Posts by teejay

63

Thank You Ray Franz.

by Martini in

jw
friends

hello friends,.

in a thread over at witnesses.net entitled "society bracing for law suits" fellow jw's are taking swipes at ray franz.

not too long ago, while i was still under the wt spell i also would have similarily spoken abusively of ray.

I agree with nearly every word of what you say relative to Ray. It's just that you could have picked a better forum if you wish it known that you are less than 100% in agreement with everything he has written.

That being said, there are few people I have more respect for. He was fooled when he was a dub, that's all, just like the rest of us, but when forced to face the REAL truth, he didn't run and hide from it and continue to preach the lie as too many do. I give him a lot of credit for that. As he was as a dub, so he is now: a man of honor. imo.

peace,
tj

8

WT policy on funerals and memorials?

by Mulan in

jw
friends

can anyone tell me the current policy for funerals and memorial services?.

mom was here today and evening, stayed for dinner, and we talked about the services for henry.

she wants there to be a portion of the service where people in attendance can tell things they want to say about him.

teejay

Mulan,

As with weddings, so it is with memorial services: those that want them the way they want them don't have them at the Hall. Just a thought.

peace,
tj

33

My stepfather died tonight

by Mulan in

jw
friends

i have just finished making phone calls informing the family of the death of my stepfather.

i was an adult when he married my mother, but i loved him very much.

he was a wonderful man.. although he was a faithful jw, for his entire life (he was born to it) he was a really good man, and a true christian, i believe.

teejay

Sorry for your loss, Mulan. He sounds like a good man. I understand how you feel about going to his memorial. Don't know what I'd do in that situation.

Take Care,

tj

33

To all snipers and bombers

by Norm in

jw
friends

the approach of ex-jehovah's witnesses towards those still witnesses has been debated since the problem first occurred.

personally i joined the ranks of ex-witnesses in 1988 and found myself more or less thrown into the fray appearing in media like newspapers, radio and tv.

one of the first things i noticed was the interest bestowed upon me from competing churches, particularly from the pentecostalism camp.

teejay

Norm,

During the many years since then I have discovered a lot of things about the whole realm of religion and religiosity. One of the most striking characteristic?s among religious people is their distaste for bluntness and directness. Everything has to be gently wrapped a couple of thousand times unto the point of complete meaninglessness.

I don't doubt your discovery as I have witnessed it myself. Knowing that is the case, wisdom leads the wise to use a different approach when addressing different people... speak Greek to Greeks, Spanish to Spaniards, etc. Doing otherwise defeats our purpose and those who might otherwise listen to us are likely to turn a deaf ear. When that happens, all loose.

tj

28

This Article from the Sep KM is very interesting

by chester in

jw
friends

i thought this article from the september 2001 kingdom ministry was very interesting.. get out there and sell those books!!!.

is it an obstacle to preaching?.

most people lead busy lives.

teejay

Chester,

"... a family head may be inclined to spend an excessive amount of time on the job..."define "excessive"

"... with a view to building up his financial reserves for unforeseen crises." oh, you mean like medical bills, help for family members who might find themselves in a bind... retirement?

"While increased secular work may seem to provide extra material things or additional opportunities for recreation and entertainment, will this make the family happier and more contented if it is done at the expense of time for spiritual pursuits and regular meeting attendance?" YES!!!

"This certainly is no time to be distracted by undue anxiety over making a living or by a desire to get comfortably situated in a system of things that will soon pass away." define UNDO anxiety... and is it really terrible to be comfortable? Aren't gb members comfortable?

"Having sustenance and covering, we shall be content with these things." Are we trying to acquire more than that? If so, we may be reaping the consequences that Paul warned about: "Those who are determined to be rich fall into temptation and a snare and many senseless and hurtful desires, which plunge men Into destruction and ruin." having 'just enough' is the goal. Wanting just a little more is always given a bad connotation. I always thought that was stupid reasoning.

Bendrr asked a good question: who'll be giving the talk in the local hall? I wonder who WROTE it. Does the man have a clue to what it's like in the real world of jobs, mortgage payments, school supplies for the kids, car repairs, retirement? If so, how can he write such an article?

tj

11

her Prince Valiant

by teejay in

jw
friends

i've always liked the sound of thunder, so when it came last night, it was comforting to me.. when i walked through the bedroom were the wife and daughter were watching tv.

sitting on the wife's lap, the daughter said, "daddy, help me.

i asked what was wrong.

teejay

I've always liked the sound of thunder, so when it came last night, it was comforting to me.

When I walked through the bedroom were the wife and daughter were watching TV. Sitting on the wife's lap, the daughter said, "Daddy, help me."

I asked what was wrong. "She's afraid of the thunder," the wife said.

"Thunder get me," said the daughter, as fear was clearly visible on her beautiful face.

A lump came to my throat as I felt her fear and need for a helper. I picked her up and carried her back to the living room where I was lounging on the sofa, watching football. I snuggled her in next to me and covered her with pillows.

"Thunder get me," she repeated.

"Don't be afraid of the thunder, baby. Daddy's here. I'll keep you safe."

She sighed, thinking about what I said, and a little smile spread across her face. She relaxed, got comfortable, and said, "Football."

I am her castle, her moat, her legion of knights in shining armor. God, I love being a father.

41

Blanket Bomb Or Snipe?

by hillary_step in

jw
friends

i wish to open a thread on a bit of a controversial issue so belt-on the self control!

my question?

why do some of us attack jws as people and who are our real targets?.

teejay

Six,

I tend to view the Duns/Friday/You know type character even more reprehensible than the types of men who are in power in the org ... Duns et al has looked it all square in the eye, and made his choices. Worse yet, he has the audacity to use obfuscation to defend those choices.

