies and television programs. They require more mental effort to read or to watch. So each individual must choose what he will feed his mind. It is said that we are what we eat, and this can apply to food for both the body and the mind. Whatever you read or watch or listen to, test whether it is propaganda or whether it is the truth. “The god of this system of things has blinded the minds of the unbelievers,” that they might not know the vital truths of our time. What about you? Will you let others think for you, or will you do your own thinking? Do your own, and “thinking ability itself will keep guard over you.” ]

20

Defend Your Borders or Listen to the Watchtower?

by raymond frantz in

https://youtu.be/dnoww-4jfao?si=ehzmc5-gxqukgn7q.

with ww3 on the horizon the watchtower is bringing out their best hits on the issue of neutrality and the latest instalment on jw.org with stephen lett has the theme " why ancient israelites were allowed to go to war but as a christian you can't " or to paraphrase for a 2024 audience " why the modern state of israel is allowed all the nuclear weapons to defend their borders but you as a western european or north american you aren't supposed to compliant against open border policies and uncontrolled illegal migration" isn't that the exact same rhetoric or is it my imagination?

so one of stephen lett's go to arguments is that christians do not take up arms because we don't live in ancient times where israelites had a mandate to occupy the holy land where as we gentile christians we don't.

Duran

I see what you are saying there but that is not the same as what it is now.

When you read 'nations' there it is clearer if you think 'peoples'.

1484. ethnos - nation, gentile, people

1471. goy - nation, gentile, people

This you have right:

It suggests a diversity of peoples and governance under Christ's rule.

The key being the second part of that, 'governance under Christ's rule.'

Today we have different 'nations' (countries) with their own borders, laws, governance, languages.

Under God's kingdom and governance under Jesus' rule, there will be 'peoples' of all the current 'nations', so a 'diversity of peoples' you seek will be there, but the culture, history, and languages are done away with and start anew under however/whatever God has instore for his 'peoples' living under kingdom rule.

[21And I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the former heaven and the former earth had passed away,5 And the One seated on the throne said: “Look! I am making all things new.”]

[11 Since all these things are to be dissolved in this way, consider what sort of people you ought to be in holy acts of conduct and deeds of godly devotion, 13 But there are new heavens and a new earth that we are awaiting according to his promise, and in these righteousness is to dwell.]

[17 For look! I am creating new heavens and a new earth; And the former things will not be called to mind, Nor will they come up into the heart.]

[ 9 For then I will change the language of the peoples to a pure language, So that all of them may call on the name of Jehovah, To serve him shoulder to shoulder.’]

20

Defend Your Borders or Listen to the Watchtower?

by raymond frantz in

https://youtu.be/dnoww-4jfao?si=ehzmc5-gxqukgn7q.

with ww3 on the horizon the watchtower is bringing out their best hits on the issue of neutrality and the latest instalment on jw.org with stephen lett has the theme " why ancient israelites were allowed to go to war but as a christian you can't " or to paraphrase for a 2024 audience " why the modern state of israel is allowed all the nuclear weapons to defend their borders but you as a western european or north american you aren't supposed to compliant against open border policies and uncontrolled illegal migration" isn't that the exact same rhetoric or is it my imagination?

so one of stephen lett's go to arguments is that christians do not take up arms because we don't live in ancient times where israelites had a mandate to occupy the holy land where as we gentile christians we don't.

Duran

the Antichrist is God's punishment for mankind

Nope, not for all, just upon those that claim to be God's people. Those that do not believe or want to serve God will do just fine under the Antichrist/8th king rule. Their punishment will come from Jesus after the 8th king's rule.

nevertheless his purpose post tower of Babel has been a world of borders and distinct national identities.

Nope, that was only to be until during the 7th king rule which is where we are at now. Now the purpose is to be an NWO/8th king rule.

Read ALL the cited Scriptures.

I prefer a world where people are allowed to be part of their local national entity with distinct language ,history and culture,

You can prefer all you want but that was never God's purpose, and he will return it back to his purpose.

Genesis 11:1-9;Zephaniah 3:8,9

20

Defend Your Borders or Listen to the Watchtower?

by raymond frantz in

https://youtu.be/dnoww-4jfao?si=ehzmc5-gxqukgn7q.

with ww3 on the horizon the watchtower is bringing out their best hits on the issue of neutrality and the latest instalment on jw.org with stephen lett has the theme " why ancient israelites were allowed to go to war but as a christian you can't " or to paraphrase for a 2024 audience " why the modern state of israel is allowed all the nuclear weapons to defend their borders but you as a western european or north american you aren't supposed to compliant against open border policies and uncontrolled illegal migration" isn't that the exact same rhetoric or is it my imagination?

so one of stephen lett's go to arguments is that christians do not take up arms because we don't live in ancient times where israelites had a mandate to occupy the holy land where as we gentile christians we don't.