How can you be so sure about Duns? Do you know--have you met--him personally? What I see in your reaction to him is what bothered me about the reaction some gave him while he was here. I normally agree with you, Six (you know that), but in this I think that unless you have something other than the words of his that you read from your computer screen, you are being horribly presumptuous -- always a big mistake, setting the stage for unfair treatment.

peace,
tj

141

JW Kids Leave the Organization: Facts

by Maximus in

jw
friends

the october 1 watchtower 2001 features articles on training children "properly" and dealing with a "prodigal child.

the latest inside u.s. figures reveal that 86% of jw children leave the fold, with some 29% who eventually come back for reasons of family ties, most never "reaching out.

" that means over half leave permanently.

teejay

Hello, Sean. I'd say 'welcome to the board' but you've been here longer 'n me!

My father would agree with you, seeing very little integrity in the human race in general.

Your father is a realist, imo. Very little integrity exists, only a mob mentality or, saying it more gently, a lemming mentality... an over-riding desire to be accepted, to follow, to not make waves. All of these behaviors stem, imo, from a lack of willingness to think for oneself.

While I agree that those without integrity get most of the attention I cannot agree that this reveals a lack of integrity in general. Doesn't it have more to do with personality and opportunity than actual moral integrity?

Maximus said it well when he said that he was stunned when no one raised a voice when great men (Ed and Ray) where treated so shabbily after decades of slendid service. No doubt many of those silent voices knew that the ugliness visited upon those fine people was not justified, but they remained silent. It's my contention that if they were indeed good people, they would have spoken up -- said something, done something -- if not for their friends who they'd worked with side by side for decades, then for the sake of truth and what was/is fair and just. That they didn't points to a severe character flaw. With friends like them...

Also to be considered is fear. It is hard for many good people to face their fears. They may object to the organization but are afraid to face consequences of revolt. I'm not ready to cast the brand of "gutless" and "lacking in integrity" on these people. I know what it's like when you have family in and you're afraid you will lose them if you speak out. You may be willing to risk it personally. But that does not in itself make you a man of integrity.

I am acquainted with the reality of risk... of loosing the freedom to be in my mother's company. I know others in my situation as well. Balancing my love for my family who are still in with an equal (greater?) love of universal truth is not easy and I don't mean to make it sound that way. Yet, the example that others have set when it comes to personal sacrifice for the sake of real truth I do not ignore. I will not ignore.

As far as their being "afraid to face consequences" I say (excuse my French) "bullshit." I never held a position in a congregation above aux. pioneer. A big part of that is due to my inability to kiss ass. I told men, all of them from DO on down, exactly what I thought. So, I paid the price of never holding an office. Was the price overwhelming? Too high? I don't think so.

After decades of association, Bill B. discovered a heinous truth about a WTS policy. Virtue moved him to 'step down.' Could others do the same? I think so. Why don't they? And if not 'step down,' why don't they at least become more vocal? Because they are afraid? Damn right. Afraid of loosing their position. Their freakin' position as a low-level flunky in an evil religion is more important than standing up for what's really. Should my respect for such people be higher than it is? Should I cut them some slack, be more understanding? I don't think so.

Think please before you open your mouth to judge.

I do and I will. You do the same. Btw, I don't consider what I've done judging. I haven't 'judged' anyone.

tj

5

Judgmentalism

by BugEye in

jw
friends

people are judgmental, this is a fact.. in fact it is a human quality that allows people to grow and become better throughout there lives.

we judge what happens and log it away for future use.

often times these things are so subconscious that an automatic trigger forms and we simply react to a new situation based upon something inside which tells us what is happening.. if we get burned by a hotplate, then forever we judge hotplates to be at least somewhat of a danger to our skin.

teejay

BugEye,

Two points and then a question.

Stereotype. I think that is a better word than judgmentalism. See one kid start a fire and make a mental leap in assuming he has a problem and all others who start fires are just like the first kid.

First impressions. Allowing the mind to project... to reach conclusions about people based on that first impression or limited contact. It's been proven that people's first impressions are a bitch to overcome. We humans typically look for evidence to support our first impressions, even if they are wrong. We 'find' evidence making our first impressions correct while ignoring equally valid evidence that proves our 'judgments' wrong.

Basically, the thrust of your post can be summed up when you said, "no two people are EVER the same" and further, that even when dealing with one person, their motives cannot always be clearly known. Real error occurs when we think we can.

Now, the question: You'd think that people older than, say, 18yrs of age, should have figured this all out. Too many give evidence of NOT having figured this out. Why is that?

tj

41

Blanket Bomb Or Snipe?

by hillary_step in

jw
friends

i wish to open a thread on a bit of a controversial issue so belt-on the self control!

my question?

why do some of us attack jws as people and who are our real targets?.

teejay

h_s,

My point is what if they are not the leaders but the led. What if they are a forty year old average man, holding down a thankless job, married to your brothers mother, two children, for the sake of argument your nephews, on your doorstep for Saturday morning service in the dripping rain. Or perhaps arriving on this Board blown by the winds of curiosity and nagging doubts. What then? This represents the vast majority of of JW's. Should our frustration be turned toward them, they are after all the misled?

TMS expressed my feelings to a 'T' (the more of him I read, the more I like). I could not have said it better. Whenever I meet JWs anywhere, they will receive nothing but the highest respect and courtesy.

I was a dub from the time I was five to 30 years hence. I meant no one any harm in all my 'work' as a Witness. How could I then vilify someone who lived as I did for so long?

That's why I deeply cringe when I seen JWs get blasted when they venture onto JW.com. I have the hardest time understanding it and will not follow suit. My methods may make others suspicious and lead them to assume that I have an agenda, but so be it. For goodness sakes, my mom is a regular pioneer!! I'd hate to think of her being abused, even verbally. She raised me better than that.

tj