Duran

But here’s the irony: The Watchtower historically took a strong stance against globalism,not anymore, warning about a “new world order” that seeks to erase borders and create one unified system, much like the Tower of Babel. Genesis 11:4 records the people’s rebellious intent: “Come, let us build ourselves a city and a tower with its top in the heavens, and let us make a name for ourselves, lest we be dispersed over the face of the whole earth.” God’s response? “So the Lord dispersed them from there over the face of all the earth.” (Genesis 11:8). Clearly, God values diversity and distinct nations, not one centralized global society.

You are half right. It was God's intention to hold back/restrain the NWO as far back as the ToB and has been the case up until now during the 7th king. But it has also been God's intention/purpose for the NWO to come about at the right time (God's time for it.). It comes upon in the form as the 8th king. This 8th king is God's means to judge all who claim to believe in him and want to serve him and live under his kingdom, not Satan's.

The 8th king is the same as the MOL and when the restraint holding back the MOL comes off at God's time for it, then the MOL/8th king will come to power to rule the NWO and under that rule there will be those proving to be God's true people by refusing the 8th king and there will be those that prove they do not belong to God by their supporting the 8th king.

The 8th king serves as the judgment that comes first on the house of God (his people) and then when Jesus comes after the 8th king (Armageddon) that serves as the judgment that comes upon those who were not obedient to the good news of God.

[ 17 For it is the appointed time for the judgment to start with the house of God. Now if it starts first with us, what will the outcome be for those who are not obedient to the good news of God?]

[ 7 But you who suffer tribulation will be given relief along with us at the revelation of the Lord Jesus from heaven with his powerful angels 8 in a flaming fire, as he brings vengeance on those who do not know God and those who do not obey the good news about our Lord Jesus. 9 These very ones will undergo the judicial punishment of everlasting destruction from before the Lord and from the glory of his strength, 10 at the time when he comes to be glorified in connection with his holy ones and to be regarded in that day with wonder among all those who exercised faith, because the witness we gave met with faith among you.]

2 Thessalonians 2:4-12;Rev 17:13,17;13:5,7,10;14:6,7,9-12;20:4;7:9,13,14;19:20,21

_______________

Ray, small correction to your post, WW3 has in fact started already, when the russia/ukrain thing kicked off. Its only now reaching full boil

@Just a guy, I agree, so far they were fighting a proxy war, but rhe masks gave come off for good now

WW3 has to happen to bring about the 8th king/MOL, it is the pretext for the nations to give their power and authority over.

[United Nations: Guterres warns ‘we are on the edge of an abyss’
The UN’s chief painted a grim picture of a divided and polarized world and urged solidarity among nations.…The world has never been more threatened or more divided, United Nations Secretary-General Antonio Guterres told nations of the world on Tuesday as he kicked off the 76th General Assembly session, urging all 193 member states to “wake up” and realize that solidarity is the only way out of disaster.]

[23 “And in the final part of their kingdom, as the transgressors act to a completion, a fierce-looking king who understands ambiguous sayings will stand up. 24 His power will become great, but not through his own power. He will bring ruin in an extraordinary way, and he will be successful and act effectively. He will bring mighty ones to ruin, also the people made up of the holy ones.] cf. Revelation 17:13,17

406

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

.

colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

Duran

So now people are fools if they don't observe your rules? And they are your rules, just like the Pharissaical rules were from the Pharisees, and not from God.

You are a FOOL because you keep proving yourself to be one from replies like you just gave.

What 'rules' of mine are you referring to? Copy and paste just one of my so-called rules if you can.

Like I said: Most people simply assume freedom where there is no specific prohibition in scripture. That is just common sense.

'I have said do what you want!' Do you see any suppression of freedom in that?

YOU are the fool that started off with this foolish statement:

God's birthday will be coming up in a few weeks. Can't wait.

Going on to say:

surely you have heard of Christmas? It's the greatest holiday the world has ever known - the birth of our Creator.

All I have done since is tried to get you to tell me if you can show in the Bible that Dec 25th is the day he was born and if he said to observe his birth yearly.

You have failed miserably in doing so because you can't because it is not there.

You then knowing you can't show it Scripturally, switch to saying:

How many things in your life do you practice that are not specifically commanded in the Bible?

You seem to adpopt a position where if something is not given specific permission in scripture, it might be called 'wrong" by people like youself.

There you are saying that even though the date of his birth is not stated in the Bible, nor did he ask for his birth to be celebrated year after year, that it is okay to pick a date for his birth and celebrate it yearly thereafter.

I have not said at any point that it is wrong to do so. What I have said in that regard is that being that you did not get his date of birth from the Bible and since he did not ask you to celebrate it, then that day and the decision to do so is not Scriptural (- from or relating to the Bible).

I then turned to saying if it is not Scriptural (- from or relating to the Bible), then who is the source (whomever) that chose to celebrate his birth yearly and why on Dec 25th, which you clearly have accepted and chosen to follow such tradition?

Are you able to answer the above and let me know whose tradition you are following?

Can you answer if you celebrate Halloween? If not, why?

Can you tell who decided that Jesus' death day is always to be acknowledged only on a 'Friday' and not with the day that actually aligns with the Scriptural day of Nisan 14?

406

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

.

colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

Duran

You seem to adpopt a position where if something is not given specific permission in scripture, it might be called 'wrong" by people like youself.

The root of your objection to celebrating the 25th is your contempt for other Christian faiths.

LOL! I know y'all were JWs at some point but do you every stop being the fools that it takes to be a JW?

Such foolish replies back and yet evasion when it comes to my questions.

I have not spoken about right or wrong or have I used the word pagan, nor have I said I object to December 25th if that is the date you want to choose. I asked that if the birth date is not known so one has to be picked, why can't you pick any date you want and privately celebrate? Why do you have to do it on Dec 25th? Those are questions!

Do you understand and agree if the date of Jesus' birth is not in the Bible, and he did not ask/command any to observe his birth, then the decision to celebrate it and the date chosen to do so does not come from him or the Bible, which means it comes from some other source. Period!

If the is the case, then that means that everyone who celebrates it are following the decision that was started/made by the source that started it. It has nothing to do as coming from Jesus.

Without getting into right or wrong, if the date of his birth is not in the Bible and there is nothing about Joseph and Mary nor his disciples celebrating his birth yearly, and Jesus never said to do so, then that means that the celebrating of it and the date to do it on came AFTER the Bible was written and by a source other than Jesus and the writers of the Bible.

So, do you who celebrate it know who chose to do so and who chose to do it on Dec 25th?

And is anyone willing to answer this:

Do you celebrate Halloween? If not, why?

And as far as:

1 Maccabees 4:36–39
Describes the rededication of the temple and the decree to celebrate annually on the 25th of Kislev which in 2024 also falls on December 25th.

Do you realize that Kislev 25 like Nisan 14 does not fall in the same month and day each year.

Kislev can be Nov/Dec and Nisan can be Mar/Apr, so celebrating something on either of those dates would need to change to adapt to the appropriate month and day to align with those dates, you can't pick/choose the month and day you want.

If Christmas is connected to Kislev 25 then Christmas can't be on Dec 25th every year.

Kislev 25 2024/Dec 26

Kislev 25 2023/Dec 8

Kislev 25 2022/Dec 19

Kislev 25 2021/Nov 29

And who decided that regardless of the fact that Jesus died on Nisan 14 a day that would fluctuate from year to year between March and April and whatever day of the week, who said that it will always be on a Friday (so-called 'Good Friday') regardless of if Nisan 14 aligns with that day or not?

Nisan 14 2023/Wed April 5

Nisan 14 2022/Fri April 14

Nisan 14 2021/Sat March 27

Nisan 14 2020/Wed April 8

406

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

.

colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

Duran

I should say so. All people are of this 'world'.

Apparently, you do not understand Jesus' view of that...

[15 “I do not request that you take them out of the world, but that you watch over them because of the wicked one. 16 They are no part of the world, just as I am no part of the world.]

Why does Jehovah get angry at his children when they celebrate his son's birthday?
I wouldn't get mad if others celebrated my son's birthday even if it was on the wrong date.

What have I said that you disagree with...

I have said and showed Jesus died on Nisan 14 and he said to continue to observe his death until he arrives. This can be shown using the Bible therefore it is Scriptural.

Do you agree with that so far?

Now I have also said that nowhere in the Bible can you show the date of his birth or that he asks for it to be observed year after year. (Are you able to show either from the Bible?) Therefore, it is not Scriptural.

Do you agree with that?

___________________

Next part:

You can say, 'so what if the date of his birth is not in the Bible nor did he ask his birth to memorialize', 'I would like to do it and see nothing wrong with it.'

I ask if that is the case, then since you don't know the real date and you just have to pick a day, then why not pick any date you choose, and do it with yourself, family, friends, the way you would for your own son, self, family, friends?

Why do you have to do it on December 25th with the rest of 'the world'?

Who chose Dec 25th and why if it is not in the Bible?

What does Santa Claus, north pole, elves, flying reindeer, etc. have to do with Jesus' birth?

What does a tree being put in a home and putting presents under it have to do with Jesus' birth?

And speaking of the tree, you know it is grown in fields just to farm them, just to be cut down and sold, so that you can then bring a dead tree in your home, to put your presents under, then throw the tree out.

Who came up with that tradition of the tree and presents under it in celebrating Jesus' birth? Is it in the Bible?

Do you celebrate Halloween? If not, why?